ACA increases IN Insurance costs 78%

[michal1980]

http://www.indystar.com/article/201...-insurance-plan-rates?gcheck=1&nclick_check=1

hmmm, what? I thought all that new free stuff you were going to get, was going to be.. free. No.?

damn, hold on might have to burn another down with my buddy Obama, err, TM.

 

[Jhhnn]

Bunk link. Try this one-

http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatc...-expected-obamacare-premium-spikes-in-indiana

If your premium goes up by 78% & the difference is covered by govt subsidy, what have you lost, particularly if you have a better plan?

Or, perhaps we're witnessing a lie of omission- intentional, of course.

There are way too many unknowns for interpretations of such information to be anything more than agitprop.

 

[boochi]

govt subsidy

And who is paying for this?

 

[First]

And who is paying for this?

Not tax-paying Americans, unless you're aware of an Obamacare tax the rest of the world isn't.

Btw, the subsidy is supposed to be temporary until the law brings prices down through the pressure of regulation and market forces. Which it has done for the last 3 years straight.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Not tax-paying Americans, unless you're aware of an Obamacare tax the rest of the world isn't.

Btw, the subsidy is supposed to be temporary until the law brings prices down through the pressure of regulation and market forces. Which it has done for the last 3 years straight.

That's cool. Now I know why patients can't get their meds now.

 

[Lanyap]

And who is paying for this?

You!

 

[Fern]

Not tax-paying Americans, unless you're aware of an Obamacare tax the rest of the world isn't.
-snip-

Well, somebody isn't aware of something....

A quick google shows 10 new taxes, or tax increases:

http://www.businessinsider.com/here-are-the-new-obamacare-taxes-2012-7

(I think I've read elsewhere that the actual number of new taxes and tax increases is actually 22.)

Fern

 

[Jhhnn]

Well, somebody isn't aware of something....

A quick google shows 10 new taxes, or tax increases:

http://www.businessinsider.com/here-are-the-new-obamacare-taxes-2012-7

(I think I've read elsewhere that the actual number of new taxes and tax increases is actually 22.)

Fern

Taxes that almost exclusively affect the most affluent Americans, who still pay the lowest tax rates of any first world affluent.

If American Capitalism were actually fulfilling the trickle down job creator promises, we wouldn't need to find alternative means for the American People to have affordable healthcare, would we?

 

[1prophet]

And who is paying for this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrTsuvykUZk:biggrin:

 

[Acanthus]

http://www.indystar.com/article/201...-insurance-plan-rates?gcheck=1&nclick_check=1

hmmm, what? I thought all that new free stuff you were going to get, was going to be.. free. No.?

damn, hold on might have to burn another down with my buddy Obama, err, TM.

From your own article:

The spike in costs is due primarily to new mandates under the law, which requires insurers to cover those with pre-existing conditions and to offer a minimum level of benefits

The cost increase is due to making the horrifically bad insurance plans illegal. You know, the ones that make you pay monthly premiums and then drop you when a bill comes along? Or the ones that don't cover anything but basic doctor visits? Or the ones that are just bulk purchasing programs for pharmacies?

This is a hilariously bad thing to be outraged about. People are getting real insurance. Of course it costs more than the shitshow the lower and middle class is used to.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Taxes that almost exclusively affect the most affluent Americans, who still pay the lowest tax rates of any first world affluent/QUOTE]

Gee I didn't realize you had to be affluent to be sick.

 

[Jhhnn]

Taxes that almost exclusively affect the most affluent Americans, who still pay the lowest tax rates of any first world affluent/QUOTE]

Gee I didn't realize you had to be affluent to be sick.

Deliberately obtuse often?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Deliberately obtuse often?

Why yes, yes you are.

Billionares don't spend a high percentage on health care so it's not them who ate getting screwed by the increase from 7.5% to 10% for deductions.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Taxes that almost exclusively affect the most affluent Americans, who still pay the lowest tax rates of any first world affluent.

If American Capitalism were actually fulfilling the trickle down job creator promises, we wouldn't need to find alternative means for the American People to have affordable healthcare, would we?

Back again to rape the wealthy because they have the money.

Better to fix the system; but that is to difficult and not politically beneficial

 

[michal1980]

From your own article:


The cost increase is due to making the horrifically bad insurance plans illegal. You know, the ones that make you pay monthly premiums and then drop you when a bill comes along? Or the ones that don't cover anything but basic doctor visits? Or the ones that are just bulk purchasing programs for pharmacies?

This is a hilariously bad thing to be outraged about. People are getting real insurance. Of course it costs more than the shitshow the lower and middle class is used to.

choices bitch. ever hear of them? if I'm health and want nothing but catastrophic coverage why cant I get that? oh because your sick fatty otherwise couldn't afford insurance. boo hoo.

 

[Jhhnn]

Back again to rape the wealthy because they have the money.

Better to fix the system; but that is to difficult and not politically beneficial

Yeh, their plight is pitiful, paying the lowest taxes of first world Rich & destroying America one offshored job at a time.

Poor Mitt had to pass up deductions to keep his federal tax rate above 13% to try to look good for the election.

If you really want to figure out who's raping who, just examine the shift of income to the tippy-top over the last 30 years, then get back to me, OK?

 

[Jhhnn]

choices bitch. ever hear of them? if I'm health and want nothing but catastrophic coverage why cant I get that? oh because your sick fatty otherwise couldn't afford insurance. boo hoo.

Because you'll get older someday, too, develop a pre-existing condition, or you'll have some truly unfortunate children, and will want better coverage after skating for as long as possible.

You'll want it both ways.

 

[buckshot24]

Yeh, their plight is pitiful, paying the lowest taxes of first world Rich & destroying America one offshored job at a time.

So what do you do about it? Make labor cost more! THAT will keep jobs from going overseas! Fucking stupid ass.

 

[Jhhnn]

Why yes, yes you are.

Billionares don't spend a high percentage on health care so it's not them who ate getting screwed by the increase from 7.5% to 10% for deductions.

I didn't offer "the Rich" but rather "the most affluent". Families in the $200-250K income range & up are definitely the most affluent. American families at the Median, ~$50K, often consider such people to be "Rich", even if I don't.

How hard will you be getting screwed by what you just claimed, anyway? put it in numbers.

 

[Jhhnn]

So what do you do about it? Make labor cost more! THAT will keep jobs from going overseas! Fucking stupid ass.

Heh. Yeh, we can all pay American overhead on Chinese wages, right?

Who'll make the mortgage payments on the vast expanses of suburbia at the wages you think we should be getting, anyway? Who'll buy the cars, insurance, energy? Bigfoot?

If American Capitalists won't provide for that with their deregulated financialized trickledown job creator song & dance routine, then America has the right to do so via other means, simply as economic self defense.

 

[buckshot24]

Heh. Yeh, we can all pay American overhead on Chinese wages, right?

Since you didn't address my point here it is again.

So how do you stop jobs from being shipped overseas? By making labor more expensive to keep them in the USA. Why do you think that will work?

Who'll make the mortgage payments on the vast expanses of suburbia at the wages you think we should be getting, anyway? Who'll buy the cars, insurance, energy? Bigfoot?

Who will do it when all the jobs get shipped overseas? Your ideas aren't stopping that and I'd say would help accelerate it.

If American Capitalists won't provide for that with their deregulated financialized trickledown job creator song & dance routine, then America has the right to do so via other means, simply as economic self defense.

Yes by creating higher labor cost so jobs stay in the US. Do you really believe this shit?

 

[Jhhnn]

Since you didn't address my point here it is again.

You never addressed mine, which came first.

If American Capitalism were actually fulfilling the trickle down job creator promises, we wouldn't need to find alternative means for the American People to have affordable healthcare, would we?

Rather, you duh-vert into strawman arguments, as usual.

Attempting to compete with Chinese labor is a losing proposition. Therefore, the power of egalitarian democracy as expressed through the govt of the people needs to find alternative ways to provide for the economic health of America, like taxing the wealthy more heavily & imposing capital constraints.

 

[sactoking]

If your premium goes up by 78% & the difference is covered by govt subsidy, what have you lost, particularly if you have a better plan?

Not everyone gets a subsidy, and those that don't have to pay the full increase. Those that do, well, that subsidy money has to come from somewhere
...

Not tax-paying Americans, unless you're aware of an Obamacare tax the rest of the world isn't.

Btw, the subsidy is supposed to be temporary until the law brings prices down through the pressure of regulation and market forces. Which it has done for the last 3 years straight.

Of course tax-paying Americans pay for it. The ACA has a ~$250 billion surcharge on insurers built into. I can tell you that that is getting passed along in the form of increased premiums (In fact, there's a big accounting controversy now b/c some insurers have been trying to levy the tax surcharge in 2013 premiums b/c the 2014 tax is calculated based on 2013 enrollment). So, everyone who pays for premiums is footing the bill.

The subsidies? They're not temporary. There is nothing in the bill marking them as such.

 

[buckshot24]

You never addressed mine, which came first.



Rather, you duh-vert into strawman arguments, as usual.

Attempting to compete with Chinese labor is a losing proposition. Therefore, the power of egalitarian democracy as expressed through the govt of the people needs to find alternative ways to provide for the economic health of America, like taxing the wealthy more heavily & imposing capital constraints.

Ok so you're admitting that raising cost on labor here won't do a damn thing to help stop outsourcing? Will it cause more outsourcing? Or less?

How the fuck is this a strawman? Does your proposed ideas increase labor costs or decrease them? If they increase them how will this help fight against outsourcing?

 

[ivwshane]

Ok so you're admitting that raising cost on labor here won't do a damn thing to help stop outsourcing? Will it cause more outsourcing? Or less?

How the fuck is this a strawman? Does your proposed ideas increase labor costs or decrease them? If they increase them how will this help fight against outsourcing?

Outsourcing has been happening for decades as corporate taxes have gone down. How long will you continue being the corporate apologist? Until all jobs are out sourced and the rich account for 90% of the wealth ownership?

Will there ever be a time when you side with the American worker over big businesses?