ALCS Poll: Red Sox vs. Yankees

[thawolfman]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: jlarsson
Sox in 7, with a Youkilis walk off HR in the bottom of the 11th.

Got news for ya - can't hit walk off home run in opponents ballpark

Also can't even hit a home run if you got dropped from the ALCS roster

 

[TheAudit]

Originally posted by: Argo

Originally posted by: jlarsson
Sox in 7, with a Youkilis walk off HR in the bottom of the 11th.

Got news for ya - can't hit walk off home run in opponents ballpark

He's not even on the roster anyway.

 

[lordtyranus]

I'm still sticking with my sox in 6. I have confidence we can sweep at fenway.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
Oh, the slaughter has begun, we are circling the trains with bow and arrows!

Bwuahahahaha!!:laugh:

Sox will win, you will see. BTW, how are the Chokeland A's doing? Well at least they won't choke themselves out of the playoffs for a 5th straight time, considering they used their "choke" card a little early this year in yielding the West to Anaheim

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Mango trees!

BOSTON -- So what does it feel like to hear a stadium crammed with Yankees fans at full roar all chanting "Who's Your Daddy?" over and over and over and over and over?

"It actually made me feel really, really good," Pedro Martinez said after his team's 3-1 loss in Game 2. "I actually realized that I was somebody important, because I caught the attention of 60,000 people, plus you guys [reporters], plus the whole world watching a guy that if you reverse time back 15 years ago, I was sitting under a mango tree without 50 cents to actually pay for a bus. And today I was the center of the attention of the whole city of New York."

Pedro is the man! From mango trees to rags to riches to torturing NY to the HOF... PEDRO PEDRO PEDRO! Resign him already Henry, what tf are you waiting for, Schilling's ankle to heal????

 

[TheAudit]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Mango trees!

BOSTON -- So what does it feel like to hear a stadium crammed with Yankees fans at full roar all chanting "Who's Your Daddy?" over and over and over and over and over?

"It actually made me feel really, really good," Pedro Martinez said after his team's 3-1 loss in Game 2. "I actually realized that I was somebody important, because I caught the attention of 60,000 people, plus you guys [reporters], plus the whole world watching a guy that if you reverse time back 15 years ago, I was sitting under a mango tree without 50 cents to actually pay for a bus. And today I was the center of the attention of the whole city of New York."

Pedro is the man! From mango trees to rags to riches to torturing NY to the HOF... PEDRO PEDRO PEDRO! Resign him already Henry, what tf are you waiting for, Schilling's ankle to heal????

Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

 

[ThePresence]

Believe it or not, I actually gained some respect for Pedro last night, the way he answered that question. I promptly lost that respect when he kinda blamed the lineup not hitting for the loss. A pitcher should never do that.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: ThePresence
Believe it or not, I actually gained some respect for Pedro last night, the way he answered that question. I promptly lost that respect when he kinda blamed the lineup not hitting for the loss. A pitcher should never do that.

I didn't see where he said that. Even if he did, it's no secret that yes, Boston's offense didn't do sht and they did lose the game. Just ask 'Tek: "He pitched well," Varitek said. "We didn't do the job on the other end." Pedro kept them in the game, they swung themselves out of it, it's the offense's job to score runs and they failed miserably.

 

[TheAudit]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

You know they are going to resign him and he wants to stay.
The only reason I think he has been down this September is that he usually has some time off during the season. This year he didn't and he's probably a little tired. He is still great. If you only give up three runs, and with that lineup, you've still given your team a chance to win.

 

[Argo]

I actually don't think red sox will resign pedro. He most likely will end up in Baltimore or a place like that next season. The only way I can see pedro resigned is if red sox win world series.

 

[mattlear]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: Argo
I actually don't think red sox will resign pedro. He most likely will end up in Baltimore or a place like that next season. The only way I can see pedro resigned is if red sox win world series.

Baltimore is gonna be a force either next year or in two years. The Mets should look at them and see what it takes to rebuild a team. If they get Pedro, they will be tough.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+). Now that he's close to 100% healthy and hitting mid 90's on the radar, he is still probably a close second in the AL (behind Santana) stuff wise (assuming he's locating his pitches well, and Santana too). Both are similar in that they have nasty breaking pitches, can switch speeds with nasty changeups, and mid 90's fastballs all spotted well. Schilling is probably 3rd in that he doesn't have a nasty change but compensates with the splitter (the same way Clemens reinvented himself in the late 90's by learning the splitter when his velocity dropped off).

As far as Koufax is concerned, yes I still wouldn't put Pedro ahead of Koufax because it was definitely a different game back then. If you did take away the complete games, I agree, he would probably be on par with Pedro's stats. Although, Koufax did pitch at the cavernous Dodger Stadium and Pedro at dangerous Fenway. Pedro obviously has better "stuff" than Koufax because it's a different game today. Both were great, Koufax got more run support than Pedro and was more durable = World Series ring.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+).

Did you forget about Guidry in '78?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
If you did take away the complete games, I agree, he would probably be on par with Pedro's stats. Although, Koufax did pitch at the cavernous Dodger Stadium and Pedro at dangerous Fenway. Pedro obviously has better "stuff" than Koufax because it's a different game today. Both were great, Koufax got more run support than Pedro and was more durable = World Series ring.

Those Steroids are really clouding your judgement. Petey couldn't hold Sandy's Jock. Petey started out great and has declined where as Koufax started out ok and got better until he was probably the best pitcher ever in the Modern era. If Petey had pitched half as many complete games as Koufax his stats wouldn't be all that impressive.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+).

Did you forget about Guidry in '78?

Guidry 28th. Pedro 2nd (2000) and 9th (1999).

 

[ABitTooSpicy]

Originally posted by: lordtyranus
I'm still sticking with my sox in 6. I have confidence we can sweep at fenway.

PUHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHA....

uh... damn... gotta breathe... oh man

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+).

Did you forget about Guidry in '78?

Guidry 28th. Pedro 2nd (2000) and 9th (1999).

I have no idea what adjusted stats mean, I know his actual stats.
in '78 he was 25-3 with a 1.74 ERA.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+).

Did you forget about Guidry in '78?

Guidry 28th. Pedro 2nd (2000) and 9th (1999).

I have no idea what adjusted stats mean, I know his actual stats.
in '78 he was 25-3 with a 1.74 ERA.

ERA+ measures dominance vs the league avg ERA, as well as other factors.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
ERA+ measures dominance vs the league avg ERA, as well as other factors.

Other factors=Bullsh!t. While I don't remember Guidry I do remember Koufax, Drysdale, Marichal and Giuson and all 4 were better than Petey.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: mattlear

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: TheAudit
Pedro is his own biggest promoter. You know they want him back, just not as the highest paid pitcher in baseball again.

Yeah, he obviously isn't the *best* pitcher in baseball, but when he's on he's pretty much unstoppable (many Yankee fans would agree with me on that). They compared his stats to Koufax last night on TV, and Pedro has better numbers so he's already a shoe in for the HOF. I think now that he's rediscovered his fastball (93-97mph range in the playoff games??????) he is probably worth at least 10 mil a year plus options. He's proven that he can still be dominant in the playoffs, whether it's giving up 3 runs vs Anaheim and winning or 3 vs NY and losing. He would still be a #1 on any staff that doesn't include the names Santana or R.Johnson. I really hope Boston can resign him... and if not I would wish him well because he's quite an enigma, on and off the field.

I saw that comparison as well.

The one thing I think throws that comparison out of whack is the Complete games. If a pitcher throws 9 innings instead of 6 or 7, of course you expect a higher ERA, or maybe some more losses, etc, because the pitcher is more fatigued. A comparison of total career innings pitched is a somewhat fuzzy stat, because today they are generally earlier innings.

Now, you can throw hard for 6 or seven innings, and have a setup man and reliever come in. Pitchers just don't throw CGs anymore, because strategy has changed. Bring in a new, live arm instead of leaving a guy in there.


I'd be curious to see on average how many innings per game both pitchers pitched.

Pedro is a damn good pitcher, and a few years ago, he was arguably the best in MLB. I'm not sure he was as dominant as Koufax was in his heyday.

-Matt

He's not as dominant now, but he undisputably had the best 2 single seasons of a pitcher ever in 1999 and 2000 with regards to dominance (ERA+).

Did you forget about Guidry in '78?

Guidry 28th. Pedro 2nd (2000) and 9th (1999).

I have no idea what adjusted stats mean, I know his actual stats.
in '78 he was 25-3 with a 1.74 ERA.

ERA+ measures dominance vs the league avg ERA, as well as other factors.

Well, excuse me for not going for that crap. I know what his stats were, not "adjusted" stats. You can make anyone you want into a superstar by "adjusting" their stats.

 

[lordtyranus]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
ERA+ measures dominance vs the league avg ERA, as well as other factors.

Other factors=Bullsh!t. While I don't remember Guidry I do remember Koufax, Drysdale, Marichal and Giuson and all 4 were better than Petey.

There weren't massive amounts of steriods going around back in the day. Pedro was putting up an ERA under 2 when the league average was above 4.

I don't think the DH existed for all of those players either.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: lordtyranus

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
ERA+ measures dominance vs the league avg ERA, as well as other factors.

Other factors=Bullsh!t. While I don't remember Guidry I do remember Koufax, Drysdale, Marichal and Giuson and all 4 were better than Petey.

There weren't massive amounts of steriods going around back in the day. Pedro was putting up an ERA under 2 when the league average was above 4.

I don't think the DH existed for all of those players either.

Petey also didn't get a low ERA by pitching complete games like the 4 I mentioned did.

 

[TheAudit]

Pedro has the best hairstyle out of all of them.