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A bill was introduced to end No-Knock warrants.

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zinfamous said:
just wait: Rand Paul will still vote against it.

Oh, you fucking know he will. 😀
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It would be foolish think that if you knew a damn thing about the guy. Just because he has an 'R' next to his name doesn't automatically make him the enemy. Introduce a bill just to vote against it? OK, maybe, but I don't buy it here. You could've made a better argument saying Trump would veto it.
 
DONT KILL ME Ok... Whats the problem with no knock warrents?
You have a situation where the perp will destroy evidence if given a 3 second chance, do these things not have a place?

Could it also be a ploy to unhook Manafort?
 
Thunder 57 said:
It would be foolish think that if you knew a damn thing about the guy. Just because he has an 'R' next to his name doesn't automatically make him the enemy. Introduce a bill just to vote against it? OK, maybe, but I don't buy it here. You could've made a better argument saying Trump would veto it.
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Uh, he votes against every bill. That's his thing. It seems is only role is to be, if it comes down to one person, he will still be the one person that votes against it.

Rand appears to think that his only job as a legislator is to "prove that government doesn't work" by simply not doing a damn thing, lol.

...so, it was mostly a joke based on his observed behavior. Do I seriously think he would vote against his own bill? ...eh, I give it 60/40. 😉
 
It seems to me that there are times when police might not want to let the occupants know they're coming in. I know that if I was going to be the first guy through a door, and the fellow on the other side had already killed people, I'd prefer that he not know I'm there. I assume that's a rare situation, but I also assume it does occasionally happen.
 
Greenman said:
It seems to me that there are times when police might not want to let the occupants know they're coming in. I know that if I was going to be the first guy through a door, and the fellow on the other side had already killed people, I'd prefer that he not know I'm there. I assume that's a rare situation, but I also assume it does occasionally happen.
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Well don't worry, we won't have police at all soon enough if certain people get their way...

That said, I understand your point. I wouldn't want to be that guy either. But surely you could catch the wanted at some point when they are outside going about their ways?
 
cytg111 said:
DONT KILL ME Ok... Whats the problem with no knock warrents?
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It is police conducting home invasions.
Anyone breaks into my house is getting shot at.
Police are going to shoot back, guaranteeing a deadly resolution to the conflict they started.

It has happened across the nation numerous times.

Including throwing a stun grenade into a baby crib, resulting in severe burns and bodily injury.

No Knock warrants are a complete disregard for human life and our civil liberties.
 
imported_tajmahal said:
Another conservative Republican that has opposed no-knock warrants for almost 40 years along with most of the Patriot Act. Funny how so many Democrats voted for and support those laws, while they still try to pin all the blame on the right.
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Funny that you do not know how the House or the Senate works......
Funny how your Fuhrer claims to be a Law and Order Fuhrer and his minions in the Senate hold up valuable legislation!
One more thing, instead of your Fuhrer calling himself a Law and order Fuhrer perhaps he should call himself the Shit and Grins Fuhrer,...
 
JEDIYoda said:
Funny that you do not know how the House or the Senate works......
Funny how your Fuhrer claims to be a Law and Order Fuhrer and his minions in the Senate hold up valuable legislation!
One more thing, instead of your Fuhrer calling himself a Law and order Fuhrer perhaps he should call himself the Shit and Grins Fuhrer,...
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Or damned near stumble, have to take baby steps, and then almost fall flat on his face trying to "walk" down a fairly shallow inclined ramp that was perfectly dry Fuhrer. And then boast of his portrayal of an almost invalid old white man.
 
Greenman said:
It seems to me that there are times when police might not want to let the occupants know they're coming in. I know that if I was going to be the first guy through a door, and the fellow on the other side had already killed people, I'd prefer that he not know I'm there. I assume that's a rare situation, but I also assume it does occasionally happen.
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It seems to me that whenever armed intruders break into a private home without warning, the residents of the home should have the right to defend themselves without question.
Which is why no-knock warrants need to go. The practice allows the govt to routinely infringe upon citizens' rights to reasonably defend themselves based upon the risk to the police of a rare situation, as you put it. It seems citizens' lives are less important than police lives, as long as we can say it might be a murderer that's the target of the no-knock warrant, when it's far more likely to be a small-time drug bust.
But thanks for bringing up the rationale that will be used to kill the bill in the Senate.
 
Thunder 57 said:
Well don't worry, we won't have police at all soon enough if certain people get their way...

That said, I understand your point. I wouldn't want to be that guy either. But surely you could catch the wanted at some point when they are outside going about their ways?
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He'll, you can even catch them at their own home, while announcing yourself, with a regular warrant. No knocks are bullshit, thru and thru.
 
Vic said:
It seems to me that whenever armed intruders break into a private home without warning, the residents of the home should have the right to defend themselves without question.
Which is why no-knock warrants need to go. The practice allows the govt to routinely infringe upon citizens' rights to reasonably defend themselves based upon the risk to the police of a rare situation, as you put it. It seems citizens' lives are less important than police lives, as long as we can say it might be a murderer that's the target of the no-knock warrant, when it's far more likely to be a small-time drug bust.
But thanks for bringing up the rationale that will be used to kill the bill in the Senate.
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Or in some cases, just murdering law abiding citizens for defending their homes.
 
ch33zw1z said:
Or in some cases, just murdering law abiding citizens for defending their homes.
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Exactly! Or you want to know what is more egregious than all the above?
When the Police execute a no knock warrant and it turns out it is the wrong house! Then once it is discovered to be the wrong house they tear the house up anyways all the while they have the occupants all in handcuffs.....
Then they get away with that under the guise of Qualified Immunity.....
 
JEDIYoda said:
Exactly! Or you want to know what is more egregious than all the above?
When the Police execute a no knock warrant and it turns out it is the wrong house! Then once it is discovered to be the wrong house they tear the house up anyways all the while they have the occupants all in handcuffs.....
Then they get away with that under the guise of Qualified Immunity.....
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Not even so much as held liable or responsible for damages to the property...even if/when the wrong property...so fucked.
 
Thunder 57 said:
Well don't worry, we won't have police at all soon enough if certain people get their way...

That said, I understand your point. I wouldn't want to be that guy either. But surely you could catch the wanted at some point when they are outside going about their ways?
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I would assume so, though it would have to be an ambush to avoid the same problems as kicking down the door.

We want the police to use the minimum amount of force necessary to arrest a suspect. That's nothing more than common sense. The problem is it's hard for anyone to make that call in a high stress situation. It's easy to make a mistake, or use it as an excuse to shoot someone. Police tactics didn't evolve out of the desire to hurt people, they evolved out of the desire to not get hurt. Now we clearly have a few cops that are of the shoot first school of thinking, those are the fellows that need to go. That's going to cover a very large piece of the problem.
 
Greenman said:
I would assume so, though it would have to be an ambush to avoid the same problems as kicking down the door.

We want the police to use the minimum amount of force necessary to arrest a suspect. That's nothing more than common sense. The problem is it's hard for anyone to make that call in a high stress situation. It's easy to make a mistake, or use it as an excuse to shoot someone. Police tactics didn't evolve out of the desire to hurt people, they evolved out of the desire to not get hurt. Now we clearly have a few cops that are of the shoot first school of thinking, those are the fellows that need to go. That's going to cover a very large piece of the problem.
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how about don't escalate the situation? people are already nervous interacting with cops, PERIOD. if a cop came up to my window with a weapon drawn? i'd be even more on edge.

if someone tries to evade you? let them go. most people aren't going to go rogue and completely off the grid. the average person is not jason bourne.

it's more than just a few, otherwise this wouldn't be happening over and over and over again.
it's a pattern that plays itself out over

the way officers are trained, the "thin blue line" mentality... it's all toxic and does nothing to actually help.
 
Thunder 57 said:
If you knew Rand Paul you wouldn't be surprised. Anyone who votes against this is just a power hungry thug.
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Greenman said:
It seems to me that there are times when police might not want to let the occupants know they're coming in. I know that if I was going to be the first guy through a door, and the fellow on the other side had already killed people, I'd prefer that he not know I'm there. I assume that's a rare situation, but I also assume it does occasionally happen.
Click to expand...

Thunder 57 said:
Well don't worry, we won't have police at all soon enough if certain people get their way...

That said, I understand your point. I wouldn't want to be that guy either. But surely you could catch the wanted at some point when they are outside going about their ways?
Click to expand...


ch33zw1z said:
He'll, you can even catch them at their own home, while announcing yourself, with a regular warrant. No knocks are bullshit, thru and thru.
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Hey bozo, how about reading the thread or what was quoted? We agree on this, but you missed something in between interactions. Your post has likes though, which means I guess others didn't read what I wrote either.
 
Thunder 57 said:
Hey bozo, how about reading the thread or what was quoted? We agree on this, but you missed something in between interactions. Your post has likes though, which means I guess others didn't read what I wrote either.
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Seems you misspelled ch33zw1z, it's ok tho...no worries. I read your replies. We DO agree. What we won't agree on is placating a poster such as Greenman.
 
Thunder 57 said:
Hey bozo, how about reading the thread or what was quoted? We agree on this, but you missed something in between interactions. Your post has likes though, which means I guess others didn't read what I wrote either.
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This should afford you a clue as to the value of your opinions.
 
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