$9,000,000,000,000 MISSING From The Federal Reserve

[fskimospy]

You are the one wound up and throwing out insults and name calling, bro.

You are just humilating yourself since I used your own source to prove you wrong.

You don't see the problem with saying a source is untrustworthy and then attempting to use it as a source to prove someone else wrong?

Seriously, this argument is embarrassing.

 

[alkemyst]

You don't see the problem with saying a source is untrustworthy and then attempting to use it as a source to prove someone else wrong?

Seriously, this argument is embarrassing.

I didn't say Bloomberg was untrustworthy though. I said there are many sources we trust that are indeed not.

Bloomberg I am sure has certain writers that embellish/lie/etc. For the most part I don't have a problem with them. However; they don't report on a lot of the things at do get mentioned overseas at ground zero.

Sadly most americans thing any arab or muslim is functionally literate and are all terrorists.

 

[alkemyst]

This is the problem, you didn't prove anything. All you proved was that in some cases the government may be lying. You didn't prove they were lying in this case. Thus your logical fallacy is that since they lie sometimes they are lying now and no piece of evidence can contradict you.

There isn't a single person posting that agrees with you. What does that tell you?

In your world it tells you you are smarter than everybody. In the real world it tells us you are a moron.

I have never stated the $9,000,000,000 was totally factual. I stated at this time we really don't know for sure, no one even knows the source of the real start of this rumor and if it had any credit.

But to get back to where I was going with all this, so do you agree our government lies to us? Isn't that part of the definition of a conspiracy?

More name calling, more speaking for the 'people' here, more anger.

 

[LegendKiller]

I have never stated the $9,000,000,000 was totally factual. I stated at this time we really don't know for sure, no one even knows the source of the real start of this rumor and if it had any credit.

But to get back to where I was going with all this, so do you agree our government lies to us? Isn't that part of the definition of a conspiracy?

More name calling, more speaking for the 'people' here, more anger.

Anybody who does any serious investigation knows that the $9tr is not real, at all. There is no basis in reality for it to be true. We know what the $9tr was, I have shown you and I know personally. I have explained time and again why it is false, yet you refuse to listen to anything and only present logical fallacies.

 

[alkemyst]

Anybody who does any serious investigation knows that the $9tr is not real, at all. There is no basis in reality for it to be true. We know what the $9tr was, I have shown you and I know personally. I have explained time and again why it is false, yet you refuse to listen to anything and only present logical fallacies.

Again, you are missing my argument since you cannot even think clearly when replying to me as you are focused on attacking me and not reading what I am saying.

I feel you put way to much credit in what you are told by your beneviolent leaders.

All in all, the US just keeps not only printing money and raising the debt ceiling, but also lends it, gives it away and at the same time is selling that debt to other nations (some of which are not really our allies).

What happens to the US if every nation wants to be paid in full?

 

[LegendKiller]

Again, you are missing my argument since you cannot even think clearly when replying to me as you are focused on attacking me and not reading what I am saying.

I feel you put way to much credit in what you are told by your beneviolent leaders.

All in all, the US just keeps not only printing money and raising the debt ceiling, but also lends it, gives it away and at the same time is selling that debt to other nations (some of which are not really our allies).

What happens to the US if every nation wants to be paid in full?

I know what your argument is, but it doesn't apply here. I *KNOW* that $9tr isn't "missing" from the Fed, I have proven it, I have seen it, I know it. You, on the other hand, go off on tangential discussions and doubt it just to doubt it, not even looking at the preponderance of evidence and making a logical conclusion. This is why you are a loser in life.

So let's stop conflating the two issues and just focus on your moronic tangential discussion. You double down on the stupid and say "what if every nation wants to be paid in full" and don't even consider the facts.

1. The bonds have a fixed maturity and are not callable, thus, they cannot demand to be paid in full today.

2. Even if they were callable they cannot do that. Take China, for example, where would they put all of the money they got from redeeming US treasuries? They cannot move it into any other currency without crushing the USD. If they crush the USD their own currency, which is mostly tied to the USD, would either have to also get crushed (on a factor of ~7:1) which would cause massive economic upheaval and eventual overthrow of the government, or would cause an economic collapse since the US, China's largest trading partner, wouldn't demand their products anymore because they would cost too much. This would toss tens of millions of Chinese into unemployment, eventually causing a government overthrow.

You see, the debt isn't our problem, it is THEIR problem. We could default on the debt today and it would hurt them far more than it would hurt us.

And what can they do to us if we default? Force a repayment? With what? Their isn't a country on this planet that can force us to pay their debts and they know it. Furthermore, they know they can't dump the bonds without ruining their country.

And you know what the kicker is? In order for their countries to grow and keep running the trade deficits they are running they *HAVE* to buy our assets. Since they learned from the Japanese that buying our real estate isn't a great idea and we block them from owning most big US companies they can really only buy US Treasuries.

It's a Chinese finger trap. The more they try to pull apart the tighter the trap gets.

As Keynes said...

If you owe your bank a hundred pounds, you have a problem. But if you owe a million, it has.


Then you add in QE, which I firmly believe was a dual purpose system. The first purpose was to make their currency cause domestic inflation, the second was to lower rates. This has resulted in their inflation increasing faster and causing wages to moderate far quicker than they would have liked.

China, ultimately, cannot achieve the same wealth we have, per capita. I firmly agree with Mish on that. There simply isn't enough energy on the planet to raise that entire population out of poverty. At least not enough at a cheap enough price to make it possible.

You see, this is why I laugh at your pitiable attempts to debate this issue. You simply have not done any research and lack the mental capacity to do so. You highlight that by conflating the issues. Further, you think you are being cool by doubting everything when, in fact, you just can't admit that you need to do research. Rather than listening and learning, what every intelligent, but inexperienced, person does, you keep going on your idiotic paths like a little child. This is why I just bore of trying to show you the way but just throw your lack of intellectual capacity in your face.

However, if I am wrong, and you actually do have a triple digit IQ, then you probably should just shut your piehole and listen, or ask questions rather than proposing answers or logical fallacies and strawmen.

But let's see your reply. If you pose another logical fallacy we know you lack a high IQ. If you ask questions about anything I said above, I am wrong about your intellectual capacity and we can actually have an interesting discussion.

The choice is yours.

 

[TerryMathews]

I know what your argument is, but it doesn't apply here. I *KNOW* that $9tr isn't "missing" from the Fed, I have proven it, I have seen it, I know it. You, on the other hand, go off on tangential discussions and doubt it just to doubt it, not even looking at the preponderance of evidence and making a logical conclusion. This is why you are a loser in life.

So let's stop conflating the two issues and just focus on your moronic tangential discussion. You double down on the stupid and say "what if every nation wants to be paid in full" and don't even consider the facts.

1. The bonds have a fixed maturity and are not callable, thus, they cannot demand to be paid in full today.

2. Even if they were callable they cannot do that. Take China, for example, where would they put all of the money they got from redeeming US treasuries? They cannot move it into any other currency without crushing the USD. If they crush the USD their own currency, which is mostly tied to the USD, would either have to also get crushed (on a factor of ~7:1) which would cause massive economic upheaval and eventual overthrow of the government, or would cause an economic collapse since the US, China's largest trading partner, wouldn't demand their products anymore because they would cost too much. This would toss tens of millions of Chinese into unemployment, eventually causing a government overthrow.

You see, the debt isn't our problem, it is THEIR problem. We could default on the debt today and it would hurt them far more than it would hurt us.

And what can they do to us if we default? Force a repayment? With what? Their isn't a country on this planet that can force us to pay their debts and they know it. Furthermore, they know they can't dump the bonds without ruining their country.

And you know what the kicker is? In order for their countries to grow and keep running the trade deficits they are running they *HAVE* to buy our assets. Since they learned from the Japanese that buying our real estate isn't a great idea and we block them from owning most big US companies they can really only buy US Treasuries.

It's a Chinese finger trap. The more they try to pull apart the tighter the trap gets.

As Keynes said...

If you owe your bank a hundred pounds, you have a problem. But if you owe a million, it has.


Then you add in QE, which I firmly believe was a dual purpose system. The first purpose was to make their currency cause domestic inflation, the second was to lower rates. This has resulted in their inflation increasing faster and causing wages to moderate far quicker than they would have liked.

China, ultimately, cannot achieve the same wealth we have, per capita. I firmly agree with Mish on that. There simply isn't enough energy on the planet to raise that entire population out of poverty. At least not enough at a cheap enough price to make it possible.

You see, this is why I laugh at your pitiable attempts to debate this issue. You simply have not done any research and lack the mental capacity to do so. You highlight that by conflating the issues. Further, you think you are being cool by doubting everything when, in fact, you just can't admit that you need to do research. Rather than listening and learning, what every intelligent, but inexperienced, person does, you keep going on your idiotic paths like a little child. This is why I just bore of trying to show you the way but just throw your lack of intellectual capacity in your face.

However, if I am wrong, and you actually do have a triple digit IQ, then you probably should just shut your piehole and listen, or ask questions rather than proposing answers or logical fallacies and strawmen.

But let's see your reply. If you pose another logical fallacy we know you lack a high IQ. If you ask questions about anything I said above, I am wrong about your intellectual capacity and we can actually have an interesting discussion.

The choice is yours.

There's an old bankers proverb: if you owe the bank $100, they own you. If you owe the bank $1m, you own them.

Just adjust it for scale.

 

[LegendKiller]

There's an old bankers proverb: if you owe the bank $100, they own you. If you owe the bank $1m, you own them.

Just adjust it for scale.

I already said that above

 

[Kougar]

Interesting video that makes me curious to know the answer.... on the other hand, given the sheer volume of money The Fed handles in the daily marketplace, this isn't an obscene number at all.

Hmm, and look what a quick Googling found: http://money.cnn.com/2010/12/01/news/economy/fed_reserve_data_release/index.htm Apparently the person in the video asking the questions didn't understand how the system works, and was just reacting to alarmist articles.

For a lot of the posts though, it helps to actually check facts. It's ridiculous how people just assume they know how the system works. The US Treasury is responsible for printing money, not The Federal Reserve. The Fed therefore has no ability to dictate anything regarding the production and printing of US money.

The Fed is however used as a distribution network for physical currency, through its regional branches and on to local area banks to enter circulation. It also takes bills out of circulation through these regional branches and handles shredding them on site. I have a tiny bag of $100 in shredded $20's on my bookshelf from the local reserve branch.

 

[LegendKiller]

Interesting video that makes me curious to know the answer.... on the other hand, given the sheer volume of money The Fed handles in the daily marketplace, this isn't an obscene number at all.

Hmm, and look what a quick Googling found: http://money.cnn.com/2010/12/01/news/economy/fed_reserve_data_release/index.htm Apparently the person in the video asking the questions didn't understand how the system works, and was just reacting to alarmist articles.

For a lot of the posts though, it helps to actually check facts. It's ridiculous how people just assume they know how the system works. The US Treasury is responsible for printing money, not The Federal Reserve. The Fed therefore has no ability to dictate anything regarding the production and printing of US money.

The Fed is however used as a distribution network for physical currency, through its regional branches and on to local area banks to enter circulation. It also takes bills out of circulation through these regional branches and handles shredding them on site. I have a tiny bag of $100 in shredded $20's on my bookshelf from the local reserve branch.

This is actually incorrect. The Federal Reserve prints bills, that is why they are called Federal Reserve Notes. They can be redeemed at any FRB or the US Treasury but are ultimately liabilities of the Federal Reserve Bank system. Each central bank around the world has a balance sheet of assets and liabilities, FRNs are liabilities of the FRB while its assets are bonds.

You can see its balance sheet here.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/monet..._balance_sheet_developments_report_201308.pdf

 

[alkemyst]

I know what your argument is, but it doesn't apply here. I *KNOW* that $9tr isn't "missing" from the Fed, I have proven it, I have seen it, I know it. You, on the other hand, go off on tangential discussions and doubt it just to doubt it, not even looking at the preponderance of evidence and making a logical conclusion. This is why you are a loser in life.

So let's stop conflating the two issues and just focus on your moronic tangential discussion. You double down on the stupid and say "what if every nation wants to be paid in full" and don't even consider the facts.

1. The bonds have a fixed maturity and are not callable, thus, they cannot demand to be paid in full today.

2. Even if they were callable they cannot do that. Take China, for example, where would they put all of the money they got from redeeming US treasuries? They cannot move it into any other currency without crushing the USD. If they crush the USD their own currency, which is mostly tied to the USD, would either have to also get crushed (on a factor of ~7:1) which would cause massive economic upheaval and eventual overthrow of the government, or would cause an economic collapse since the US, China's largest trading partner, wouldn't demand their products anymore because they would cost too much. This would toss tens of millions of Chinese into unemployment, eventually causing a government overthrow.

You see, the debt isn't our problem, it is THEIR problem. We could default on the debt today and it would hurt them far more than it would hurt us.

And what can they do to us if we default? Force a repayment? With what? Their isn't a country on this planet that can force us to pay their debts and they know it. Furthermore, they know they can't dump the bonds without ruining their country.

And you know what the kicker is? In order for their countries to grow and keep running the trade deficits they are running they *HAVE* to buy our assets. Since they learned from the Japanese that buying our real estate isn't a great idea and we block them from owning most big US companies they can really only buy US Treasuries.

It's a Chinese finger trap. The more they try to pull apart the tighter the trap gets.

As Keynes said...

If you owe your bank a hundred pounds, you have a problem. But if you owe a million, it has.


Then you add in QE, which I firmly believe was a dual purpose system. The first purpose was to make their currency cause domestic inflation, the second was to lower rates. This has resulted in their inflation increasing faster and causing wages to moderate far quicker than they would have liked.

China, ultimately, cannot achieve the same wealth we have, per capita. I firmly agree with Mish on that. There simply isn't enough energy on the planet to raise that entire population out of poverty. At least not enough at a cheap enough price to make it possible.

You see, this is why I laugh at your pitiable attempts to debate this issue. You simply have not done any research and lack the mental capacity to do so. You highlight that by conflating the issues. Further, you think you are being cool by doubting everything when, in fact, you just can't admit that you need to do research. Rather than listening and learning, what every intelligent, but inexperienced, person does, you keep going on your idiotic paths like a little child. This is why I just bore of trying to show you the way but just throw your lack of intellectual capacity in your face.

However, if I am wrong, and you actually do have a triple digit IQ, then you probably should just shut your piehole and listen, or ask questions rather than proposing answers or logical fallacies and strawmen.

But let's see your reply. If you pose another logical fallacy we know you lack a high IQ. If you ask questions about anything I said above, I am wrong about your intellectual capacity and we can actually have an interesting discussion.

The choice is yours.

Dude you don't work for the Fed in any capacity to say this especially when you just agreed publically with TerryMathews the money game.

 

[LegendKiller]

Dude you don't work for the Fed in any capacity to say this especially when you just agreed publically with TerryMathews the money game.

I knew it, I knew you couldn't even think about asking questions or debating the post, you are too stupid to do it. Thanks for proving me correct, again. I shot down your conflated argument and proved you didn't even know that they can't "call" the debt. It's simple logic, they *HAVE* to hold it. But you don't get simple logic, do you?

Dude, you don't even have the capacity to stay in a marriage, own a house, own a nice car or raise through the ranks in life. You are some middle aged loser who lives in shithole FL that picks up loser women. You can't even comprehend half of what I post, let alone judge whether I know what I am talking about.

MIT? ROFL.

 

[alkemyst]

I knew it, I knew you couldn't even think about asking questions or debating the post, you are too stupid to do it. Thanks for proving me correct, again. I shot down your conflated argument and proved you didn't even know that they can't "call" the debt. It's simple logic, they *HAVE* to hold it. But you don't get simple logic, do you?

Dude, you don't even have the capacity to stay in a marriage, own a house, own a nice car or raise through the ranks in life. You are some middle aged loser who lives in shithole FL that picks up loser women. You can't even comprehend half of what I post, let alone judge whether I know what I am talking about.

MIT? ROFL.

I did skim it. You have no clue, but just research basic facts to make you seem knowledgeable.

You are just talking out your self-proclaimed pedigree ass.

I am done with you since you don't debate you just call names. Just like above.

More personal attack and name calling doesn't make you important.

Stay angry.

 

[alkemyst]

BTW I never had to live in a shithole like you did in 2004.

I see how it makes you angry.

 

[LegendKiller]

I did skim it. You have no clue, but just research basic facts to make you seem knowledgeable.

You are just talking out your self-proclaimed pedigree ass.

I am done with you since you don't debate you just call names. Just like above.

More personal attack and name calling doesn't make you important.

Stay angry.

I gave you the perfect opportunity to learn and you still fuck it up (like everything else in your life). You didn't even know the debt couldn't be called. You didn't even know the Fed could be subject to an FOI. You don't know anything.

 

[LegendKiller]

BTW I never had to live in a shithole like you did in 2004.

I see how it makes you angry.

No, your shithole has a $20 K-mart mirror, a shitty nightstand and a crappy tile job. Dude, you're in your 40s and pretend you're a baller but you still lived in a pretty much foreclosed on shithole in FL. You also lost your car and your wife.

Don't make yourself any more of a joke than you already are. Just bow out of the thread. I won't even ask you to admit you don't know what you are talking about.

Just stop the both of you with the personal thread derailing stuff. Take it to PM and insult each other all you want.
admin allisolm

 

[TerryMathews]

I already said that above

Ah yes, I do see it in there now. :beer:

 

[KlokWyze]

Nice post explaining the debt game LK. Breaks it down nicely.

 

[alkemyst]

I knew it, I knew you couldn't even think about asking questions or debating the post, you are too stupid to do it. Thanks for proving me correct, again. I shot down your conflated argument and proved you didn't even know that they can't "call" the debt. It's simple logic, they *HAVE* to hold it. But you don't get simple logic, do you?

Dude, you don't even have the capacity to stay in a marriage, own a house, own a nice car or raise through the ranks in life. You are some middle aged loser who lives in shithole FL that picks up loser women. You can't even comprehend half of what I post, let alone judge whether I know what I am talking about.

MIT? ROFL.

So Florida is a shithole and you don't pick up losers?

You want to keep resorting to personal attacks and digging up information?


oh and stay angry!

I guess Florida was a shithole to you:


Please keep L&R private. Please focus on topics not posters.

 

[alkemyst]

No, your shithole has a $20 K-mart mirror, a shitty nightstand and a crappy tile job. Dude, you're in your 40s and pretend you're a baller but you still lived in a pretty much foreclosed on shithole in FL. You also lost your car and your wife.

Don't make yourself any more of a joke than you already are. Just bow out of the thread. I won't even ask you to admit you don't know what you are talking about.

I had two cars actually, I had a 2012 Mazda 3 GT that was still upside down and a 2006 M3 ZCP with about $10k in equity. I had to sell a car in the divorce.

Since you are such a baller, please post up your life and all that coward.

You are backed in a corner now and spouting off dogma about the national debt for the company you work for.

 

[LegendKiller]

So Florida is a shithole and you don't pick up losers?

You want to keep resorting to personal attacks and digging up information?

Here is some of your's:


oh and stay angry!

I guess Florida was a shithole to you:



Please keep L&R private. Please focus on topics not posters.

Yes, FL was a shithole, hence us moving from there quickly.

I am far from angry, I think it's laughable.

 

[LegendKiller]

I had two cars actually, I had a 2012 Mazda 3 GT that was still upside down and a 2006 M3 ZCP with about $10k in equity. I had to sell a car in the divorce.

Since you are such a baller, please post up your life and all that coward.

You are backed in a corner now and spouting off dogma about the national debt for the company you work for.

Backed into a corner? I'm not speaking for my company at all, but nice try.

It's hardly dogma, it's fact, but do keep it up chuckles.

 

[alkemyst]

no, bro you are angry.

It's unfortunate you CFA's don't have debate classes.

Calling names and such is so not allowed and low brow.

Please refrain from fucking with my family and private life.

 

[LegendKiller]

no, bro you are angry.

It's unfortunate you CFA's don't have debate classes.

Calling names and such is so not allowed and low brow.

Please refrain from fucking with my family and private life.

It's unfortunate you have no debate skills at all. You just go around and around in some moronic logical fallacy to make yourself seem smart.

 

[alkemyst]

It's unfortunate you have no debate skills at all. You just go around and around in some moronic logical fallacy to make yourself seem smart but really you're just a loser.

I guess I touched a nerve, eh, that you need to stalk me? Poor little baby, posts in OT about his silly life, posts his shit house, and then expects nobody to call him out on the fact that he really doesn't have an intelligent leg to stand on. Who is mad now, bro, that you had to stalk?

lol you cried to the mods about me.