A sample of how 'hard' teachers have it

[ProfJohn]

Here is a copy of a union contract for the South Milwaukee school district.

Everything in bold is my comments.


http://www.publicschoolspending.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/South-Milwaukee-Sch-Dist-2009.pdf

High School Middle School Elementary Schools
7:30 a.m. to 3:00 p.m. (includes a thirty (30) minute duty- free lunch period)

7 hour work day

A full-time classroom teacher in the district has 320-330 minutes of student- assignable time per day.

5.5 hours a day in front of students

Full-time teachers at the 6-12 level shall not have more than five (5) instructional classes per day and not more than 1350 minutes of instructional time per week. This language allows the option of mutually agreeable overload assignments and pay.

22.5 hours a week and if you do more you get paid more.

Professional staff who are absent from work because of illness or other disabilities will be compensated at full pro-rated contractual pay level at the rate of twelve (12) personal sick leave days per year, cumulative to one hundred (100) days.

12 sick days in a 9 month period...

The calendar will have one hundred eighty (180) session days. Session days are those days the school is occupied by both students and teachers. Up to three (3) scheduled parent/teacher conference days may be included in the one hundred eighty (180) session days .

They actually have 187 days of work a year after workshop days and parent conferences etc

And for all this suffering they are paid a starting pay of $38k for a BA degree up to $46k after 5 years and top out at $50k after 9. A masters is worth as much as $10k depending on years worked.

I should have gone into teaching...

 

[MomentsofSanity]

You've never known a teacher have you? So much fail in one post.

 

[Martin]

You've never known a teacher have you? So much fail in one post.

Aye. Two of my friends became teachers and anyone who think teachers have it easy is a moron. They have to deal with far more shit anyone else I know.

 

[ProfJohn]

You've never known a teacher have you? So much fail in one post.

My sister in-law is a teacher as is her sister and many of their friends.

But feel free to do the math and show me how a teacher working 187 days a year does more work than a full time non-teacher working 235 days a year.

Hell, I'll do it for you.

Regular stiff: 2 weeks vacation, 10 paid holidays, 5 sick days. That is 25 days off a year or 235 working days a year.

235x8= 1,880 hours a year.

Teacher 187 days a year.
1,800/187 = 10 hours a day every day for the entire school year to equal same amount of work hours as typical 40 hours a week person.

 

[cubby1223]

<snip>

Just stop.

Seriously.

Stop posting.

Your commentary does not reflect reality in any shape or form.



Some school districts have certain teachers making high salaries. Most school districts have teachers making lower salaries and working many, many, many more hours than you claim.

 

[Engineer]

You've never known a teacher have you? So much fail in one post.

The guy, while bashing the evil teachers, has no idea.


There is no way in hell that I would teach even if paid what I'm paid now. Not fucking worth it. Anyone who wants to bitch and moan should have to try it once. Just once is all it would take.

Funny....you pay a high school educated mechanic $60 per hour to work on your car but whine like a baby when a college educated (masters degree in many cases) teacher gets paid $35 or more per hour to teach your kids. You, regardless of your sister in law being a teacher, have no fucking idea.

I rarely say this but you've earned a big STFU on this one.

 

[JSt0rm]

we should get rid of all teachers. Lazy bitches. Replace them with a bible.

 

[CrackRabbit]

You've never known a teacher have you? So much fail in one post.

No kidding.
In fact, I think this may be the largest fail of a troll post PJ has posted yet.

<-- Mother was a teacher.

 

[ProfJohn]

Aye. Two of my friends became teachers and anyone who think teachers have it easy is a moron. They have to deal with far more shit anyone else I know.

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

 

[JSt0rm]

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

Well you still have to work with black people in either job so what would you rather do pj? Mister southerner? Hmmm?

 

[CrackRabbit]

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

I'll take the job at Mickey D's.

You would have to pay me 3x that to get me to put up with the crap my mother did.

Edit: I have a feeling your sister-in-law probably thinks you are a dick.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

My sister in-law is a teacher as is her sister and many of their friends.

But feel free to do the math and show me how a teacher working 187 days a year does more work than a full time non-teacher working 235 days a year.

Hell, I'll do it for you.

Regular stiff: 2 weeks vacation, 10 paid holidays, 5 sick days. That is 25 days off a year or 235 working days a year.

235x8= 1,880 hours a year.

Teacher 187 days a year.
1,800/187 = 10 hours a day every day for the entire school year to equal same amount of work hours as typical 40 hours a week person.

You actually believe they start work at the opening bell and stop at the closing bell don't you? My family is full of teachers and they are doing class prep, marking homework, tests etc... Literally all night most nights. 10 hours a day? Try upwards of 15 or more, plus weekends etc...

 

[Engineer]

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

What are the educational requirements to be a manager at McDonalds?

 

[ProfJohn]

Just stop.

Seriously.

Stop posting.

Your commentary does not reflect reality in any shape or form.



Some school districts have certain teachers making high salaries. Most school districts have teachers making lower salaries and working many, many, many more hours than you claim.

Reality is the union contract in that link that lays it out right in front of you.

Sure a lot of teachers do extra work and do home work and stay late.

But do you really think they are putting in 3 hours a day for everyday of the school year doing that?

And what about the teachers who suck and do exactly what the contract requires?
7 hours a day, 187 days a year and it is nearly impossible to get fired... :hmm:

 

[Schadenfroh]

My mother is a (public school) teacher, she retired a couple of years ago.

When I was young, she would constantly come home late because of parent / teacher conferences or administrative meetings. The meth head parents of the little shits are far worse than them.

You are basically a free (to the parents) daycare service for low income families that provide the kids two free meals a day. A student was hauled off by the cops about once a week for some kind of violent act or drug related charge.

Some students could not speak English, they would just sit there and the teachers passed them. Some native born Americans (that were really good at football) were completely illiterate.

When you do try to discipline them or teach them something, they will fail their tests and their shithead parents will make you spend hours a day in parent / teacher conferences in which they tell you it is always YOUR fault that their brilliant son cannot pass algebra I.

Our public schools (for the most part) are a disaster, the kids do not care and the parents only want to raise hell with the teachers / administration or slap lawsuits on the school if a teacher actual does his/her job.

 

[frostedflakes]

To be fair, teachers do a lot of work outside that time. They're grading papers after work technically ends and the students go home, planning and preparing lessons, etc. Then again, a lot of salaried professionals bring their work home with them as well and work more than 40 hours a week, so I don't think I'd say that teachers have it harder than anyone else.

 

[ProfJohn]

What are the educational requirements to be a manager at McDonalds?

More like reverse requirements

But hey! Here is some FACTUAL information (as opposed to the emotion based arguments you guys keep making)

Data is from around 2000-2001 but it clearly shows that the average hourly pay for teachers is better than accountants, computer programers or government engineers.

 

[shortylickens]

 

[sunzt]

Reality is the union contract in that link that lays it out right in front of you.

Sure a lot of teachers do extra work and do home work and stay late.

But do you really think they are putting in 3 hours a day for everyday of the school year doing that?

And what about the teachers who suck and do exactly what the contract requires?
7 hours a day, 187 days a year and it is nearly impossible to get fired... :hmm:

Reality is... teachers pretty much do the equivalent of a years worth of work in a 187-235 day period. Many of them also work during the summer as well.

And yes... I would take the McD job over teaching.

 

[ProfJohn]

To be fair, teachers do a lot of work outside that time. They're grading papers after work technically ends and the students go home, planning and preparing lessons, etc. Then again, a lot of salaried professionals bring their work home with them as well and work more than 40 hours a week, so I don't think I'd say that teachers have it harder than anyone else.

Exactly.

I have friends making teacher pay (45-55k a year) working 45-55 hours a week EVERY week year round (2 weeks vacation and holidays off of course)

If you look at hours worked vs pay teachers do very well in most cases.

Doesn't mean that I would rush off to teach in the bad part of town, but teaching in any of the schools near where I live would probably be a better life style than my current career offers. (similar pay with a hell of a lot more time off plus you can be home by 4pm every day if you need too.)

 

[sunzt]

More like reverse requirements

But hey! Here is some FACTUAL information (as opposed to the emotion based arguments you guys keep making)

Data is from around 2000-2001 but it clearly shows that the average hourly pay for teachers is better than accountants, computer programers or government engineers.

Does that take into account worked hours not paid or is based on what's "on paper".

 

[Martin]

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

I'd rather work at my current job, making far more and being able to tell people to fuck off when they annoy me. Teachers frequently do work long hours during the school year (they have their their own version of homework), in addition to having to discipline a bunch of manipulative little shits, deal with their idiot parents, try their best to keep some out of prison all the while trying to actually teach something to the rest of the kids. But apparently an average wage is waaaay to much money for them.

 

[Engineer]

More like reverse requirements

But hey! Here is some FACTUAL information (as opposed to the emotion based arguments you guys keep making)

Data is from around 2000-2001 but it clearly shows that the average hourly pay for teachers is better than accountants, computer programers or government engineers.

So? They deserve every penny for what they put with, especially with pieces of shit legislation like No Child Left Behind (short for hold every child behind). Like I said, you pay a mechanic $60 per hour but bitch because the evil union teacher makes an average of over $35.

You didn't answer my question on the educational requirements for McDonald's manager....you brought that up now answer it.

Get over yourself and your fucking hard on for unions and just shut up.

 

[her209]

PJ should see the sweet contracts that are offered to the higher ups.

 

[ProfJohn]

Reality is... teachers pretty much do the equivalent of a years worth of work in a 187-235 day period. Many of them also work during the summer as well.

And yes... I would take the McD job over teaching.

Bullshit!

That McDonalds job is going to require 45-50 hours a week every week for 50 weeks a year.

Compared to 50 hours a week for 9 months a year.

A 45-50 hour week is pretty much standard for white collar employees these days. So the typical working making similar pay as a teacher is working as many hours a week as a teacher and doesn't get 14 weeks off a year.