4070 reviews thread

[Heartbreaker]

Sure you can do that six months later, but not after six days. Do you want your loyal customers who bought at the original price to feel like the [female dogs] that they are? Maybe you can give them a voucher they can redeem at NV HQ to have JHH spit in their mouths.

An announced price cut after six days is a sign of weakness to investors. A reduction in price results in increased sales regardless. People are still interested in the new card and search for a 4070 and hey, here's one that's $50 cheaper, I'll get that one.

It will be obvious if there is a cut by NVidia because it will be across the brands at all the retailers. Not something like a gift card from Microcenter.

It reminds me of all the times there is a news story of Intel dropping CPU prices, then you look and it's just a Microcenter sale...

 

[Ranulf]

Nvidia reportedly in talks of limiting production of 4070, "sales are not good".... via wccftech originally so standard disclaimer.

NVIDIA Reportedly in Talks to Limit Production of GeForce RTX 4070: "Sales Are Not Good" - The FPS Review

NVIDIA is planning to limit the production of the GeForce RTX 4070 because it isn't selling as good as the company had anticipated, according to a report stemming from a user on the Chinese Board Channel Forums. While it's unclear how true this actually is, NVIDIA critics continue to point out...

www.thefpsreview.com

 

[MrTeal]

Sure you can do that six months later, but not after six days. Do you want your loyal customers who bought at the original price to feel like the [female dogs] that they are? Maybe you can give them a voucher they can redeem at NV HQ to have JHH spit in their mouths.

An announced price cut after six days is a sign of weakness to investors. A reduction in price results in increased sales regardless. People are still interested in the new card and search for a 4070 and hey, here's one that's $50 cheaper, I'll get that one.

Basically what happened when some AIBs gave launch buyers refunds when the GTX 280 dropped $150 right after launch when the 4870 launched at less than half the price and ate its lunch.

$100 Steam GC is actually pretty close to a real $100 value. It's leagues better than the $40 value they claim for the Overwatch 2 battle pass that gets you some outfits or something in a game you may or may not play or care about.

 

[Ranulf]

Worse, its not $40 in the US, its $30 on Bnet so NE etc. has it wrong on their item listings.

 

[Kocicak]

Literally 6 days later, 100$ price cut: https://videocardz.com/newz/us-reta...steam-gift-cards-with-all-geforce-rtx-40-gpus

And btw just came here to tell, I don't agree with 99% of stuff that you say. And the difference between 200W and 400W GPU is not that big, if the cooler on the 400W gpu is quiet....

It is not a price cut, it is a bonus given by ONE retailer in ONE country on all RTX 4000 cards.

Are you kidding? Difference between 200 and 400 is freaking TWO FOLD. Noise is just a byproduct of higher power draw.

 

[coercitiv]

It is not a price cut, it is a bonus given by ONE retailer in ONE country on all RTX 4000 cards.

Reminds me of someone who was using numbers from ONE retailer, in ONE country, to argue the 4070 is selling fine.

 

[coercitiv]

This is what I am talking about. Read the comments. The push back on this card is strooooong. I think nvidia might have actually overplayed their hand.

This is the reverse crypto moment, gamers have learned to HODL.

There will be nasty moments in the future though. Watch as game studios will start taking the heat for releasing games with higher and higher system requirements. The crowd is a finicky beast. AMD better learn from what is happening right now, although knowing RTG... they wouldn't spot a warning shot even if it hit them in the head.

 

[Kocicak]

Reminds me of someone who was using numbers from ONE retailer, in ONE country, to argue the 4070 is selling fine.

I simply offered a counterargument to a view of somebody that 4070 are not selling at all, that there is a case, in which 4070 are the second most selling cards behind 3060, you can clearly see how I got the data and you can make your own conclusion about their validity. That is all.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Reminds me of someone who was using numbers from ONE retailer, in ONE country, to argue the 4070 is selling fine.

Not quite the same thing, if someone says they aren't selling and you do a random snapshot and can see them selling to counters that point, and presumably unless that location is special, they are also selling elsewhere.

But an actual price cut would involve more than one retailer and would be readily obvious.

This is the reverse crypto moment, gamers have learned to HODL.

I doubt it.

Crypto mining boom has taught us most humans have little ability to postpone buying when they want something.

If people could hold off, scalpers wouldn't have been getting rich selling GPUs for 2X-3X MSRP.

It's more that there really isn't much demand for GPUs at all right now due to a variety of economic and social factors is likely putting a marked damper on discretionary GPU spending.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Amazon Best Seller list top ten, right now. Slightly more useful than a short window snapshot at a smaller retailer:

Amazon Best Sellers: Best Computer Graphics Cards

Discover the best Computer Graphics Cards in Best Sellers. Find the top 100 most popular items in Amazon Computers & Accessories Best Sellers.

www.amazon.com

#1 3060
#2 3060
#3 4070
#4 3060 Ti
#5 4070
#6 RX 6600
#7 4070 Ti
#8 3060
#9 RX 580
#10 6700 XT

Though all this tells us is that they are selling, but it tells us nothing much beyond that, and nothing about how much GPU sales are down...

While there is no major rush on, It looks to me, like they haven't been shunned either, similar thing has been happening with 4070 Ti all along when I checked.

I expect NVidia isn't happy with sales, but they haven't stalled enough for them to price cut them. They will just limit product while they stock draws down, and NVidia shifts production to 4060[Ti] to stuff that part of the channel.

 

[Kocicak]

This is the reverse crypto moment, gamers have learned to HODL.

You mean yodl? Or yodle?

...

While there is no major rush on, It looks to me, like they haven't been shunned either, similar thing has been happening with 4070 Ti all along when I checked.

I expect NVidia isn't happy with sales, but they haven't stalled enough for them to price cut them. ...

And what about all those remainders of 3000 series in the supply channel and in the retailer warehouses? Would not dropping price of 4070 disrupt sale of these cards considerably?

I believe that Nvidia do not care at all how slowly are 4070 selling in the first few weeks/months of possibly 2 year sale period of these cards. There is probably a lot of 3070 and 3080 cards that need to be sold first.

 

[Heartbreaker]

And what about all those remainders of 3000 series in the supply channel and in the retailer warehouses? Would not dropping price of 4070 disrupt sale of these cards considerably?

I believe that Nvidia do not care at all how slowly are 4070 selling in the first few weeks/months of possibly 2 year sale period of these cards. There is probably a lot of 3070 and 3080 cards that need to be sold first.

What 3000 series remainders?

I was checking stock regularly, and 3080+ have been cleared out for months now, by the clearance price cuts. Time Stamp where HWUB points that out:

There was never any price cuts on 3070 and below yet, since they aren't in the same performance range, there seemed to be no urgency.

IMO, it's a lesson, about how NVidia deals with oversupply and price cuts. They seldom seem to offer significant cuts until they have a replacement imminent, otherwise they seem content to let sales trickle overstock down. Perhaps closer to 4060 series release there will be some 3070 and below clearance attempt.

For 4070 I don't expect NVidia cuts until AMD competitors show up. Then NVidia might be forced to react, but I expect 4070 oversupply will be handled on the supply side, not the demand side.

 

[Kocicak]

What 3000 series remainders? I was checking stock regularly, and 3080+ have been cleared out for months now...

Oh. I had no idea.

I do not believe that any price cuts in the near future are likely, as 4070 will be sold for years and it is not yet clear, with what AMD comes up.

The rumors about Nvidia subsidizing the cards in the launch weeks in order to have enough supply at MRSP suggest, that the opposite is coming, price hikes.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Oh. I had no idea.

Easy to get the opposite impression, as people keep repeating the 3000 series over-supply like a mantra, even though it was cleared on the high end months ago.

The rumors about Nvidia subsidizing the cards in the launch weeks in order to have enough supply at MRSP suggest, that the opposite is coming, price hikes.

Those rumors are unfalsifiable noise of ZERO value. It's like me claiming a I have an invisible pink unicorn hovering in my backyard.

 

[Kocicak]

The more people from the more companies something involves, the more probability, that a rumor about that is true. Everybody knows from the nature of that "something" that other parties are involved and it makes no sense to release any false information.

The rumor above is of that kind and most likely true IMO.

 

[Heartbreaker]

The more people from the more companies something involves, the more probability, that a rumor about that is true.

That doesn't logically follow.

It's more likely that information leaks.

But it doesn't give any specific rumor more veracity.

 

[Aapje]

Crypto mining boom has taught us most humans have little ability to postpone buying when they want something.

If people could hold off, scalpers wouldn't have been getting rich selling GPUs for 2X-3X MSRP.

It's more that there really isn't much demand for GPUs at all right now due to a variety of economic and social factors is likely putting a marked damper on discretionary GPU spending.

How can you conclude this, unless you know how many cards went to miners and how many to gamers? These are not even distinct categories, with some gamers mining on their cards to earn back (part) of what they spent on it. Scalpers can just as easily sell to miners as to gamers, so their existence doesn't prove that gamers were still just as eager to buy these cards.

To somewhat accurately determine how elastic the market actually was, you need more information than we have.

Ultimately, your narrative just doesn't hold up to me at all when we these cards not selling out at launch, unlike pretty much every earlier generation. This is a clear indication that gamers are in fact holding off, or are simply exiting the discrete GPU market, for example by buying consoles (which were in low supply during the chip shortage days, but no longer).

 

[Heartbreaker]

Ultimately, your narrative just doesn't hold up to me at all when we these cards not selling out at launch, unlike pretty much every earlier generation. This is a clear indication that gamers are in fact holding off, or are simply exiting the discrete GPU market, for example by buying consoles (which were in low supply during the chip shortage days, but no longer).

No other launch period mirrors this one. We just had a 30% collapse in the PC market, and we have a lot of economic uncertainty, inflation, and recession fears. All discretionary spending is down.

Also I don't remember sell outs being that much of a problem before mining became a thing. The crazy situation getting RTX 3000 cards was NOT normal.

Here is a 970/980 owner thread from the day of Launch, and I'm many days after launch on page 5, with no real sign of sellout.

Page 5 - GTX 970/980 owners thread

Page 5 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

forums.anandtech.com

"For some reason Newegg Canada is price gouging. They are still around MSRP at Newegg America."

Page 10 now, and 10 days in. Now I saw the first "Can't find one message", then a few days later:

"Ah, stocking situation seems to have improved considerably @ Newegg. MSI Gaming, Gigabyte, "limit per customer 5 cards"."

So there were some rough patches after a week in, it was nothing like the crazy mining years getting a card back then.

 

[Aapje]

It still was normal before mining that cards were sold out for the first month or so. Not selling out on the very first day is quite bad.

We just had a 30% collapse in the PC market, and we have a lot of economic uncertainty, inflation, and recession fears. All discretionary spending is down.

Yes, and Nvidia is providing us with an unprecedented poor improvement in price/performance per generation.

When market conditions are tough, the normal response is to provide more value and accept temporarily lower margins, not to do the opposite.

 

[BFG10K]

Timestamped at the appropriate time.

Multiple independent sources confirm the 4070 is under-selling while RDNA2 sales are up.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Timestamped at the appropriate time.

Multiple independent sources confirm the 4070 is under-selling while RDNA2 sales are up.

MLID anecdotes. I posted Amazons best seller list yesterday, there were 2 4070s in the top 5, and ZERO AMD cards.

Amazon is probably the biggest volume seller of GPUs in the USA.

I'm not claiming these are selling great, but they are selling in significant numbers. Essentially it's mirroring the 4070 Ti launch. Units are moving, but nothing spectacular.

 

[Mopetar]

It will be obvious if there is a cut by NVidia because it will be across the brands at all the retailers. Not something like a gift card from Microcenter.

Even if every brand decides to pass the full $50 on to customers, NVidia has plausible deniability and can let investors pretend that the AIB partners initiated the price cuts. There won't be any market data to suggest NVidia lowered their own cut because it's all happened in the same financial quarter. Worst case is that they have to adjust guidance slightly if there's nothing else to offset the reduction in revenue or their own earlier projections were too optimistic.

If the rumors and reporting about NVidia's AIB partners being squeezed is true, I would imagine that most would try to hold on to that $50 or as much of it as they possibly can. Some would probably cut prices by $20 instead of the full $50 and you get a wide variety of products and price points that doesn't look like an official price cut.

 

[Aapje]

MLID anecdotes. I posted Amazons best seller list yesterday, there were 2 4070s in the top 5, and ZERO AMD cards.

It's just the current reality that the main competition to buying Nvidia cards is 'no buy,' rather than AMD.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Even if every brand decides to pass the full $50 on to customers....

Rumor with zero evidence.

Plus, if NVidia gives rebates to board partners, you would expect strings are attached.

Like last year when all the 3090 Ti's suddenly got a ~50% price cut at the same time. NVidia didn't just give hundreds of dollars per 3090 ti, to board partners and say, do what you want with the money. It's clearly attached to the price reductions, on those specific products to clear them out.

If they did that for 4070 because they were considered to be selling too slowly, then you would again expect similar strings aimed at reducing the price to spur sales.

 

[Kocicak]

The top two most selling cards at three largest czech retailers - 4 of them are 4070. Just saying...

If you are willing to pay certain amount of money for a new card and do not want old stuff, 4070 is now simply the only rational option.

AMD should at least announce, what are they going to do with it.