37 Children Dead - Latest Israeli Air Strike

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: GrGr

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: oO beetlejuice Oo
ThePresence you really need to stop kissing Israeli ass and open your eyes. You're so full of your own worthiness that I can smell the stench all the way here - and I'm on a different continent.

I don't know which continent you're on, but I imagine it's not in the mideast. I have lived there, I've experienced what goes on there. I've been at scenes of suicide bombings and seen a steaming human ribcage in an apple stand, have you? I've seen things and formed opinions from what I've seen, not relying on media biases as you seem to be.

Yeah, I am sure the millions of Israelis living in the Middle East have unbiased view on this matter just like you.

I never claimed to be unbiased. I think most of us are biased for one reason or another, whether we choose to recognize it or not. Yes, I am certainly biased and I know the reasons why I am biased all too well. So what? My point was in response to his. He asserted that my opinions are formed from media outlets. I disagree, I think his are certainly more likely to be formed that way then mine.

What is your point here?

My point is that your not relying on media doesn't give you more credibility than any one else because you are forming opinion based on your already biased views like you claimed.

Yes we don't live in the ME, and we relie on media, books (both current and historical) to form our opinion. But we can at least get our materials from variaty of different sources, some place have nothing to do with the conflicts, like most of the Asian countries for example.

I never said I was more credible. I was replying to what he was saying.
And don't think that Asian countries are unbiased. Every media source is biased, every last one, even if you think that htey don't have a dog in this show. Everyone has an agenda.

The job of the media is not to be unbiased. The agenda of the media is to scrutinize those in power and their agendas in order to keep the public informed of the agendas of the establishment (be it political, coorporate or military). Alas, critical thinking is the last thing US main stream media is interested in (or, at this point, capable of perhaps).

The job of the media is to report a story. Not pick and choose how to present it or run a story based on a bias.

 

[GrGr]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: GrGr

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: oO beetlejuice Oo
ThePresence you really need to stop kissing Israeli ass and open your eyes. You're so full of your own worthiness that I can smell the stench all the way here - and I'm on a different continent.

I don't know which continent you're on, but I imagine it's not in the mideast. I have lived there, I've experienced what goes on there. I've been at scenes of suicide bombings and seen a steaming human ribcage in an apple stand, have you? I've seen things and formed opinions from what I've seen, not relying on media biases as you seem to be.

Yeah, I am sure the millions of Israelis living in the Middle East have unbiased view on this matter just like you.

I never claimed to be unbiased. I think most of us are biased for one reason or another, whether we choose to recognize it or not. Yes, I am certainly biased and I know the reasons why I am biased all too well. So what? My point was in response to his. He asserted that my opinions are formed from media outlets. I disagree, I think his are certainly more likely to be formed that way then mine.

What is your point here?

My point is that your not relying on media doesn't give you more credibility than any one else because you are forming opinion based on your already biased views like you claimed.

Yes we don't live in the ME, and we relie on media, books (both current and historical) to form our opinion. But we can at least get our materials from variaty of different sources, some place have nothing to do with the conflicts, like most of the Asian countries for example.

I never said I was more credible. I was replying to what he was saying.
And don't think that Asian countries are unbiased. Every media source is biased, every last one, even if you think that htey don't have a dog in this show. Everyone has an agenda.

The job of the media is not to be unbiased. The agenda of the media is to scrutinize those in power and their agendas in order to keep the public informed of the agendas of the establishment (be it political, coorporate or military). Alas, critical thinking is the last thing US main stream media is interested in (or, at this point, capable of perhaps).

The job of the media is to report a story. Not pick and choose how to present it or run a story based on a bias.

Well since the government (the politicians) the coorporations and the military/Pentagon), for example, all serve their own agendas it is the agenda of the media to expose those agendas. To expose those agendas is reporting the real story. Otherwise you are just catapulting the propaganda.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: GrGr

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: GrGr

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: rchiu

Originally posted by: ThePresence

Originally posted by: oO beetlejuice Oo
ThePresence you really need to stop kissing Israeli ass and open your eyes. You're so full of your own worthiness that I can smell the stench all the way here - and I'm on a different continent.

I don't know which continent you're on, but I imagine it's not in the mideast. I have lived there, I've experienced what goes on there. I've been at scenes of suicide bombings and seen a steaming human ribcage in an apple stand, have you? I've seen things and formed opinions from what I've seen, not relying on media biases as you seem to be.

Yeah, I am sure the millions of Israelis living in the Middle East have unbiased view on this matter just like you.

I never claimed to be unbiased. I think most of us are biased for one reason or another, whether we choose to recognize it or not. Yes, I am certainly biased and I know the reasons why I am biased all too well. So what? My point was in response to his. He asserted that my opinions are formed from media outlets. I disagree, I think his are certainly more likely to be formed that way then mine.

What is your point here?

My point is that your not relying on media doesn't give you more credibility than any one else because you are forming opinion based on your already biased views like you claimed.

Yes we don't live in the ME, and we relie on media, books (both current and historical) to form our opinion. But we can at least get our materials from variaty of different sources, some place have nothing to do with the conflicts, like most of the Asian countries for example.

I never said I was more credible. I was replying to what he was saying.
And don't think that Asian countries are unbiased. Every media source is biased, every last one, even if you think that htey don't have a dog in this show. Everyone has an agenda.

The job of the media is not to be unbiased. The agenda of the media is to scrutinize those in power and their agendas in order to keep the public informed of the agendas of the establishment (be it political, coorporate or military). Alas, critical thinking is the last thing US main stream media is interested in (or, at this point, capable of perhaps).

The job of the media is to report a story. Not pick and choose how to present it or run a story based on a bias.

Well since the government (the politicians) the coorporations and the military/Pentagon), for example, all serve their own agendas it is the agenda of the media to expose those agendas. To expose those agendas is reporting the real story. Otherwise you are just catapulting the propaganda.

There is a fine line between reporting the real story and catapulting your own propaganda. Thus if media outlets actually reported the facts vs this idea their sole purpose is to fight the govt, I think we would have a better media in this country. They already come to the table with a bias, bias in "news" stories are bad.

Save it for the commentary and opinion section.

 

[Doboji]

can we get a reduction in the nested quoting please?

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: hysperion

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Doboji
...Quite frankly I'd rather kill Lebanese children than Israeli children...

Why? They are children, I don't think you can make the argument that the death of an Israeli child is worse than the death of a Lebanese child. What is it about this conflict that turns otherwise normal people into sociopaths?

You are missing the point... I'm not advocating the killing of children... I think anytime a child is killed regardless of where they come from it is a horrific tragedy of massive proportions.

War is evil and wrong...

But you have to realistically look at this conflict, and what is truly happening. Israel was attacked unprovoked in an attempt to bully Israel into releasing people who killed Israeli children.

What shall a country do under these circumstances... should they say... no we will not attack, because it is inevitable in this attack that innocent lebanese children will be killed?

Should they say instead we will release these people who killed our children... we shall allow the murderers of our children to go free, and thereby encourage our enemies to kill more of our children?

I say no... I say that as a country it is your responsibility to protect your own citizens first... to protect your own children first... You must strike back... you mast stand tall in the face of such an enemy EVEN IF IT MEANS THE INEVITABLE DEATH OF INNOCENTS. To do otherwise is to sacrifice your own children for the sake of someone elses.

In a just world, no children would have to die... in a just world Lebanese militants never would have crossed the border to kill Israeli children some 20 years ago, and thus there would be no prisoners in jails to justify Hezbollah's actions. But reality is reality... and it does noone any good to try and pretend that all children of all countries have equal priority to all countries...

I stand behind Israel in it's war effort... in spite of the horror of war... because I believe that IF Israel wins there will be more peace than if Hezbollah wins...

-Max

Based on a 72 year average lifespan in this country and the number of people living here.... 10,000+ people are dieing daily in our country alone. So forgive me for not caring about 35 located in the terrorist infested slum that southern Lebanon has become right now...........

So 9/11 was just an above average day, why get all worked up about it?

 

[Pandaren]

Then you concede that you don't really know what he is thinking.

Originally posted by: hysperionI don't have to read his mind- based on what he's written about the subject it's obvious he's an Arab apologist trying to gather support for his opinion by claiming "he thought the other side once, but".......a common ploy by people trying to make their argument appear stronger.............

It's either that or he's an idiot for dropping his support for a country based on one Army officer's words.......Although lets not kid ourselves, it's the former......

 

[Pandaren]

It is people like you who give the terrorists one more lousy excuse to attack the US>

Originally posted by: Richard Cranium
Yeah I agree, besides those children would probably grow up to be terrorists anyway so I say good riddance!

 

[hysperion]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: hysperion

Originally posted by: Doboji

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Doboji
...Quite frankly I'd rather kill Lebanese children than Israeli children...

Why? They are children, I don't think you can make the argument that the death of an Israeli child is worse than the death of a Lebanese child. What is it about this conflict that turns otherwise normal people into sociopaths?

You are missing the point... I'm not advocating the killing of children... I think anytime a child is killed regardless of where they come from it is a horrific tragedy of massive proportions.

War is evil and wrong...

But you have to realistically look at this conflict, and what is truly happening. Israel was attacked unprovoked in an attempt to bully Israel into releasing people who killed Israeli children.

What shall a country do under these circumstances... should they say... no we will not attack, because it is inevitable in this attack that innocent lebanese children will be killed?

Should they say instead we will release these people who killed our children... we shall allow the murderers of our children to go free, and thereby encourage our enemies to kill more of our children?

I say no... I say that as a country it is your responsibility to protect your own citizens first... to protect your own children first... You must strike back... you mast stand tall in the face of such an enemy EVEN IF IT MEANS THE INEVITABLE DEATH OF INNOCENTS. To do otherwise is to sacrifice your own children for the sake of someone elses.

In a just world, no children would have to die... in a just world Lebanese militants never would have crossed the border to kill Israeli children some 20 years ago, and thus there would be no prisoners in jails to justify Hezbollah's actions. But reality is reality... and it does noone any good to try and pretend that all children of all countries have equal priority to all countries...

I stand behind Israel in it's war effort... in spite of the horror of war... because I believe that IF Israel wins there will be more peace than if Hezbollah wins...

-Max

Based on a 72 year average lifespan in this country and the number of people living here.... 10,000+ people are dieing daily in our country alone. So forgive me for not caring about 35 located in the terrorist infested slum that southern Lebanon has become right now...........

So 9/11 was just an above average day, why get all worked up about it?

Who said I was? 99%+ of the people that claim to care can't name a single person that died from that attack anyways without looking it up........

 

[Jaskalas]

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/744426.html

The Israel Defense Forces indicated yesterday that it might not have been responsible for the deaths of at least 54 Lebanese, including 37 children , when a building bombed in an Israeli air strike in the village of Qana collapsed yesterday - but was unable to offer an alternative explanation.

There is an unexplained gap of about seven hours between the one Israeli air strike that hit the Qana building housing the civilians, which took place around 1 A.M. Sunday, and the first report that the building had collapsed, said the chief of staff of the Israel Air Force, Brigadier General Amir Eshel. Speaking at a press conference at the Kirya military complex in Tel Aviv last night, Eshel said that of three Israeli air strikes on Qana early Sunday, only the first strike hit the building in which the civilians were staying. The other two hit areas at least 400 meters away.

"I can't say whether the house collapsed at 12 A.M. or at 8 A.M.," said Eshel. "According to foreign press reports, and this is one of the reports we are relying on, the house collapsed at 8 A.M. We do not have testimony regarding the time of the collapse. If the house collapsed at 12 A.M., it is difficult for me to believe that they waited eight hours to evacuate it."

At first report of the eight hour gap, I was curious if it merely collapsed eight hours later due to the strike at midnight. Yet, even if it did do so because of that, now I have to ask why was that building not evacuated eight hours after being struck?

 

[GrGr]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/744426.html

The Israel Defense Forces indicated yesterday that it might not have been responsible for the deaths of at least 54 Lebanese, including 37 children , when a building bombed in an Israeli air strike in the village of Qana collapsed yesterday - but was unable to offer an alternative explanation.

There is an unexplained gap of about seven hours between the one Israeli air strike that hit the Qana building housing the civilians, which took place around 1 A.M. Sunday, and the first report that the building had collapsed, said the chief of staff of the Israel Air Force, Brigadier General Amir Eshel. Speaking at a press conference at the Kirya military complex in Tel Aviv last night, Eshel said that of three Israeli air strikes on Qana early Sunday, only the first strike hit the building in which the civilians were staying. The other two hit areas at least 400 meters away.

"I can't say whether the house collapsed at 12 A.M. or at 8 A.M.," said Eshel. "According to foreign press reports, and this is one of the reports we are relying on, the house collapsed at 8 A.M. We do not have testimony regarding the time of the collapse. If the house collapsed at 12 A.M., it is difficult for me to believe that they waited eight hours to evacuate it."

At first report of the eight hour gap, I was curious if it merely collapsed eight hours later due to the strike at midnight. Yet, even if it did do so because of that, now I have to ask why was that building not evacuated eight hours after being struck?

The missile that killed those children, most of them asleep in their pyjamas but some of them still up and playing, was marked: "For use on MK-84 Guided Bomb BSU-37-B". I.e it was US made, and dropped by the Israelis.

 

[Gaard]

Well- 35 less future hezbollah terrorists for my children to worry about.........

I don't make a lot of comments on the ME affairs. I'm not as knowledgable as others are, but I read up on it...the TV news (of course), online news, and yes, even here. But when assholes make comments like the above, I feel like I have to comment. It really only says that he's an asshole and nothing else.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: GrGr

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/744426.html

The Israel Defense Forces indicated yesterday that it might not have been responsible for the deaths of at least 54 Lebanese, including 37 children , when a building bombed in an Israeli air strike in the village of Qana collapsed yesterday - but was unable to offer an alternative explanation.

There is an unexplained gap of about seven hours between the one Israeli air strike that hit the Qana building housing the civilians, which took place around 1 A.M. Sunday, and the first report that the building had collapsed, said the chief of staff of the Israel Air Force, Brigadier General Amir Eshel. Speaking at a press conference at the Kirya military complex in Tel Aviv last night, Eshel said that of three Israeli air strikes on Qana early Sunday, only the first strike hit the building in which the civilians were staying. The other two hit areas at least 400 meters away.

"I can't say whether the house collapsed at 12 A.M. or at 8 A.M.," said Eshel. "According to foreign press reports, and this is one of the reports we are relying on, the house collapsed at 8 A.M. We do not have testimony regarding the time of the collapse. If the house collapsed at 12 A.M., it is difficult for me to believe that they waited eight hours to evacuate it."

At first report of the eight hour gap, I was curious if it merely collapsed eight hours later due to the strike at midnight. Yet, even if it did do so because of that, now I have to ask why was that building not evacuated eight hours after being struck?

The missile that killed those children, most of them asleep in their pyjamas but some of them still up and playing, was marked: "For use on MK-84 Guided Bomb BSU-37-B". I.e it was US made, and dropped by the Israelis.

They died when the building collapsed, which was some eight hours afterwards.

 

[blackangst1]

ya know what? They were fvcking warned. They knew the risks living in the same building as Hezz (hell, a good % of the population believes in the Hezz's cause anyway). So I feel no pity. They can all them martyrs, I call them stupid. Guess what. If youre at war, and a known enemy is living in your apartment...dont be so shocked when a missle comes visiting.

 

[Todd33]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
ya know what? They were fvcking warned. They knew the risks living in the same building as Hezz (hell, a good % of the population believes in the Hezz's cause anyway). So I feel no pity. They can all them martyrs, I call them stupid. Guess what. If youre at war, and a known enemy is living in your apartment...dont be so shocked when a missle comes visiting.

You don't sound all that different from al Quada when they talk about 911. Extremist on both sides make this planet and human affairs in general really sad.

 

[SpeedZealot369]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
ya know what? They were fvcking warned. They knew the risks living in the same building as Hezz (hell, a good % of the population believes in the Hezz's cause anyway). So I feel no pity. They can all them martyrs, I call them stupid. Guess what. If youre at war, and a known enemy is living in your apartment...dont be so shocked when a missle comes visiting.

Yepp, if Israel is so bloodthirsty, why are they warning civilians to leave before they drop bombs?

It's people that call what Israel is doing a "slaughter" and "wrong" and whatever else they can think of that make it hard to do what needs to be done.

Do you even know that about half of israeli's are leftists and think the same thing as you do? That these palastinians are innocent (which is arguable) and Israel is being wrong?

Either way, I've said this in other threads and I'll say it again, Israel is doing everyone a favor by engaging these terrorits. SHUT UP and say thank you. Yes civilians are dying but Israel does everything they can to minimize those deaths. Only targeting specifics, telling people that they're building will be bombed, etc

Hizballah wants you DEAD and won't stop until it achives that goal. Just let Israel take care of business.

Some interesting reads:

http://www.nysun.com/article/36717

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/184122.php

 

[CHOPPER GOD]

[/quote]

The job of the media is to report a story. Not pick and choose how to present it or run a story based on a bias.



[/quote]

Incorect..the TRUE job of 'the media' is to sell advertising time...trust me
I dont agree that it should be this way...but it is

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Todd33

Originally posted by: blackangst1
ya know what? They were fvcking warned. They knew the risks living in the same building as Hezz (hell, a good % of the population believes in the Hezz's cause anyway). So I feel no pity. They can all them martyrs, I call them stupid. Guess what. If youre at war, and a known enemy is living in your apartment...dont be so shocked when a missle comes visiting.

You don't sound all that different from al Quada when they talk about 911. Extremist on both sides make this planet and human affairs in general really sad.

Why do you call it extremist to want Hezbollah to surrender? I suppose FDR and Churchill were extremists in your view.

As for these civilians, when was the last time terrorists gave us leaflets letting us know they were at war with our military, that we were in a war zone, and that for our lives we should head out of town?

Oh, that's right. On 9/11 and in Northern Israel they didn't drop leaflets because their aim was to kill our civilians. To this day they continue to target us, and you want us to surrender to them?

 

[Skyclad1uhm1]

Originally posted by: IFICUDIWUD

Originally posted by: peachee
I've noticed something that is clear: Not one, not one of Israeli loyalists on this thread has ever expressed sympathy for the 37 dead children or the women. Not one.

Some have blamed the dead children and women.

Some have ignored it and tried to focus on why we should kill muslims for Israel. (more shocking violent murderous genocidal talk)

And then it became clear: These Israeli supporters are really inhuman socialpaths. They truly ignore the hypocrisy that somehow everyone should support Israeli murders and weep for only for Israeli casualties. It's like Israeli supporters don't care about anyone who isn't an Israeli.

Shocking clear ain't it? So, how does that make us non-Israeli supporters feel? What should we do about these socialpaths? Would you support them? Would you believe them?

So sad about the children.. Gotta kinda blame the parents.. Isreal told them 4 2 weeks they were gonna start destroying the rocket launcher hideouts... By the way it is a war. Unfortunatly people die

Most of those people do not have anywhere else to go. What should they do, walk out of the city and just sit in the hills with their children without food, medical care, shelter or anything to drink? Or should they go to one of the UN shelters which Israel is targetting?

Al Qaida has warned the US several times about any US citizen being a fair target. So if warning makes it OK then I guess the WTC attack was fair too? After all those people knew they could die if they stayed in the US, and after all the 'war on terrorism' is a war too.

Would Hitler have been right in his actions if a Jew had once tried to kill him or a friend of his? Killing civilians is a (war) crime, no matter how you call it. Whether it's a suicide bomber, artillery fire or an aerial bombardment.

 

[Jaskalas]

Most of those people do not have anywhere else to go.

Only point I can agree with. Yet, staying in a war zone is clearly not a viable option when they are being blown to bits. So maybe they need to consider the hardships waging war against Israel brings them and cast down Hezbollah.

Or should they go to one of the UN shelters which Israel is targetting?

Since when is an observational post a UN shelter? 😕

Al Qaida has warned the US several times about any US citizen being a fair target.

Excuse me; they said the world trade centers were in the middle of a war zone in a battle against our military? Oh, no?. they merely declared that they wish to kill every last one of us. You think that compares to Israel warning Lebanon that Hezbollah in southern Lebanon will be attacked? 😕

Do you suppose the Lebanese don?t know that their unconventional military has set up a war zone in their own homes? If so, what was the military target on 9/11, or the military target in Northern Israel this month?

I fail to see how you manage to draw that comparison, unless you care to continue.

Would Hitler have been right in his actions if a Jew had once tried to kill him or a friend of his?

No, but let?s not stop there.

I?ve got a better question, seeing as the Allies killed hundreds of thousands of innocents during WW2. Were we wrong in our actions to wage war?

So long as war is waged, innocents will die. I can guarantee you that. If we start it or not they will die. If we participate or not they will die. It is only when we fight for the end of aggression against us that the loss of innocent lives will end.

 

[Dari]

Israel lied about the Qana attack.

 

[Pacemaker]

I think Israel is only making things worse for themselves by retaliating with bombings and takeovers. All this does is make another generation of people who hate them and reinforcing the current generations attitudes.

The problem is rockets and suicide bombs cannot be tolorated, so something has to be done. I really wish that they had not thrown Israel "to the wolves" so to speak by putting them in the middle of a bunch of people who hate them, but nothing can be done about that now.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

I, for one, will not be surprised the next time we in the U.S. are hit. We can only be philosophical when the next attack on our soil occurs, since our government provides a proxy army with the munitions used to slaughter innocent children. Every mother and father affected is now a "terrorist". Who among us wouldn't be given the same circumstance?

 

[wiin]

Originally posted by: alien42

Originally posted by: TheSlamma

Originally posted by: Islamistani

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: novon
When the heck is the US going to say enough is enough? Israel seems to have a never ending bloodthirst.

Lol at the idea that Israel is bloodthirsty. Have you considered that they have been defending themselves against terrorists for decades? Have you considered that if the terrorists stopped attacking then Israel would stop fighting? Have you considered that if Israel stopped fighting, the terrorists would keep on attacking? Probably not. I bet you're perfectly happy with a short term ceasefire that does nothing to stop the flow of Hezbollah rockets into Israel.

Anyone who considers the murder of 37 children is/was an effort to stop Hezbollah is a total whackjob. Where exactly are the Hezbollah fighters, and/or their weaponry? All I see is 54 INNOCENT civilians dead.

All I see is finger pointing democrats like you with fingers pointed and no real idea of how to stop any wars. You are as bad as the christians who think all you need is Jesus and peace will just all of a sudden happen.

How about an actual idea to support your side instead of just "War is bad, STOP IT"

how many innocent people have died since the US failed to agree with the rest of the world last week by not agreeing to a cease fire? if condi would have said "war is bad, stop it" there would be fewer people dead on both sides.

The US did agree to a cease fire...in 2000. Did it work? Nope.

 

[tommywishbone]

Originally posted by: International Machine Consortium
I, for one, will not be surprised the next time we in the U.S. are hit. We can only be philosophical when the next attack on our soil occurs, since our government provides a proxy army with the munitions used to slaughter innocent children. Every mother and father affected is now a "terrorist". Who among us wouldn't be given the same circumstance?

Ouch. Absolutely true, but still... ouch.

 

[SpeedZealot369]

I don't understand. There ARE ALWAYS CIVILIAN CASUALITES IN WAR why are so many people complaining about this war specifically? Oh thats right - it's because Israel is invlolved..