a "band-aid" for Nvidia shadow problem in FarCry

[lavaheadache]

Jeff7181 brought it to our attention in Dug777's now huge thread about a setting in the config file that seemed to improve the quality. This setting is e_active_shadow_maps_receving = "XX". The XX's don't belong there but, there will be some value assigned by FC. I'm guessing all Nvidia cards are using 2 as the assigned value becuase this is what mine was. I found that by changing the value too high results in graphic corruption. Setting the value at 12 provided the best shadow with no corruption. 13 and beyond resulted in the black map problem. I found a long tree shadow that illustrates the problem best. This is how it looked at stock setting. This is how it looked at a setting of 10( haha I was getting shot at when I took the screenie). Although this might not be the "right way" to fix the problem, it makes the shadows look a million times better than they did. I'm curious as to see what FC puts as a value using ATI cards. Anyone care to share?

 

[Jeff7181]

While this helps... it's not really a fix, I don't think. The shadows still aren't rendered how they're rendered on ATI cards. So the question now becomes, which is the correct way to render the shadows? Is Far Cry supposed to have soft shadows like you're seeing on ATI cards? I'd like to see what effect this tweak has on ATI cards...

This blocky shadow problem appears to exist in Battlefield 2, which leads me to believe this "fix" for Far Cry is a bandaid solution. The real problem lies in how the GPU is rendering the shadows in certain games. Since Far Cry and Battlefield 2 are definately not made using the same game engine, I don't think the same tweak is responsible for both. But maybe they use the same method of creating shadows that the nVidia hardware/drivers screws up.

The problem also existed on my FX5900... but I don't recall it existing on my 9800 Pro that I had for a short while. I'll see if I can find some screenshots from the 9800 that can confirm or deny that.

 

[lavaheadache]

I agree that this isn't the right way to correct the problem, but I will take a soft shadow-less Far Cry over a sh1tty shadowed Far Cry any day.

 

[Jeff7181]

The funny thing is the lower the number, the more "soft" the shadows become. But they're blocky. Increasing the number reduces the blockyness, but then it's not a soft shadow. Could someone with an ATI card and Far Cry please test this tweak and see what it does on an ATI GPU?

 

[lavaheadache]

Jeff I got a spare 9800 pro that im going to install right now. I'll get back to you in a few mins

 

[lavaheadache]

ok, interesting results. I installed the 9800 pro and fired up farcry. The shadows still looked blocky, so I deleted the system config file and reloaded farcry. The system re did the auto config. Loaded a map and bingo shadows are fixed. So with an ATI card using the nvidia created cofig file shadows looked like POO-POO. Using the ATi card on an ATi created config file they look awesome. Now, I'm going to reinstall the 6800 GT and use the ATI created profile and see what happens. BTW, changing the e_active_shadow_maps_receving = "XX". value to a higher value like 10 created a lot of graphic corruption almost like artifacting due to overclocking on the 9800 pro.

 

[Jeff7181]

Please post the system.cfg here for us to see.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
Please post the system.cfg here for us to see.

Yes, please do.

 

[lavaheadache]

here's the ati one
-- [System-Configuration]
-- Attention: This file is generated by the system, do not modify! Editing is not recommended!

ca_ambient_light_intensity = "0.2"
ca_ambient_light_range = "10"
ca_EnableDecals = "1"
cl_installshieldversion = "44"
cl_lazy_weapon = "0.0000"
cl_projectile_light = "1"
cl_punkbuster = "0"
cl_saveubipassword = "1"
cl_weapon_fx = "2"
cl_weapon_light = "2"
d3d9_TextureFilter = "TRILINEAR"
e_active_shadow_maps_receving = "2"
e_beach = "1"
e_brushes_merging = "1"
e_cgf_load_lods = "0"
e_decals = "1"
e_decals_life_time_scale = "3.000000"
e_detail_texture_quality = "1"
e_EntitySuppressionLevel = "0"
e_flocks = "1"
e_light_maps_quality = "2"
e_max_entity_lights = "4"
e_obj_lod_ratio = "10.000000"
e_overlay_geometry = "1"
e_particles_lod = "1.000000"
e_particles_max_count = "8192"
e_shadow_maps = "1"
e_shadow_maps_from_static_objects = "1"
e_shadow_maps_view_dist_ratio = "20.000000"
e_shadow_spots = "0"
e_stencil_shadows = "1"
e_stencil_shadows_only_from_strongest_light = "0"
e_use_global_fog_in_fog_volumes = "0"
e_vegetation_min_size = "0.000000"
e_vegetation_sprites_distance_ratio = "1.000000"
es_CharZOffsetSpeed = "2.0"
es_EnableCloth = "1"
ExitOnQuit = "1"
fs_homepath = ""
g_gore = "2"
g_language = "english"
g_playerprofile = "default"
g_serverprofile = ""
g_timezone = "0"
game_GliderBackImpulse = "2.5f"
game_GliderDamping = "0.15f"
game_GliderGravity = "-0.1f"
game_GliderStartGravity = "-0.8f"
i_dinputkeys = "1"
i_direct_input = "1"
i_mouse_accel = "0.0"
i_mouse_accel_max = "100.0"
i_mouse_mirror = "0"
i_mouse_smooth = "0.0"
log_FileVerbosity = "0"
log_Verbosity = "0"
mp_model = "objects/characters/pmodels/hero/hero_mp.cgf"
p_color = "4"
p_deathtime = "30.0000"
p_lightrange = "15"
p_model = "objects/characters/pmodels/hero/hero.cgf"
p_name = "Jack Carver"
r_Beams = "1"
r_Brightness = "0.500000"
r_checkSunVis = "2"
r_ColorBits = "32"
r_Contrast = "0.500000"
r_CoronaFade = "0.125000"
r_Coronas = "1"
r_CoronaSizeScale = "1.000000"
r_CryvisionType = "0"
r_DepthBits = "24"
r_DetailDistance = "4.000000"
r_DetailNumLayers = "1"
r_DetailTextures = "1"
r_DisableSfx = "0"
r_DisplayInfo = "0"
r_Driver = "Direct3D9"
r_EnhanceImage = "1"
r_EnhanceImageAmount = "1.000000"
r_EnvCMResolution = "2"
r_EnvCMupdateInterval = "0.050000"
r_EnvLCMupdateInterval = "0.050000"
r_EnvLightCMSize = "16"
r_EnvLighting = "0"
r_EnvTexResolution = "3"
r_EnvTexUpdateInterval = "0.001000"
r_Flares = "1"
r_FSAA = "0"
r_FSAA_quality = "0.000000"
r_FSAA_samples = "1"
r_Fullscreen = "1"
r_Gamma = "1.000000"
r_Glare = "1"
r_GlareQuality = "2"
r_HDRBrightOffset = "6.000000"
r_HDRBrightThreshold = "3.000000"
r_HDRLevel = "0.600000"
r_HDRRendering = "0"
r_HeatHaze = "1"
r_Height = "1050"
r_MotionBlur = "1"
r_ProcFlares = "1"
r_Quality_BumpMapping = "3"
r_Quality_Reflection = "0"
r_RenderMode = "0"
r_ScopeLens_fx = "1"
r_SelfShadow = "0"
r_ShadersPrecache = "1.000000"
r_ShadersSave = "0.000000"
r_ShadowBlur = "2"
r_StencilBits = "8"
r_TexBumpResolution = "1"
r_TexLMResolution = "0"
r_TexQuality = "0"
r_TexResolution = "1"
r_TexSkyResolution = "1"
r_Texture_Anisotropic_Level = "1"
r_TexturesStreamPoolSize = "0"
r_Vegetation_PerpixelLight = "1"
r_VolumetricFog = "1"
r_VSync = "0"
r_WaterReflections = "1"
r_WaterRefractions = "1"
r_WaterUpdateFactor = "0.001000"
r_Width = "1680"
s_CapsCheck = "0"
s_CompatibleMode = "0"
s_DopplerEnable = "1"
s_DopplerValue = "1.0"
s_DummySound = "0"
s_EnableSoundFX = "0"
s_InactiveSoundIterationTimeout = "1"
s_MaxActiveSoundSpots = "100"
s_MaxHWChannels = "0"
s_MaxSoundDist = "500"
s_MinHWChannels = "16"
s_MinRepeatSoundTimeout = "200"
s_MusicEnable = "1"
s_MusicMaxPatterns = "12"
s_MusicStreamedData = "1"
s_MusicVolume = "0.5"
s_SampleRate = "44100"
s_SFXVolume = "1"
s_SoundEnable = "1"
s_SpeakerConfig = "5"
s_VisAreasPropagation = "10"
sv_mapcyclefile = "profiles/server/mapcycle.txt"
sv_maxrate = "30000"
sv_maxrate_lan = "100000"
sv_punkbuster = "0"
sys_firstlaunch = "0"
sys_script_debugger = "0"
sys_skiponlowspec = "0"
sys_spec = "2"
sys_SSInfo = "0"
sys_warnings = "0"
ui_BackGroundVideo = "1"
ui_EasyToolTip = "0"
ui_RepeatDelay = "200"
ui_RepeatSpeed = "40"
ui_ToolTipDelay = "1500"
ui_ToolTips = "1"
ui_TriggerUIEvents = "1"
ui_TriggerWidgetEvents = "1"











heres the nv one

-- [System-Configuration]
-- Attention: This file is generated by the system, do not modify! Editing is not recommended!

ca_ambient_light_intensity = "0.2000000029802322"
ca_ambient_light_range = "10"
ca_EnableDecals = "1"
cl_installshieldversion = "44"
cl_lazy_weapon = "0.0000"
cl_projectile_light = "1"
cl_punkbuster = "0"
cl_saveubipassword = "1"
cl_weapon_fx = "2"
cl_weapon_light = "2"
d3d9_TextureFilter = "TRILINEAR"
e_active_shadow_maps_receving = "2"
e_beach = "1"
e_brushes_merging = "1"
e_cgf_load_lods = "0"
e_decals = "1"
e_decals_life_time_scale = "3.000000"
e_detail_texture_quality = "1"
e_EntitySuppressionLevel = "0"
e_flocks = "1"
e_light_maps_quality = "2"
e_max_entity_lights = "4"
e_obj_lod_ratio = "10.000000"
e_overlay_geometry = "1"
e_particles_lod = "1.000000"
e_particles_max_count = "8192"
e_shadow_maps = "1"
e_shadow_maps_from_static_objects = "1"
e_shadow_maps_view_dist_ratio = "20.000000"
e_shadow_spots = "1"
e_stencil_shadows = "1"
e_stencil_shadows_only_from_strongest_light = "0"
e_use_global_fog_in_fog_volumes = "0"
e_vegetation_min_size = "0.000000"
e_vegetation_sprites_distance_ratio = "1.000000"
es_CharZOffsetSpeed = "2.0"
es_EnableCloth = "1"
ExitOnQuit = "1"
fs_homepath = ""
g_gore = "2"
g_language = "english"
g_playerprofile = "default"
g_serverprofile = ""
g_timezone = "31337"
game_GliderBackImpulse = "2.5f"
game_GliderDamping = "0.15f"
game_GliderGravity = "-0.1f"
game_GliderStartGravity = "-0.8f"
i_dinputkeys = "1"
i_direct_input = "1"
i_mouse_accel = "0.0"
i_mouse_accel_max = "100.0"
i_mouse_mirror = "0"
i_mouse_smooth = "0.0"
log_FileVerbosity = "0"
log_Verbosity = "0"
mp_model = "objects/characters/pmodels/hero/hero_mp.cgf"
p_color = "0"
p_deathtime = "30"
p_lightrange = "15"
p_model = "objects/characters/pmodels/hero/hero.cgf"
p_name = "Jack Carver"
r_Beams = "1"
r_Brightness = "0.500000"
r_checkSunVis = "2"
r_ColorBits = "32"
r_Contrast = "0.500000"
r_CoronaFade = "0.125000"
r_Coronas = "1"
r_CoronaSizeScale = "1.000000"
r_CryvisionType = "0"
r_DepthBits = "24"
r_DetailDistance = "16.000000"
r_DetailNumLayers = "2"
r_DetailTextures = "1"
r_DisableSfx = "0"
r_DisplayInfo = "0"
r_Driver = "Direct3D9"
r_EnhanceImage = "1"
r_EnhanceImageAmount = "1.000000"
r_EnvCMResolution = "2"
r_EnvCMupdateInterval = "0.050000"
r_EnvLCMupdateInterval = "0.050000"
r_EnvLightCMSize = "16"
r_EnvLighting = "0"
r_EnvTexResolution = "3"
r_EnvTexUpdateInterval = "0.001000"
r_Flares = "1"
r_FSAA = "0"
r_FSAA_quality = "0"
r_FSAA_samples = "1"
r_Fullscreen = "1"
r_Gamma = "1.000000"
r_Glare = "2"
r_GlareQuality = "2"
r_HDRBrightOffset = "6.000000"
r_HDRBrightThreshold = "3.000000"
r_HDRLevel = "0.600000"
r_HDRRendering = "0"
r_HeatHaze = "1"
r_Height = "1050"
r_MotionBlur = "1"
r_ProcFlares = "1"
r_Quality_BumpMapping = "3"
r_Quality_Reflection = "1"
r_RenderMode = "2"
r_ScopeLens_fx = "1"
r_SelfShadow = "0"
r_ShadersPrecache = "1"
r_ShadersSave = "0"
r_ShadowBlur = "0"
r_StencilBits = "8"
r_TexBumpResolution = "0"
r_TexLMResolution = "0"
r_TexQuality = "0"
r_TexResolution = "0"
r_TexSkyResolution = "0"
r_Texture_Anisotropic_Level = "8"
r_TexturesStreamPoolSize = "0"
r_Vegetation_PerpixelLight = "1"
r_VolumetricFog = "1"
r_VSync = "0"
r_WaterReflections = "1"
r_WaterRefractions = "1"
r_WaterUpdateFactor = "0.001000"
r_Width = "1680"
s_CapsCheck = "0"
s_CompatibleMode = "0"
s_DopplerEnable = "1"
s_DopplerValue = "1.0"
s_DummySound = "0"
s_EnableSoundFX = "0"
s_InactiveSoundIterationTimeout = "1"
s_MaxActiveSoundSpots = "100"
s_MaxHWChannels = "0"
s_MaxSoundDist = "500"
s_MinHWChannels = "16"
s_MinRepeatSoundTimeout = "200"
s_MusicEnable = "1"
s_MusicMaxPatterns = "12"
s_MusicStreamedData = "1"
s_MusicVolume = "0.5"
s_SampleRate = "44100"
s_SFXVolume = "1"
s_SoundEnable = "1"
s_SpeakerConfig = "5"
s_VisAreasPropagation = "10"
sv_mapcyclefile = "profiles/server/mapcycle.txt"
sv_maxrate = "30000"
sv_maxrate_lan = "100000"
sv_punkbuster = "0"
sys_firstlaunch = "0"
sys_script_debugger = "0"
sys_skiponlowspec = "0"
sys_spec = "2"
sys_SSInfo = "0"
sys_warnings = "0"
ui_BackGroundVideo = "1"
ui_EasyToolTip = "0"
ui_RepeatDelay = "200"
ui_RepeatSpeed = "40"
ui_ToolTipDelay = "1500"
ui_ToolTips = "1"
ui_TriggerUIEvents = "1"
ui_TriggerWidgetEvents = "1"


Mostly the same exept the things that would differ like very high texture versus medium texture. The 6800 GT using the ati config file still looked like poo-poo. Odd it seems as though the 9800 pro could use the nv file and produce nv quality shadows but not vice-versa. I will add though that the 9800 pro can produce good frame rates at 1680x1050 no AA of AF using medium textures and everything else on high. Good meaning I didnt notice any stutter.

 

[moonboy403]

so using the ati profile on a nv card...does it help???

 

[lavaheadache]

Originally posted by: moonboy403
so using the ati profile on a nv card...does it help???

nope, I said it didnt in my last post

 

[lifeguard1999]

Thanks for the info.

 

[dug777]

as has been said, it improves it, which is very useful, but it falls well short of being a fix...

 

[Matt2]

Just for reference, in BF2 my X800XL had the blocky ugly shadows too.

 

[slash196]

I think the ugly shadows in BF2 are just a concession that the programmers made to cut down on lag.

 

[SynthDude2001]

Let me post my latest post from the other thread...:

Just an update - I was playing more FarCry earlier (on mp_radio) and I was getting tons of random slowdowns to under 10fps, other times it would be right back at 60. It was unplayable, really (it was under 10 a lot more than it was close to 60). When I set it back to the default of 2, framerates jumped back up to 60 solid. So, unless something else in my config has changed, I think that shadow setting isn't a real fix...

 

[Viper96720]

What's your video driver settings for global and farcry.exe? Make sure all optimizations are off.

 

[Chocolate Pi]

This is probably obvious, but it might help somebody figure something out:

ATI-
ca_ambient_light_intensity = "0.2"
g_timezone = "0"
p_color = "4"
p_deathtime = "30.0000"
r_DetailDistance = "4.000000"
r_DetailNumLayers = "1"
r_FSAA_quality = "0.000000"
r_Glare = "1"
r_Quality_Reflection = "0"
r_RenderMode = "0"
r_ShadersPrecache = "1.000000"
r_ShadersSave = "0.000000"
r_ShadowBlur = "2"
r_TexBumpResolution = "1"
r_TexResolution = "1"
r_TexSkyResolution = "1"
r_Texture_Anisotropic_Level = "1"

nVidia-
ca_ambient_light_intensity = "0.2000000029802322"
g_timezone = "31337"
p_color = "0"
p_deathtime = "30"
r_DetailDistance = "16.000000"
r_DetailNumLayers = "2"
r_FSAA_quality = "0"
r_Glare = "2"
r_Quality_Reflection = "1"
r_RenderMode = "2"
r_ShadersPrecache = "1"
r_ShadersSave = "0"
r_ShadowBlur = "0"
r_TexBumpResolution = "0"
r_TexResolution = "0"
r_TexSkyResolution = "0"
r_Texture_Anisotropic_Level = "8"

Those are the values that are the slightest bit different between the config files listed. Most probably don't have anything to do with it, but weirder things have happened.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001
Let me post my latest post from the other thread...:

Just an update - I was playing more FarCry earlier (on mp_radio) and I was getting tons of random slowdowns to under 10fps, other times it would be right back at 60. It was unplayable, really (it was under 10 a lot more than it was close to 60). When I set it back to the default of 2, framerates jumped back up to 60 solid. So, unless something else in my config has changed, I think that shadow setting isn't a real fix...

Of course it's not. That's why I said it's a bandaid fix. Doesn't really solve the problem of the gaping, infected wound, just covers it up.

 

[TraumaRN]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001
Let me post my latest post from the other thread...:

Just an update - I was playing more FarCry earlier (on mp_radio) and I was getting tons of random slowdowns to under 10fps, other times it would be right back at 60. It was unplayable, really (it was under 10 a lot more than it was close to 60). When I set it back to the default of 2, framerates jumped back up to 60 solid. So, unless something else in my config has changed, I think that shadow setting isn't a real fix...

Of course it's not. That's why I said it's a bandaid fix. Doesn't really solve the problem of the gaping, infected wound, just covers it up.

I goofed around with it in my system and found that setting it to a value of 10 is best for solid frames, 11 and 12 caused slowdown even on my system...i tried 9 and it was a slideshow but 10 it's buttery smooth

 

[lifeguard1999]

Come on NV, lets get a real fix!

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001
Let me post my latest post from the other thread...:

Just an update - I was playing more FarCry earlier (on mp_radio) and I was getting tons of random slowdowns to under 10fps, other times it would be right back at 60. It was unplayable, really (it was under 10 a lot more than it was close to 60). When I set it back to the default of 2, framerates jumped back up to 60 solid. So, unless something else in my config has changed, I think that shadow setting isn't a real fix...

Of course it's not. That's why I said it's a bandaid fix. Doesn't really solve the problem of the gaping, infected wound, just covers it up.

Now Jeff, do you really think shadows being blocky in a year and a half old game can be described as a "gaping, infected wound", especially when editing the config file makes them better?

Hyperbole?

IMO everything being rendered black and white merits your description, this could be described as a nuisance?

And what about shadows? Is it a "gaping, infected wound" that ATI cards can't render the soft stencil shadows in games like Riddick? I play Riddick with soft shadows, poor ATI owners have to look at hard edges on their shadows- shadows don't have a hard edge Jeff.

You don't see me on hear making huge threads "When will ATI card be able to render Riddicks Shadows properly, as programmed?"

This whole "blocky shadows of Far Cry" thing is bullsh*t, a mountain out of a molehill, people who want to flame nVidia picking a trivial nuisance and playing it up like it was the end of the world. Pretty sad.

 

[dug777]

:roll: maybe if it did solve the problem you'd even begin to have a point, but the shadows still look like ass, and what's more the 'fix' messes dramatically with the performance of the game as several people have reported. (including one you've quoted :roll: )

Next, you notice the fact that pretty much all of us who have followed this issue up have nvidia cards, so there goes your last (and ridiculously childish) point. We just want the problem solved, and for us (yes, us who own nvidia cards ).

It may be a year and a half old game, but AFAIK it's one of the most commonly benched games out there, arguably one of the best looking engines even now (many on this foum seem to think so at least) and has been on the technological bleeding edge all along..remember HDR? It might interest you to know that it's still in development, and according to beyond3d (http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/r520/index2.php?p=21) we'll shortly be seeing a patch that allows HDR and AA...seems pretty relevant and important to me (maybe you should ask anand why he still benches with it )...

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001
Let me post my latest post from the other thread...:

Just an update - I was playing more FarCry earlier (on mp_radio) and I was getting tons of random slowdowns to under 10fps, other times it would be right back at 60. It was unplayable, really (it was under 10 a lot more than it was close to 60). When I set it back to the default of 2, framerates jumped back up to 60 solid. So, unless something else in my config has changed, I think that shadow setting isn't a real fix...

Of course it's not. That's why I said it's a bandaid fix. Doesn't really solve the problem of the gaping, infected wound, just covers it up.

Now Jeff, do you really think shadows being blocky in a year and a half old game can be described as a "gaping, infected wound", especially when editing the config file makes them better?

Hyperbole?

IMO everything being rendered black and white merits your description, this could be described as a nuisance?

And what about shadows? Is it a "gaping, infected wound" that ATI cards can't render the soft stencil shadows in games like Riddick? I play Riddick with soft shadows, poor ATI owners have to look at hard edges on their shadows- shadows don't have a hard edge Jeff.

You don't see me on hear making huge threads "When will ATI card be able to render Riddicks Shadows properly, as programmed?"

This whole "blocky shadows of Far Cry" thing is bullsh*t, a mountain out of a molehill, people who want to flame nVidia picking a trivial nuisance and playing it up like it was the end of the world. Pretty sad.

Nobody's flaming nVidia... well... I can't speak for everyone. I'm not flaming nVidia... I just want the issue fixed since I have an nVidia graphics card.

As far as your comparison between Riddick and Far Cry, there's a difference between the two, Rollo. I'm surprised you can't see that. It's a fact that ATI GPU's cannot render soft shadows in Riddick. Everyone is aware of it, aknowledges it, and nobody denies it. However, neither nVidia nor Crytek haven't even aknowledged a difference in the way shadows are rendered in Far Cry. A week later, nVidia has not even answered the guys over at The Inquirer. You would think they might at least say "we're looking into it." But no... nothing.

The gaping wound is the failure of the community to recognize this and ask why it is the way it is in the past... lets see... 19 months.

I want quality graphics and I want smooth graphics. Ideally, I want them both at the same time. But we can't always have our cake and eat it too. If I want to give up performance to have correctly rendered shadows, I want the choice. If I want performance at the expense of shadow quality, I want the choice. I don't have a choice in this case... I can make it better... but I can't "fix" it.

I'm really surprised to see that this is your opinion, Rollo. It seems that you're upset that this issue was brought into the open. You don't have any problem bringing up ATI rendering problems and lack of features. You seem to like soft shadows so much, I'm surprised you're not disappointed that your card SHOULD be rendering soft shadows in Far Cry and it's not. Maybe there is something to what people say about you, that you're a fanboy. But I don't think you're necessarily brand loyal. I think you're loyal to your purchase and feel the need to defend it, whatever it is, when anyone brings up an issue that might make your purchase seem like less than the best. That to me, is pretty sad.

 

[Qbah]

@ Rollo

In Riddick in does say the 2.0++ mode is for Series 6 and beyond GF cards only. And as far as I know, Riddick is the only game that uses that (talking bout being nV friendly, eh?). But let me stress it once more... They clearly SAY that this is ONLY for GF Series 6+ cards.

Both Ati and nVidia can draw regular PS2.0 graphics. Which look the same (read: nice). 2.0++ is a special mode... And saying mode 2.0 looks crap is total BS. The game looks sweet. The shadows are drawn like in every 3D game. But the blocky shadows in FarCray vs the regular shadows in FarCry are like earth and heaven. How can you even compare that?

I don't know what rig you're playing on, but on mine 2.0++ drops the fps to mid 20s low 30s. Yes, I own a 7800GT.

One thing that saddens me is that there are more and more applications that get this 'shadow issue'. On both Ati and nVidia (like WoW - yuck!). There's no way in a million years Blizz would create an engine that draws shadows like that... ever. Believe me, in places like 1000 needles this looks really bad. Third test in 3DMark05 on nVidia cards too.

But then again, I might be an IQ whore. Still makers me wonder, why can shadows look nice in one game and utterly crappy in another...

EDIT I just saw your sig... X2 wiith SLi 7800GTX. Nice. No wonder it plays fine. No wonder you defend that ~1000$ purchase