Info AMD confirms Windows 11 slow down its CPUs up to 15%

[deasd]

AMD processors hit by performance issues on Windows 11, patch on the way

AMD has said that its CPUs are taking a performance hit on Windows 11 systems and that it has teams working on the issues. Patches should be released later this month through Windows.

www.neowin.net

AMD: Windows 11 Slows Our CPUs Up To 15%, Patch Coming

High latency bug hits fast

www.tomshardware.com

AMD: Windows 11 May Cause Performance Dips Of Up To 15% On Ryzen CPUs

AMD reported issues that their Windows 11 compatible AMD Ryze CPUs were having with performance while running certain applications.

wccftech.com

The issue mentioned in the opening paragraph is caused by functional L3 cache latency which has increased by around three times on affected hardware. The programs that will suffer include those sensitive to memory subsystem access times. AMD noted another problem too, explaining that UEFI CPPC2 may not schedule threads on the processor’s fastest core preferentially.


Regarding the latter issue, applications sensitive to the performance of one or a few CPU threads will see a performance hit. The issue will be more noticeable on greater than 8-core processors that operate at over 65W. This issue should also be fixed this month.

hmmmm, whose fault is it this time? It screw up the future hardware review if true? what about Intel side?

 

[mikeymikec]

hmmmm, whose fault is it this time?

AMD processors work properly on Win10, they don't on Win11, the only thing that changed was... Windows. How on earth could this be AMD's fault?

 

[Hans de Vries]

How it started:

Intel’s New Alder Lake Processors Will Run Faster On Windows 11

Other operating systems including Windows 10 could be slower - here's why

www.forbes.com

However, Microsoft has stated that it has worked with Intel to ensure that Windows 11 is specifically optimized for Alder Lake's new CPU core design and Thread Director. Both companies have said that thanks to the optimizations, Alder Lake will perform better on Windows 11 than other operating systems as a result.

How it is going:

AMD: Windows 11 Slows Our CPUs Up To 15%, Patch Coming

High latency bug hits fast

www.tomshardware.com

The errors impact every Ryzen CPU supported in Windows 11. That means all Zen+, Zen 2 and Zen 3 CPUs that comprise the Ryzen 2000, Ryzen 3000, Ryzen 4000, and Ryzen 5000 processors. In addition, select AMD EPYC processors for data centers, along with some newer Athlon chips, are also impacted. You can see the full list here, but suffice it to say that every AMD chip on our Best CPUs for gaming list is included.

AMD's advisory says that the issue boils down into two categories. First, the measured and functional L3 latency can increase by ~3X, meaning you can see the impact with measurement utilities and that it results in real performance degradation in games and applications. The bug impacts applications that are sensitive to memory subsystem latency, causing a 3–5% reduction in performance. This issue also causes the 10–15% performance reduction outliers in games "commonly used for eSports," which isn't surprising given that games tend to be extremely sensitive to memory and cache latency.

 

[coercitiv]

Originally I wanted to write something about MS needing to deliver a polished product with W11 if they truly aimed at the benefit of rebranding their OS, while also highlighting that we don't really know how much AMD could have done to to prevent this.

But then something else caught my eye, and I think this time I'll indulge in a moderate dose of off-topic with a sprinkle of whataboutism:
Xbox creator apologizes to AMD over last-minute switch to Intel CPUs 20 years ago

The designer of the console revealed on Twitter that the change was a result of a phone call between Microsoft's CEO at the time, Bill Gates, and then-Intel CEO Andy Grove. The decision to switch from AMD to an Intel Pentium III processor surprised Blackley and everyone else. AMD engineers were even sitting in the front row, waiting to see the unveiling of the final product they worked on together.

"I was standing there on the stage for the announcement, with BillG, and there they were right there, front row, looking so sad. I'll never forget it. They had helped so much with the prototypes. Prototypes that were literally running the launch announcement demos ON AMD HARDWARE," said Blackley adding, "I felt like such an ass."

How does this relate to the topic at hand? It warns us to exercise caution when applying common sense and common business knowledge to the presumed interaction between MS and AMD. IF WE DON'T KNOW what AMD knew or did before the W11 launch with respect to performance bugs on their silicon, we should not venture into assigning responsibilities and blame in their hands. Maybe they moved too slow, or maybe they got another front row seat to a public display of (internal MS) political priorities.

Windows is a Microsoft product. Their turf, their decisions, their responsibility first and foremost.

 

[mikeymikec]

Or is sabotaging AMD's revolutionary V 3D cache concept just to risky?

All AMD need is to reasonably prove MS's intention and they've got themselves a payday. Even more if the proof showed that Intel put MS up to it.

 

[DrMrLordX]

He's talking about the Microsoft Dev Channel, hosted by Microsoft. It's different from the Insider Program in that it has current development builds available for download. So yes, that is a very reputable source.

. . . am I?

Anyone can join the Insider Program and get into the dev channel. Granted I've been an Insider since . . . uh . . . well it's been awhile. 2014 or something? Whatever, doesn't matter. Anyway, all you do is:

Join the Insider Program, install Win11 preview <whateveritisyouget>
Right click Win11 start button
Select Settings
Select Windows Update on the left panel
Hit the Windows Insider Program button
Hit the Choose your Insider Settings button
Select the Dev Channel radio button
Then you go back and search for new updates, and bam, it should hook you up with 22741.1000

Alternatively you can possibly get an .iso of 22741.1000 and install it directly, and join that way.

 

[Hans de Vries]

So the bizarre L3 latency (for AMD only) is still getting worse with each new Windows 11
release/update from the Intel/Microsoft scheduler team.

blue___: Windows 10
red____: Windows 11 release (5 October)
black:_: Windows 11 update (12 October)

So what will happen October 19th when the "bug" fix patch is supposed to come ???







Some Cranky Paranoid Stuff from Twitter:

Just before the Windows 11 release:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1444680175740862464

Day before the Windows 11 update:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1447334953088212993

Intel GOD Pat is promising lots of goodies in return for love?

- A dirt cheap Intel XBOX replacement for Microsoft?
- Lots of dirt cheap Sapphire Rapids for the Microsoft Cloud?
- Some "offshore goodies" which no one will see, hear or know about?

Or is sabotaging AMD's revolutionary V 3D cache concept just to risky?

 

[Asterox]

Well my W10 PC shows only one update possible, awaiting for me accepting licensing terms : Win11 of course.
Not that I was asked if I had any interest, of course.

Today no one can force a "well-informed user" to do any Windows upgrade or update.

Windows Update Blocker v1.6

In Windows 10 There is no option to turn off Windows Updates. Windows Update Blocker is a tool that helps you to completely disable or enable Automatic Updates.

www.sordum.org

Regular Windows Update, this is not to put it that way a cure for cancer.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordon...e-warning-update-chrome-browser/#4f4d0b965f8f

If not broken do not repair.As an example, in the past i have been using Windows 7 for six years+Windows Update Off.Windows 10, i have same practice WU Off and no problem.

 

[LightningZ71]

Hmm, I'm generally opposed to most conspiracy theories, but.... I would be shocked if this issue is fully resolved by the time Alder Lake is released and hardware sites run their benchmarks and put out their stories... It's going to be a one sentence explainer or a footnote at the bottom of pages at best, and we'll probably see UserBenchmark just run wild with this one...

You have to think that MS and their testers have had representative AMD products on their desks for months by now and this hasn't come up before?!?!

 

[mikeymikec]

Who would use Win11 RTM as their sole review testing platform? You'd have to disclaim everything as being a potential artefact of Win11's lack of maturity. It would be like reviewing gaming graphics cards but only with one game that was released yesterday.

It would make some sense to have a dual platform (in terms of OS versions) setup, but this scenario works best for MS to show off Win11's improvements.

 

[Shivansps]

This is Microsoft fault, but why AMD didnt realised this sooner? everyone has access to the insider builds.

 

[mikeymikec]

This is Microsoft fault, but why AMD didnt realised this sooner? everyone has access to the insider builds.

On one hand I can understand AMD thinking, "pre-release product, let's wait till they have something closer to release", on the other hand I'm surprised that they haven't been working with MS prior to RTM.

 

[Asterox]

Tested with Ryzen 5 3600.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Hmm, I'm generally opposed to most conspiracy theories, but.... I would be shocked if this issue is fully resolved by the time Alder Lake is released and hardware sites run their benchmarks and put out their stories... It's going to be a one sentence explainer or a footnote at the bottom of pages at best, and we'll probably see UserBenchmark just run wild with this one...

You have to think that MS and their testers have had representative AMD products on their desks for months by now and this hasn't come up before?!?!

I dunno dude. This entire OS seems like a rushed release. Heck, the updated paint doesn't even have a dark mode. Let me repeat that. Their own app doesn't support the theme in their own OS. Just crazy.

 

[Joe NYC]

I dunno dude. This entire OS seems like a rushed release. Heck, the updated paint doesn't even have a dark mode. Let me repeat that. Their own app doesn't support the theme in their own OS. Just crazy.

It's the best to stay away from this garbage for 6-12 months.

It's not even close to being ready if they are finding obvious showstopper bugs 3 days after release...

Clearly, there is no testing / QA done by Microsoft. They just send it out for users to test their code.

 

[dainthomas]

You should definitely upgrade now if you're cool with a beta OS and don't need your computer for any critical tasks.

 

[KompuKare]

Clearly, there is no testing / QA done by Microsoft. They just send it out for users to test their code.

Just to joke about Bethesda games and took to calling them Bugsoft as they always released games where their users had to fix all the issues. Just was well TES (and later Fallout) modding took off; and didn't Microsoft recently buy Bethesda?

Maybe Microsoft are going to release a Creators Kit for Windows so users can fix their QA issues?

 

[jpiniero]

You should definitely upgrade now if you're cool with a beta OS and don't need your computer for any critical tasks.

It can't be that beta of an OS. It's just Windows 10 with some UI tweaks and a new name so OEMs can push buying new.

It's not even close to being ready if they are finding obvious showstopper bugs 3 days after release...

I bet they've known about it for awhile, they are just making it public now because of the release. Not sure if this is an AMD specific security hole they are patching or an Intel conspiracy.

 

[lightmanek]

I find these interviews very telling:

 

[Joe NYC]

I bet they've known about it for awhile, they are just making it public now because of the release. Not sure if this is an AMD specific security hole they are patching or an Intel conspiracy.

Where do you get that this is a security hole? No one said that.

Security hole does not manifest itself typically with a 15% slowdown.

 

[jpiniero]

Security hole does not manifest itself typically with a 15% slowdown.

Smeltdown?

Edit: Someone should check and see if this behavior exists in earlier beta versions of Windows 11.

 

[DigDog]

dows W11 do anything IRL better than W10 ?

 

[Det0x]

Just to joke about Bethesda games and took to calling them Bugsoft as they always released games where their users had to fix all the issues. Just was well TES (and later Fallout) modding took off; and didn't Microsoft recently buy Bethesda?

Maybe Microsoft are going to release a Creators Kit for Windows so users can fix their QA issues?

Modders have already started

Windows 11 Tweaks Fixes And Modifications - Post Index

 

[Leeea]

dows W11 do anything IRL better than W10 ?

It will be flat out superior for MS shareholders.

 

[coercitiv]

Modders have already started

Windows 11 Tweaks Fixes And Modifications - Post Index

And right there close to the top...