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A Muslim's perspective

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My personal opinion is that with globalization, and access to information, the Muslim populace will finally be able to understand the religion and not simply believe the half-baked nonsense spewed out by crazed leaders, governmental or religious.

That's a great sentiment, necessarily, but unfortunately Muslims have erected significant barriers to the better understanding of their religion.

E.g.

uh, Hinduism and Islam are not similar, they are different from a fundamental POV. One is idol worship polytheistic religions. The other is a monotheistic no idols allowed.

Globalization presents a great opportunity to learn from the rest of the world, and that includes learning from your closest neighbors which you've fought and distanced yourselves from. Hinduism is monotheistic at its core, but takes a polytheistic appearance as it celebrates the plurality of appearances of that divinity and notably tolerance for disparate views of the divine. Islam on the other hand is arguably the least tolerant of all religions, and it is because of that there is a gulf between it and other religions; other views of God.

However, considering that positively might be too far of a leap for you at this time. It should be easier to consider the message of prophet Isa. That message is clearly one of tolerance and harmlessness -- turn the other cheek, instead of taking enormous offense and violent reactions to attacks, only perceived and otherwise.

Sadly, you have done nothing here to improve the perception of Muslims. Not one iota of compromise, not one iota to accepting responsibility for the harm done by Islam and Muslims to the world and to your present corner of the world specifically. What we hear instead is you're not responsible, and that the other aren't true Scotsmen like yourself, and that you couldn't make any compromise because no compromise would be sufficient for the hardest opponents, and the appearance of any compromise would be seen as a loss, in your great battle.

You could even start by showing some respect for comical protests, instead of the more common rage and violent hostilities that we've become accustomed to. Such protests are not simply acts of war as you take them to be, but are also acts expressing freedom of thought and specifically freedom from the increasing effects and impositions placed on others by Islam, its proponents, interpreters, and law makers.

Rumi was proud of his scholarship. Yet it is said that the man who was to teach him threw his books in a well when he met him, in a symbolic act. So if symbolic damage to books could be used to teach Rumi, must such an act be interpreted and reacted to as simple hostility now?
 
I like your post Madwand1 a lot more then the Hindus who have really come off as attacking and blaming.
I don't know if those posts are in this thread or one of the others though, you probably missed them.
I think routan has done a fairly good job considering he's got to defend against 30 people with 30 different attacks.
 
I like your post Madwand1 a lot more then the Hindus who have really come off as attacking and blaming.
I don't know if those posts are in this thread or one of the others though, you probably missed them.
I think routan has done a fairly good job considering he's got to defend against 30 people with 30 different attacks.

lol sure, he is doing a perfect job.

all he does is reflect, "oh i answered that already" "oh but this"


he is hardly answering deep questions, rather floating with simple ones, such as: "do you want shariah law in the us" or " do you think hamas is a terrorist organization"

after the initial answer, which leaves more questions than answers, he doesnt go any deeper on any issue.
 
I like your post Madwand1 a lot more then the Hindus who have really come off as attacking and blaming.
I don't know if those posts are in this thread or one of the others though, you probably missed them.
I think routan has done a fairly good job considering he's got to defend against 30 people with 30 different attacks.

Earl, are you yourself Muslim or an Islamist?

This thread, from what I have read of it has the usual gamut of inquiry, insult and argument. For a thread of this length he has been treated extraordinarily well by the standards that are held here.

In any case, routan has been an acknowledged lurker and thus knew in advance that he would be challenged. That is why he posted.

The issue that I and others have is in the incompleteness and in the deflection and thus the fundamental dishonesty of his answers. As he claimed he would offer a true insight into the Muslim perspective many are disappointed.

He is free to respond or not as he chooses, and will likely continue to receive as much or more courtesy as anyone can expect here.
 
lol sure, he is doing a perfect job.

all he does is reflect, "oh i answered that already" "oh but this"


he is hardly answering deep questions, rather floating with simple ones, such as: "do you want shariah law in the us" or " do you think hamas is a terrorist organization"

after the initial answer, which leaves more questions than answers, he doesnt go any deeper on any issue.

lol
I can't tell for sure who you are talking about, the Park51 Imam or routan.
routan has had to answer several questions repeatedly,sometimes less then a page apart.
I think your talking about the Iman with the Shari'ah law and the hamas as a terrorist org, and he did answer them, weren't you one of the attackers with the hamas thing?
You got the answer you weren't looking for and failed to man up to it.
Speaking of manning up, are you basically giving up on the Iman calling 71% of Americans radicals?

Earl, are you yourself Muslim or an Islamist?

This thread, from what I have read of it has the usual gamut of inquiry, insult and argument. For a thread of this length he has been treated extraordinarily well by the standards that are held here.

In any case, routan has been an acknowledged lurker and thus knew in advance that he would be challenged. That is why he posted.

The issue that I and others have is in the incompleteness and in the deflection and thus the fundamental dishonesty of his answers. As he claimed he would offer a true insight into the Muslim perspective many are disappointed.

He is free to respond or not as he chooses, and will likely continue to receive as much or more courtesy as anyone can expect here.

Born and raised Catholic (not practicing), Norwegian,Irish,Scottish descent. I live in the Canadian Bible Belt. Live in the big city (pop-179,246) of Regina, Saskatchewan, but have spent most of my life in small towns (a country boy, if you will) When I'm working, I'm doing Carpentry,Plumbing etc. labor intensive work. I love football (Go Riders), NASCAR, Star Trek and my PS3. Divorced, 3 kids and a dog named Blue. You can call me a redneck and I'll give you a "Damn straight* as a reply.
How's that for a bio, I'm just going to copy it now, and just paste it every time I get the "Are you Muslim?" question.

Since the American wars, we have had a lot of Muslim refugees, and I'm starting to think because of the American economy and FOX headlines a lot more Muslim,Hindu etc immigrants. No doubt seeking employment and tolerance and freedom.
I live in a block of apartments that has become quite the little multicultural community. I can look out my window at women in full burqa gear chatting it up with the Hindu and Sikh ladies while their kids play together.
Since most of our high school graduates have become spoiled and fat also, (not mine everyone else's 😉 ) I have had the chance to work with a lot of Muslim men and have become after-work friends with a few.

I lurked here for years also before I first posted, the Righties in P&N and OT, before there was a P&N fascinated me. They were so different then the Americans I had got to know in real life.
- To the grammar nazis's, I did the best I could

edit- p.s. I have noticed 2 new restaurants in town, Punjabi Pizza and Punjabi Perogies.
What is that? That's Canadian! 😉
 
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lol

edit- p.s. I have noticed 2 new restaurants in town, Punjabi Pizza and Punjabi Perogies.
What is that? That's Canadian! 😉

TMI, Earl.

While I can imagine Punjabi Pizza, Punjabi Pierogies seem wrong, very wrong to me. 😵

But, like you said, that's Canadian!
 
lol
I can't tell for sure who you are talking about, the Park51 Imam or routan.
routan has had to answer several questions repeatedly,sometimes less then a page apart.
I think your talking about the Iman with the Shari'ah law and the hamas as a terrorist org, and he did answer them, weren't you one of the attackers with the hamas thing?
You got the answer you weren't looking for and failed to man up to it.
Speaking of manning up, are you basically giving up on the Iman calling 71% of Americans radicals?

actually both dodge questions, but in this case im talking about routan.

I have had little presence in this thread, since i dont have time to read 6 pages worth of posts, so not i wasnt attacking him on the hamas issue or shariah law issue, but i beleive i did ask him, and he responded with 'oh i answered that already'



also, in the interview, i guess i misintrepreted what he said, he said:

" If we move from that location, the story will be that the radicals have taken over the discourse. The headlines in the Muslim world will be that Islam is under attack. "


but this still doesnt change the fact that the imam wants shariah law in the us, doesnt condemn hamas, and is being insensitive to thousands of families who lost someone they knew on 911.

and on the issue with the name "CORDOBA" should be getting more press than it is.

we all know where this name comes from, and i think that reveals a lot on the imam's intentions with the muslim world.

what better way to embrace the west than to tell the muslim world, "hey look we have a cordoba house on ground zero"

I am not saying EVERYONE will take it negatively, but in the muslim world, where they are brainwashed every day, and only know of the "conquering" aspect of the name cordoba, and the radicals (which many in the muslim world think are moderates) that hijacked planes, they WILL take it as a way muslims are trying to conquer the US.

Look how easily the islamic people of the world went CRAZY when around 20 people at a SMALL church in florida THREATENED to burn the koran.

if they can be angered that easily for a threat, what can one honestly expect will happen if the coin flips the other way and they get a CORDOBA house on Ground Zero
 
Thought you lived in Iceland?
Our restaurant was probably opened from some guy fleeing the racism in the US 😉

If someone wants to flee racism, then why would they go to a country where they are subjects of an inbred queen who represents a sexist, racist and discriminatory institution? And that bitch's ugly face is on all of the money!
 
but this still doesnt change the fact that the imam wants shariah law in the us, doesnt condemn hamas, and is being insensitive to thousands of families who lost someone they knew on 911.

RAUF: I condemn everyone and anyone who commits acts of terrorism. And Hamas has committed acts of terrorism.

I'll just leave it up to you to read the transcript (for answers to the rest of your post), a couple more times, or however more you need, to comprehend it.
 
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If someone wants to flee racism, then why would they go to a country where they are subjects of an inbred queen who represents a sexist, racist and discriminatory institution? And that bitch's ugly face is on all of the money!

lol
Ya, I'll just leave you to your racism.
 
Btw, I really like your avatar. I'm thinking of making one with someone defecating on the bible or peeing on the torah.

Not original enough, my good man, and the National Endowment for the Arts has already subsidized such expressions, making it positively uncool.

Based on national trends you might consider an "I Miss The Mommy State" legend or one that is sure to please, "I Fought The Law And The Law Won," ensconced over the new Dem symbol.

But, those are as petulant as you are and I think you need a re-branding. How about a Crusader shield? Or "My Great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandaddy fought at Lepanto and I'm going back!" No, too long, better "Lepanto, miss me yet?"

How about "I was born a Republican and it took the Department of Education to make me a Democrat!" on a sea of red ink? Too long, how about "Passed gas, now taking Tea!"

Symbols abound - for you, a dunce cap. But make it really yours and superimpose how many time you voted for the Dems! :awe:
 
No, I'm not piddling in my pants thinking I'm going to get my head cut off in the first place.

Feeling safe at the moment, huh? No airliners flying over your head? I guess having those oil sands in your backyard kinda obviates the actual need to concern yourself.
 
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