am I going about this all wrong?

[rasczak]

As most of you know, I started the rippletoe program almost 2 months ago. I've made tremendous gains imo and am excited about doing more. where i am going wrong is my diet. I've read the articleby SC and found it very informative, but i'm still confused about what in particular i should be doing. i feel like what I am doing is bulking by trying to take in more calories, but is that what I really want to do? I'm already around 214lb to 218 lbs but I don't want to gain more weight. am i right in thinking what i really want to do is start taking in less calories in order to burn the fat? or am I supposed to take in MORE cals?

i don't remember if i've already posted my diet but I will do so for efficiency.

7am

2-3 eggs sunnyside up
bowl of oatmeal with spoonful of brown sugar, almonds and granola.
2-3 pieces of bacon or sausage.

banana or other fruit
9am -10am workout.
ON Whey protein shake (recomended amount)

11am

lunch -usually chicken breast or tuna fish sandwich with baked lays
or small salad with chicken and lo cal italian dressin.

2:30
snack of some sort.

500-600pm dinner, spaghetti, or 6oz salmon or 6oz chicken breast on wheat bread.

1100pm sleep. then wake at 400am

(i did have a bit of a breakdown this weekend and overate. my highest weight was 220 on sunday evening. weighed myself this morning, and was back down to 216lbs. whew)

anyway, i know it's been a beaten down topic, but could someone help simplify this for me?

thanks all.

I'd love for you to post what your daily meals look like in order to get some ideas for myself as well.

thanks!

 

[spamsk8r]

Depends on how tall you are, how much body fat you currently have, and your goals. If the number one goal is strength, keep eating more calories. If you want to lean out, your strength goals will not be as impressive, but you can still make gains while cutting down. I have to drop my calories to about 2200 a day to see results (I'm 5'10", 205 lbs., 18% BF, down from 235, 28% BF). Your diet looks alright, but I would definitely make sure to eat protein with every meal (i.e. no meals/snacks with just carbs). I would cut out the chips and pasta myself, and stick to lean meats, fresh veggies (or frozen, if that's easier), nuts, seeds, olive oil, brown rice, and only whole grain pastas/breads. Probably your main problem would be that you're simply taking in too many calories, so you might want to consider tracking your calorie intake daily. Just track it all for a week (everything you put in your mouth), and see how much you're averaging. Then reduce it by 500 calories. Keep it there for a few weeks and you'll see the scale start to move downward.

 

[onlyCOpunk]

Keep it simple. No added sugars, and no salt or sodium.

Make sure you are getting your 5 day.

Also as far as protein, you want a full balance of the different types. Dairy, chicken, fish, and eggs, along with supplements.

When you start measure out your portions so you know exactly what you are taking in. Here's my diet to give you an idea

Breakfast:
2 egg whites
medium bagel
8oz glass of milk

Snack:
30g whey protein shake
Banana

Lunch:
4oz piece of chicken
cup of green
half a tomato

Snack:
Orange
30g whey protein shake

Dinner:
6oz piece of white fish
cup of basmati rice
cup of steamed vegetables

Snack:
cup of cottage cheese


The cottage cheese may come as a surprise but it has a very high protein count, low in calories, and if you buy the right kind, low in sodium.

It may not seem like much but I ave maintained and made gains in my lifting, and I also lost 5 pounds in one week. Probably from the lack of sodium in my diet, but still 5 pounds.

 

[brikis98]

you need to clearly define your goals:

* If your primary desire is to have your muscles grow bigger & stronger, eat a calorie surplus
* If your primary desire is to become more cut/ripped (lower your body fat percentage), eat a calorie deficit

As a total beginner, you'll probably be able to do both at the same time - shocking your body with weight lifting will cause some of the flab to melt away and be replaced by muscle. however, the longer you do it, the harder it is to do both at the same time. after a while, it's damn near impossible - either you're growing muscle and gaining a little fat or you're burning fat and losing a little bit of muscle. therefore, most people focus on one at a time, and alternate every now and then. for example, bulk for 8 weeks, cut for 8 weeks, repeat.

i finished a bulk several weeks ago during which I had put on ~10lbs by eating a calorie surplus. now i'm trying to cut and my diet is roughly:

9am: kashi go lean protein cereal, 2 glasses of milk (one for the cereal), multivitamin, fish oil
12pm: either a salad with grilled chicken, a sub with lots of cold cuts or chicken, a stir fry with chicken/beef and veggies, or some kind of fish with steamed veggies
4pm: some combination of string cheese, fruti, yogurt (gives me energy for going to the gym after work)
8pm: protein shake right after the gym, fish oil
9pm: dinner with lots of lean meats & fish (chicken, turkey, tuna, salmon), and some kind of side dish, such as sweet potatoes, salad, steamed veggies. sometimes, out of laziness, i eat pasta (ravioli or tortellini) or rice, but i'm trying to cut down on that.

I keep the meals small but eat quite often, so i'm rarely hungry. Each meal contains protein - keeping your protein intake very high is VERY important whether bulking or cutting. try to get around 1g of protein per pound of body weight (in your case, around 215g) every day.

 

[rasczak]

my original goal was to lose the fat, but gain strength. but for some reaon i feel like that's unrealistic?

 

[MegaVovaN]

Originally posted by: rasczak
my original goal was to lose the fat, but gain strength. but for some reaon i feel like that's unrealistic?

I think that's realistic because strength is dependent on many factors, not just muscle volume.
While losing fat you'll lose some muscle but gain strength regardless!

Originally posted by: brikis98I keep the meals small but eat quite often, so i'm rarely hungry. Each meal contains protein - keeping your protein intake very high is VERY important whether bulking or cutting. try to get around 1g of protein per pound of body weight (in your case, around 215g) every day.

Per pound of LEAN BODY MASS. Don't count his XX lb of fat in these 215.

 

[rasczak]

Originally posted by: MegaVovaN

Originally posted by: rasczak
my original goal was to lose the fat, but gain strength. but for some reaon i feel like that's unrealistic?

I think that's realistic because strength is dependent on many factors, not just muscle volume.
While losing fat you'll lose some muscle but gain strength regardless!

Originally posted by: brikis98I keep the meals small but eat quite often, so i'm rarely hungry. Each meal contains protein - keeping your protein intake very high is VERY important whether bulking or cutting. try to get around 1g of protein per pound of body weight (in your case, around 215g) every day.

Per pound of LEAN BODY MASS. Don't count his XX lb of fat in these 215.

how would i figure out my lean body mass?

 

[MegaVovaN]

I am not sure, but common sense and quick Google search tells me that you need to find out your bodyfat % and multiply the weight by bodyfat % in decimal form to get pounds of fat. Then subtract pounds of fat from total weight, for example lets say you are 20% bodyfat.

215 x 0.20 = 21.5 x 2 = 43 lb of fat.

215 - 43 = 172 lb of lean body mass.


There are many ways to find/estimate bodyfat %, and one of them is to measure few areas of body with tape and enter in calculator:
http://www.gain-weight-muscle-...dy-fat-calculator.html


Here are few different formulas to calc bf %
http://www.linear-software.com/online.html

 

[rasczak]

interesting. i believe my initial bf% was 25% = 161..25 lbs of lbm

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Heya rasczak. First of all, thanks for reading my thread. Let's get to business.

If you're looking to gain muscle, you're gonna be bulking, which is a caloric surplus. If you're looking to lose fat (and often times gain strength), then you're gonna want to be in a caloric deficit. That's what my whole thread is about - losing fat and gaining strength. I thought it was fairly clear in my thread, but I'll re-read it and try to clarify if it's not. Find out your BMR and take in a little bit above that. Your BMR is not your caloric maintenance value - your BMR is your basal metabolic rate is the amount of calories your body would burn if you laid in bed all day and didn't move a muscle. It is significantly lower than your caloric maintenance. I think this may be where you're confused, but if it's not, let me know and I'll try further to help you out.

 

[rasczak]

Originally posted by: SociallyChallenged
Heya rasczak. First of all, thanks for reading my thread. Let's get to business.

If you're looking to gain muscle, you're gonna be bulking, which is a caloric surplus. If you're looking to lose fat (and often times gain strength), then you're gonna want to be in a caloric deficit. That's what my whole thread is about - losing fat and gaining strength. I thought it was fairly clear in my thread, but I'll re-read it and try to clarify if it's not. Find out your BMR and take in a little bit above that. Your BMR is not your caloric maintenance value - your BMR is your basal metabolic rate is the amount of calories your body would burn if you laid in bed all day and didn't move a muscle. It is significantly lower than your caloric maintenance. I think this may be where you're confused, but if it's not, let me know and I'll try further to help you out.

It wasn't your thread that confused me SC. I apologize if it seemed that way. I've read a few other threads/websites on fat loss/strength gaining, and most had said choose one or the other. I read them all wrong and mistook bulking = strength gaining. My first goal is to gain strength while cutting fat. so my diet above seems like a good way to start?

 

[KoolDrew]

I read them all wrong and mistook bulking = strength gaining. My first goal is to gain strength while cutting fat. so my diet above seems like a good way to start?

As you move beyond the "newbie phase" it is generally best to pick one or the other, as generally people don't gain strength and lose fat at the same time. As a beginner most strength gains will be neurological related anyway, so you are able to do both at the same time. For people who have had quite a bit more lifting experience the goal is to just maintain strength during a cut.

My suggestion is to start tracking what you eat on fitday.com and work from there.

Per pound of LEAN BODY MASS. Don't count his XX lb of fat in these 215.

There's nothing wrong with basing protein requirements on body weight. I used to always set protein intake based on LBM, because in theory it does make the most sense as fat cells don't really have much of a protein requirement. However, in practice I generally think basing protein intake on bodyweight is the better approach. Most people do not know what their lean body mass is and even if they have a general idea, rarely is it even close to accurate. Also, a bit too much protein is always superior to too little protein. Basing protein on bodyweight makes life easier as well, which is always a good thing.

The only exception to this would be individuals who are carrying a substantial amount of bodyfat where setting protein intake based on bodyweight would just bring protein levels to a point way more than is necessary. I personally set my protein intake based on bodyweight and aim for anywhere between 1-1.5g per pound. I generally take in more protein while cutting, but it stays somewhere within that range.

 

[rasczak]

Originally posted by: KoolDrew

I read them all wrong and mistook bulking = strength gaining. My first goal is to gain strength while cutting fat. so my diet above seems like a good way to start?

As you move beyond the "newbie phase" it is generally best to pick one or the other, as generally people don't gain strength and lose fat at the same time. As a beginner most strength gains will be neurological related anyway, so you are able to do both at the same time. For people who have had quite a bit more lifting experience the goal is to just maintain strength during a cut.

My suggestion is to start tracking what you eat on fitday.com and work from there.

Per pound of LEAN BODY MASS. Don't count his XX lb of fat in these 215.

There's nothing wrong with basing protein requirements on body weight. I used to always set protein intake based on LBM, because in theory it does make the most sense as fat cells don't really have much of a protein requirement. However, in practice I generally think basing protein intake on bodyweight is the better approach. Most people do not know what their lean body mass is and even if they have a general idea, rarely is it even close to accurate. Also, a bit too much protein is always superior to too little protein. Basing protein on bodyweight makes life easier as well, which is always a good thing.

The only exception to this would be individuals who are carrying a substantial amount of bodyfat where setting protein intake based on bodyweight would just bring protein levels to a point way more than is necessary. I personally set my protein intake based on bodyweight and aim for anywhere between 1-1.5g per pound. I generally take in more protein while cutting, but it stays somewhere within that range.

I went with this method myself. i have seen some growth in my chest since I started taking the protein shakes, but i have also seen a slim down in my waist (!!!) as i've cut out a lot of calories.


also did a close estimation of my BF% and it came out to 20.5%

given the numbers it's looks like this

215 * 20.5% = 44.075lbs of bodyfat.

215 - 44.075 = 170.925 lbs of lbm