AMD ARM devkits now available

[NTMBK]

http://www.amd.com/en-us/who-we-are/corporate-information/events/arm

Interesting times...

 

[Vesku]

Glad to see they fixed what ever issue pushed back their initial end of March availability of the dev kits.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

http://www.amd.com/en-us/who-we-are/corporate-information/events/arm

Interesting times...

There is ONE tiny/slight problem.

From your link:

Complete developer kits are available for $2,999 USD.

I.e. it's at least $2,500 too much, for my liking.

I would have hoped that it was in the $150 to $500 price range.

A Raspberry PI (ok, slower and inferior), would be more like £20/$30, or a tiny bit more than that.

EDIT: Obviously when it is properly released, the item will be considerably cheaper.
Also, my comparison with a Raspberry PI is unfair, as the A1100 board, is intended to compete with somewhat powerful server boards.

 

[Unoid]

You know that the linked article mentions a OPERTON system.

Everyone knows that opteron systems are servers.

a complete server system is probably expensive, not $150 - $500.


Reading is for chumps I guess.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

You know that the linked article mentions a OPERTON system.

Everyone knows that opteron systems are servers.

a complete server system is probably expensive, not $150 - $500.


Reading is for chumps I guess.

It's intended to compete on the microserver market.

i.e. Atom boards.

Atom boards (e.g. J1800) are about $50, with server versions of the atom boards, costing even more.

Example

Taking that sub $50 board I just linked to.
It can be used as a microserver, e.g. NAS box, etc etc.

 

[monstercameron]

no, these arent supposed to be $50 file severs.

 

[Phynaz]

$3,000 for an ARM dev kit.

AMD has gone totally off the deep end.

 

[Phynaz]

You know that the linked article mentions a OPERTON system.

Everyone knows that opteron systems are servers.

a complete server system is probably expensive, not $150 - $500.


Reading is for chumps I guess.

http://www.cdw.com/shop/search/Serv...e-_-Servers_Server_Management|ServersUnder500

Research is for chumps I guess.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

no, these arent supposed to be $50 file severs.

The fairest equivilent, at the moment is probably the 8 core C2750 server motherboard (with built in cpu).

The current price is about $300 (guess).

One of my possible UK suppliers, has them for about £236, but I think they sell for less in the US.

Here

But you can save a huge amount of money. By going for the 4 core J1900 board, which are more like $70 (but are NOT real server grade boards, but potentially fine for gentle home microserver usage).

DISCLAIMER: ALL my posts in this thread (so far), have been talking about prices "JUST FOR" the motherboard and in-built cpu, NOTHING else.

Since that is all you are getting from AMD, when these things are for general sale. (i.e. Motherboard and cpu built in, NOT a complete fileserver).

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

$3,000 for an ARM dev kit.

AMD has gone totally off the deep end.

The following article, agrees with me (and another poster in this thread, quoted above), that $2999, is apparently too high a price for their development system.

http://www.brightsideofnews.com/2014/07/30/amd-announces-64-bit-arm-opteron-a1100-series-dev-kit/

If you’re interested in trying out AMD’s new 64-bit ARM Opteron A1100-series chips, then you should head on over to AMD’s landing page and sign up to get one (and fork over $2,999). This announcement is in conjunction with Redhat’s announcement of an ARM Partner early access program for a partner ecosystem. I’m not entirely sure why AMD is pricing these ARM servers so high, even if they are development boards. Perhaps it did cost them a lot of money to develop these boards and to manufacture them in low quantities, but $2,999 is pretty restrictive and will limit the developers to only the very large companies, which may be what AMD is trying to do. But, in AMD’s current position in the server market and their current market share, they should be trying to sell as many as they can, not as few as they can. It is good to see that AMD is continuing to move forward and improve their position in the server market, but it remains to be seen who will adopt this new technology and how cost effective it really can be versus what’s deployed now.

Although (as other poster(s) have said), it is used to make servers (microservers), they are aiming towards the bottom end of the server market (microservers), because they have relatively little processing speed/power (the 8 cores will be about the same processing power as 2** (of the 4 available on a quad) cores of a modern day haswell cpu).

(**No source for information, it is my own estimation, actual processing speed has not been publicly released yet, I am expecting it to be about 50%..65% the speed of a Haswell 4770, but I could be way, way out).

 

[USER8000]

As with all these things whether the actual price to partners and RRP actually match is another question.

Interesting to see DDR4 support though.

 

[Zstream]

To those thinking that the dev kits are expensive..... you obviously don't work for a large company which they're giving these away for free anyways. In addition, this is open to the public so quit your bitching. You think HP was giving moonshot dev kits out to the public?

 

[Vesku]

I don't think it's jumping to that big of an assumption to think AMD's supply of these Dev Kits is limited. Considering they were initially saying they'd start having them available in April/May. Also the vibe I get from current AMD management is they are fishing for very large non-consumer oriented customers, the embedded systems market for example. A $3000 price tag will mean they most likely won't have to tell anyone "sorry out of stock" and will self select for very large potential customers.

 

[mrmt]

I don't think it's jumping to that big of an assumption to think AMD's supply of these Dev Kits is limited. Considering they were initially saying they'd start having them available in April/May. Also the vibe I get from current AMD management is they are fishing for very large non-consumer oriented customers, the embedded systems market for example. A $3000 price tag will mean they most likely won't have to tell anyone "sorry out of stock" and will self select for very large potential customers.

They could open the program only for targeted customers if they were that supply constrained. I can't really understand the logic of selling on the market for that price something they should want to spread as much as they can, but I guess we can't expect any coherent behavior from AMD management, especially from AMD marketing.

 

[Vesku]

They could open the program only for targeted customers if they were that supply constrained. I can't really understand the logic of selling on the market for that price something they should want to spread as much as they can, but I guess we can't expect any coherent behavior from AMD management, especially from AMD marketing.

They don't have many customers to specifically target, their server marketshare is abysmal atm. Notice they take details up front, filter by price and then select among the filtered applications.

 

[NTMBK]

There is ONE tiny/slight problem.

From your link:



I.e. it's at least $2,500 too much, for my liking.

I would have hoped that it was in the $150 to $500 price range.

A Raspberry PI (ok, slower and inferior), would be more like £20/$30, or a tiny bit more than that.

EDIT: Obviously when it is properly released, the item will be considerably cheaper.
Also, my comparison with a Raspberry PI is unfair, as the A1100 board, is intended to compete with somewhat powerful server boards.

It's a freaking dev kit, not a Raspberry Pi. Of course the final product is going to be cheaper. You are paying for extremely early access, and the support that comes with it. This is for engineers, not end customers.

 

[ShintaiDK]

This is what you essentially give for free to promote adoption unless you wish to sell it to the public. Also I dont see the devkit offer anything that any other ARM maker cant do.

 

[teejee]

This is what you essentially give for free to promote adoption unless you wish to sell it to the public. Also I dont see the devkit offer anything that any other ARM maker cant do.

in my experience developer kits usually cost money in one way or another.
Often they are part of a larger supplier/partnership agreement, but then they are paid implicitly by that agreement. And this cost is a part of part price negotiation.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

It's a freaking dev kit, not a Raspberry Pi. Of course the final product is going to be cheaper. You are paying for extremely early access, and the support that comes with it. This is for engineers, not end customers.

The (competing) Atom stuff, has been out for ages (something like a year ago), on sale to the general public, at reasonable prices. They are in the somewhat near future, suppose to be bringing out even better ones (Denverton?).

Competing Xeon (low end versions) processors have been around for ages, longer than I can easily remember, like 10 or 20 years.

At $3000 (yes it may well be cheaper, later, but $3000 makes it sound like it will STILL be too expensive, even after a price reduction), I might as well chuck out any idea of using their AMD Arm stuff, and use one of the numerous alternatives, ranging from the AMD AM1 + 5350, or one of the extensive Atom solutions (boards).
Or choose from the extensive Xeon series.

As regards (somewhat powerful) Arm 64-bit, at least 4 core (Quad) "Development" systems, there are already at least one alternative, which can be bought immediately, for a whopping $65. (Some sources say $65, others $70).

I may NOT be linking to the best one, as I think they are bringing out a new/better one.

Hummingbird A31 Is a $70 Feature-packed Development Board Powered by AllWinner A31

http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/05/09/hummingbird-a31-is-a-70-feature-packed-development-board-powered-by-allwinner-a31/

tl;dr

$65/$70 vs $3000, hopefully I have explained why I prefer the $65/$70 option ?
(Or alternatively a J1900 board (inc cpu), for about $70, available NOW).

Extra link, to youtube video, showing alternative Arm system

 

[Nothingness]

Also I dont see the devkit offer anything that any other ARM maker cant do.

What other available board has a 64-bit Cortex-A57 based SoC?

The (competing) Atom stuff, has been out for ages (something like a year ago), on sale to the general public, at reasonable prices.

Do you know how much Atom boards running engineering samples cost before public release of the chip?

That being said, I also think the price is outrageous.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

Do you know how much Atom boards running engineering samples cost before public release of the chip?

That being said, I also think the price is outrageous.

Early parts can be very expensive, I totally agree.

The original reports (if I remember correctly) that were coming out, seemed to indicate that the "full production items" would be ready this September 2014.
(Although it may have been clever marketing, and the real launch date was going to be the beginning of 2015, when the units could actually be bought.).

I hoped that early release development systems, would come out at a somewhat affordable price, $200 .. $500.

At $3000, only VERY determined, big companies, are going to buy these.

But very high board prices, may mean that the (less convinced in the product anyway) big companies who could have been interested in these boards, won't bother now. So it may be a poor marketing idea, in the long run.

I guess that there are two extremes to the market place.
Massive companies, who spend hundreds of millions of dollars on their server equipment, who might be interested in these boards, to save on the electricity bills, and cooling costs, etc.

And the hobbyist home based, low cost server (microserver), to act as a simple NAS box, or light duty webserver, or just for messing about etc.
Who wants to spend $75 (or $200) or so, on the motherboard + cpu.

 

[NTMBK]

The (competing) Atom stuff, has been out for ages (something like a year ago), on sale to the general public, at reasonable prices. They are in the somewhat near future, suppose to be bringing out even better ones (Denverton?).

Competing Xeon (low end versions) processors have been around for ages, longer than I can easily remember, like 10 or 20 years.

At $3000 (yes it may well be cheaper, later, but $3000 makes it sound like it will STILL be too expensive, even after a price reduction), I might as well chuck out any idea of using their AMD Arm stuff, and use one of the numerous alternatives, ranging from the AMD AM1 + 5350, or one of the extensive Atom solutions (boards).
Or choose from the extensive Xeon series.

As regards (somewhat powerful) Arm 64-bit, at least 4 core (Quad) "Development" systems, there are already at least one alternative, which can be bought immediately, for a whopping $65. (Some sources say $65, others $70).

I may NOT be linking to the best one, as I think they are bringing out a new/better one.



http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/05/09/hummingbird-a31-is-a-70-feature-packed-development-board-powered-by-allwinner-a31/

tl;dr

$65/$70 vs $3000, hopefully I have explained why I prefer the $65/$70 option ?
(Or alternatively a J1900 board (inc cpu), for about $70, available NOW).

Extra link, to youtube video, showing alternative Arm system

It's not a finished product. It's a developer kit for engineers.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

It's not a finished product. It's a developer kit for engineers.

I know.

As time progresses, I'm increasing agreeing with you (and the other posters).

Yes, prototype/early parts can be extremely expensive, so $3000 can be quite reasonable, from that point of view.

================----------------=============================


I have not got the link to hand, but I think that the production pricing will be $99 (8 core A1100, Opteron/Seattle version) for the cpu only (as it is the same price as the outgoing opteron x2150), and an unknown amount for the motherboard (which will have the cpu permanently soldered down on it).

 

[Nothingness]

I have not got the link to hand, but I think that the production pricing will be $99 (8 core A1100, Opteron/Seattle version) for the cpu only (as it is the same price as the outgoing opteron x2150), and an unknown amount for the motherboard (which will have the cpu permanently soldered down on it).

Anand guessed ~$100 for an 8-core A1100 but that's all it is, a guess If he is correct, we'll likely see dev board <$300 when the chip is in mass production.

 

[SOFTengCOMPelec]

Anand guessed ~$100 for an 8-core A1100 but that's all it is, a guess If he is correct, we'll likely see dev board <$300 when the chip is in mass production.

I agree, that is probably where I found the $99. ($100).

I did not realize that the price was speculated (poor comprehension on my part), but I see exactly what you mean now.

Given that it is not compatible with X86 software, I was hoping that it would give a significant cost savings, compared to existing/future Atom server boards.
If it is not cheaper, then it is difficult to justify buying them.
(Big businesses, with huge server rooms, may be able to save money in other ways, such as electricity and cooling costs, so it may still be suitable for them).