29 years old and hitting the gym for the first time...

[Carson Dyle]

You are obviously well versed in training :sarcasm: Please don't talk about things you have no idea about. You may want to reread what I posted. You can very effectively get your cardio work in through weight training. Increase intensity/volume while decreasing rest periods between sets. This is better than doing what the vast majority of idiots do for cardio.... Half ass steady state cardio on an elliptical at level 1.

You can, but very few beginners are going to weight train like this. Certainly not by themselves.

 

[phucheneh]

Okay, so, this bickering aside:

I started doing squats today.

...yeah, I needed squats. I am a girly man. Three 10 rep sets with like a whopping 70 pounds and I'm walking funny. Not hurt, no pain...just...got that kinda rubber-bandy feeling in my hamstrings that is making my legs forget how to work properly.

I did get a bit of satisfaction from seeing a group of guys next to me squatting like 250-300lbs or more...about three inches. I at least tried to get my butt as damn close to the floor as I could.

On that note, I was experiencing one issue toward the end...I had no trouble keeping my ass in, but when I get tired, I...I kinda, like...fucking hula dance. :\ Seriously...my ass wants to shimmy back and forth as I push from the bottom of the rep. Being built like a spidermonkey kinda sucks.

I'm also going more for weight and slightly less reps on other things, and I gotta say, it feels good. My ass feels properly kicked today.

 

[Bock]

check out the bodybuilding forums. I found that site very useful when I started working out. They may be a bit juvenile but I found it motivating.

 

[z1ggy]

Okay, so, this bickering aside:

I started doing squats today.

...yeah, I needed squats. I am a girly man. Three 10 rep sets with like a whopping 70 pounds and I'm walking funny. Not hurt, no pain...just...got that kinda rubber-bandy feeling in my hamstrings that is making my legs forget how to work properly.

I did get a bit of satisfaction from seeing a group of guys next to me squatting like 250-300lbs or more...about three inches. I at least tried to get my butt as damn close to the floor as I could.

On that note, I was experiencing one issue toward the end...I had no trouble keeping my ass in, but when I get tired, I...I kinda, like...fucking hula dance. :\ Seriously...my ass wants to shimmy back and forth as I push from the bottom of the rep. Being built like a spidermonkey kinda sucks.

I'm also going more for weight and slightly less reps on other things, and I gotta say, it feels good. My ass feels properly kicked today.

Fire out of the hole (bottom part of the squat) using your glutes.

And yeah, bro's are gunna bro. They think moving large amounts of weight 3 inches makes them cool/strong. I have little respect for people who half rep anything, even something simple like a bicep curl. I'd rather do a quality rep through the whole ROM (range of motion) with less weight.

Worst offenders I see at my gym are on the pull up bar. They pull up, then lower til they have about a 90 degree angle between their forearm and bicep, then pull back up. That's not a pull up, that's BS. Instead of accepting that they are weak and need to focus on good form and actually getting a stretch in the Lat muscle, they keep doing it. I've watched this kid do half rep pull ups for 3 months, and he still can only do about 6-7. Meanwhile, when I got real serious about lifting early last year, I could barely do 3 to 4 full ROM pull ups. I felt like an idiot. Now about 1yr later, I can do 6-8 with 35lb weight attached to me.

 

[phucheneh]

One of my personal goals is to be able to do unassisted pullups...well, right now, just...pullup. A single rep would be a landmark. I've never been able...only time I was ever forced to do them was BCT, where quite a few of us just had too much mass and too little upper body strength to do them. You'd have a buddy spotting you, who basically had to help you cheat. :\

Right now I can manage to do a couple with forty pounds of help on the sled. I think that's always been with the sideways grips, though...underhand gets me a little closer, overhand is currently a lost cause.

Also, SHIT, my legs hurt today. While I (and some of you other guys, too) feel that Zivic's diet and cardio advice might not be the best for a beginner looking to just build some initial strength...damn, he was on the money when he said I wasn't doing shit for my legs. Leg presses and curls did not do anything like this.

So I'd say I definitely need the lower body training. Plus the stabilizing muscles in my midsection...my abs and lower back have some strength, but I've gotta do something to target those side muscles (...I really gotta start learning more muscle nomenclature).

Couple the legs with the fact that I was really trying to push my arms/shoulders/chest yesterday...I hurt. Aside from a nice long hot soak in the tub, is there anything I can do to get a little relief?

 

[phucheneh]

Oh, and BTW, I should state/restate that I really do appreciate any help from you guys. I'm probably just gonna keep noting progress in this thread, and anyone who wants to chime in with tips is extremely appreciated.

I think I'm going to try to work up some kind of schedule. I'm definitely getting to a point where I really want to push hard, and I've gotta start giving muscle groups days off. Anyone got a link to a good starter guide for that, maybe?

There's such a wealth of information out there, but it is all generally either a) very, very lengthy or b) very, very specialized. As I've said, I'm just so lacking in experience that it is hard for me to know which direction to go. An example of a good gym routine for a beginner doing 5+ days a week would be freaking awesome. I'm somewhat unwilling to take days off, since I just feel better when I exercise. But I've got to quit overtaxing myself.

 

[Zivic]

An example of a good gym routine for a beginner doing 5+ days a week would be freaking awesome..

maybe you missed my posts about AST's MAX-OT???

There is only one direction... build muscle/lose fat. How far you want to take it is up to you. the starting point is the same.

 

[Zivic]

Oh, and lemme get one more question in here for Zivic or anyone who may agree with his goblet squat rec: Why? Not 'why squats,' but why the goblet over a standard squat with a bar? I always thought using a dumbell, kettlebells, or what-have-you was more for convenience rather than actually doing something difference from a standard squat with a bar.

I think you will have an easier time doing goblet squats over traditional barbell squats, they are less intimidating, no issues with bar placement, or discomfort from the bar. They will allow you to start with lighter weight. They will strengthen your core a bit more.

and you are missing the point with the easier/more convenient comment. All pieces of equipment in the gym... machines, barbells, dumbbells, etc can all be used effectively.

Please read up on some of the programs already posted... MAX-OT, starting strength

The training aspect doesn't mean that much at the point you are at. As long as you are being consistent and following a half-@ssed program (using progressive overload) you will make gains.

You are doing exactly what a typical newb is doing -> ignoring what people are telling you based on some BS random belief that you have in your head. You need to read through a few programs - again that have been already posted here in your thread - and chose one and follow it.

Max-OT hit it exactly on the head in their opening section -> forget everything you think you know about working out

I am again repeating myself, but if you read through and follow Max-OT's program it will put you YEARS ahead of the vast majority of gym goers. I am not saying stick to that program forever, but you need a solid foundation to build from. It will more than provide that. Stop asking questions and do some reading on your own. people have provided plenty of info (between the programs, fat loss sticky) that should keep your busy for quite a while.

There is no secret... no magic program... no magic lift or technique or machine. It's consistent, hard f^cking work that will determine your success.

 

[blackdogdeek]

Aside from a nice long hot soak in the tub, is there anything I can do to get a little relief?

Foam roll

maybe you missed my posts about AST's MAX-OT???

And mine about Starting Strength and StrongLifts5x5. These are both beginner programs that spell out EXACTLY what you need to do.

 

[Zivic]

You can, but very few beginners are going to weight train like this. Certainly not by themselves.

and a lot of people that have 'trained' for years continue to get fatter and fatter despite doing hours and hours of 'cardio'

 

[phucheneh]

Eh, I think what you guys are not getting is that when someone says 'I know nothing,' they're not looking to go out and buy a book on the subject. They want it distilled down to a more simplistic 'for dummies' version.

I had looked at one of the recommended programs and found it a bit too overwhelming. MAX-OT looks to be a little more paint-by-numbers, and claims to be free, so I will look into it.

I have certainly not ignored anything other than the stuff about strict, rigid dieting. If you want to say fine, that's my loss; okay, I'm cool with that.

Don't confuse my request for 'simple' as a request for 'easy.' Believe me, I'm putting in work. I just don't like to be mentally overwhelmed.

If you came to me and said you wanted to learn to fix your own car, I wouldn't start by telling you how to build a shortblock. If I did, I'd be going on and on about proper machining, checking oil clearances, ect, but you'd get nothing from it. Know what I mean?

 

[Carson Dyle]

Why not employ the services of a trainer for a month or two? Not to kick your ass into shape, but just to show you around the gym, introduce you to different exercises and proper form, and to give you some training guidelines.

When I began lifting I had the benefit of starting out with a buddy who had been a pretty serious body builder a few years before. I'm not sure what, or even if, I'd have learned otherwise.

 

[blackdogdeek]

Starting Strength and StrongLifts ARE 'for dummies' versions.

The Original Starting Strength Novice Program
Workout A
3x5 Squat
3x5 Bench Press
1x5 Deadlift

Workout B
3x5 Squat
3x5 Press
5x3 Power cleans

Workouts A and B alternate on 3 non-consecutive days per week.

StrongLifts 5×5 consists of two full body-workouts:

Workout A: Squat, Bench Press, Barbell Row
Workout B: Squat, Overhead Press, Deadlift

You train three times a week, alternating workout A and B, and resting at least one day between two workouts. You never train two days in a row because your body needs days off to get stronger. Most guys train Monday, Wednesday, Friday. But you can lift Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday or Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday. As long as you train three times a week, and take at least one day off between two workouts for your body to recover, you’ll get stronger.

...

5×5 means five sets of five reps with the same weight. This excludes your lighter warmup sets. 1×5 is one heavy set of five reps, after you’ve warmed up, and applies to Deadlift only (Squatting 3x/week will get you stronger for Deadlifts because it works similar muscles. No need for more sets).

Your goal isn’t to get pumped or sore (although that’s possible once the weights get heavy). Your goal is to increase the weight each workout. If you get five reps on each set, add 2.5kg/5lb next time you do that exercise (so 1.25kg/2.5lb on each side of the bar). If you get 1×5 on Deadlifts, add 5kg/10lb next time.

Don’t start too heavy or you’ll get sore legs and feel like skipping workouts in week one. Start light to let your body get used to Squatting three times a week. Remember you’re adding 2.5kg/5lb per workout or 30kg/60lb per month on Squats. The weight will increase fast. No need to start too heavy. If you’ve done free weight exercises like Squat, Bench and Deadlift before, with proper form, start with 50% of your five rep max.

If you’ve never used free weights, haven’t lifted in years, or you have no idea what a five rep max means, start with these weights:

Squat, Bench Press, Overhead Press: 20kg/45lb. That’s the empty Olympic bar.
Deadlift: 40kg/95lb. The empty bar with a plate of 10kg/25lb on each side.
Barbell Row: 30kg/65lb. The empty bar with 5kg/10lb on each side.

You start heavier on Deadlifts and Barbell Rows because you can’t do these exercises with proper form holding an empty bar in the air. Each rep must start with the weight on the floor.

Read more: http://stronglifts.com/5x5/

 

[Kaido]

Eh, I think what you guys are not getting is that when someone says 'I know nothing,' they're not looking to go out and buy a book on the subject. They want it distilled down to a more simplistic 'for dummies' version.

...

I just don't like to be mentally overwhelmed.

Let me simplify it for you:

Step 1: Pick a very specific goal that you want to reach (physique, lifting weight goals, bodyweight, etc.)

Step 2: Design a program around that goal that incorporates plans for the following:

1. Exercise
2. Food
3. Sleep

Step 3: Start the program with accountability. That can either be working out with a buddy, starting a thread here & updating it regularly, or tracking your daily workouts & physical progress metrics (bodyweight, bodyfat, etc.) on a fitness website. Or if you're super self-motivated, just get started. Personally I find that tracking helps because (1) it keeps me accountable, and (2) it lets me see if I'm actually making progress in my program.

From reading this thread, you:

1. Are motivated & willing to exercise
2. Want to get more strict with a training program
3. Already have a membership to Planet Fitness
4. Currently do 30 minutes of intense cardio with a minimum of an hour on weight machines
5. Specifically want to tack on upper-body mass
6. Do not want to get crazy-strict with your diet

So you need an exercise & diet program that will help you increase upper-body mass using the equipment available at your gym. To build lose weight & also build muscle, I've found eating (in particular, eating a ton of food) to be a key player. You might want to look into the "flexible dieting" way of eating (aka IIFYM, which stands for "if it fits your macros" - lots of reading available on google), which lets you eat a bunch of different stuff (including junk food), as long as it fits your macro diet goals. You have to learn to count calories (until you get the hang of it, at least), but it's a lot more flexible than just eating chicken, broccoli, and sweet potatoes all the time & doesn't make you feel deprived from eating the foods you love.

As far as working out goes, what Carson Dyle said is great - hire a trainer for a couple of months to show you the basic moves, different workout approaches, proper form, etc. After that, like blackdogdeek said, Starting Strength & Stronglifts 5x5 are great to get into. But if you're a total noob, hire a cheap at-the-gym trainer for a little while because that's basically what they're paid to do all day - teach people what to do based on their (usually) extensive knowledge. Tell your trainer what the goal you want to achieve is & how you want to approach it (ex. flexible dieting & weight machines, keto with free weights, etc.). There's a million different approaches, but it sounds like you're already 90% of the way there & just need some extra guidance to nail down that last bit.

One note on sleep. Like food, sleep helps your muscles grow. But everyone hates going to bed early. I hate going to bed early & fight myself all the time. However, more than actually growing muscles, I've found that going to bed early gives me a lot of energy & motivation all throughout the next day, whereas if I stay up late, I drag & everything is hard. I would say getting sufficient sleep, and moreso going to bed decently early, is the hardest thing to do in the bodybuilding world...exercise can be fun, you can make healthy food taste good, but staying up late is the best & no one wants to give that up haha!

 

[Zivic]

Eh, I think what you guys are not getting is that when someone says 'I know nothing,' they're not looking to go out and buy a book on the subject. They want it distilled down to a more simplistic 'for dummies' version.

I had looked at one of the recommended programs and found it a bit too overwhelming. MAX-OT looks to be a little more paint-by-numbers, and claims to be free, so I will look into it.

I have certainly not ignored anything other than the stuff about strict, rigid dieting. If you want to say fine, that's my loss; okay, I'm cool with that.

Don't confuse my request for 'simple' as a request for 'easy.' Believe me, I'm putting in work. I just don't like to be mentally overwhelmed.

If you came to me and said you wanted to learn to fix your own car, I wouldn't start by telling you how to build a shortblock. If I did, I'd be going on and on about proper machining, checking oil clearances, ect, but you'd get nothing from it. Know what I mean?

Read through max-ot. It will teach you what you want to know. I'm being as basic as I can. Progressive overload, accountability on what you eat and in how you train. How you train is a distance second to you being consistent with it. It won't matter if you do isolated curls or standing curls if you do either of them consistently you will make gains. You just need to put the time in and see what works for you. I'm not telling you how to rebuild a short block. I'm telling you to put some seat time in... In both the gym and reading the info that has already been presented to you. If you are in mn I'll even offer to train with you if you likematterng informed questions and we can go over specifics then... But at this point just get your @ss into the gym following one of the 3 plans presented to you. The finer details won't matter

 

[phucheneh]

Blackdog's quoted bit from Stronglifts seems to have done the trick...he shoved something obvious in my face, and I was intrigued enough to read through a lot of that guy's stuff. I've also been reading some personal accounts on r/fitness, which all seem highly positive of that philosophy in general.

I'm going to try to commit to either SL or a similar 5x5 program, as that seems to be the most in line with my goals. Although I do feel like I may need to make slight modifications until I get a little more growth (and more confidence). Namely, doing squats and seated overheads on the Smith instead of squats and standing overhead with free weights. What can I say...I...am a clumsy person.

 

[Bock]

for muscle soreness, multi vitamin, potassium, protein & water.

Edit: Quality Stretches often.
Great times would be, right before a work out, right after, before bed & in the morning. I used to have an extensive 15-20 minute pre bedtime stretch routine that worked wonders.

 

[Fulle]

Blackdog's quoted bit from Stronglifts seems to have done the trick...he shoved something obvious in my face, and I was intrigued enough to read through a lot of that guy's stuff. I've also been reading some personal accounts on r/fitness, which all seem highly positive of that philosophy in general.

I'm going to try to commit to either SL or a similar 5x5 program, as that seems to be the most in line with my goals. Although I do feel like I may need to make slight modifications until I get a little more growth (and more confidence). Namely, doing squats and seated overheads on the Smith instead of squats and standing overhead with free weights. What can I say...I...am a clumsy person.

Don't be shy, man. The SL 5x5 starts you out with really low weight on the squats and overheads, so it's not scary. It's literally an empty bar the first day. If you go in the smith machine, you'll be messing up your natural range of motion, and won't work your stabilizing muscles as well, so you'll be cheating yourself.

 

[phucheneh]

Well, an update...I've kinda just found what works for me. It's not optimal, I'm sure, but I doing the best with the time and equipment I have available.

I weighed myself today (after dinner, no less) and am currently at 195lbs.

I can now bench 160lbs. Managed five reps at that weight a couple days ago. Yeah, it's in a smith, so it's 'cheating' a bit. But when I started the thread, I'm pretty sure I couldn't lift 100lbs a single time, smith or no smith. And I know it's a bit 'bro' to rate progress by how much you can bench, but meh...it's where I can see the most obvious/consistent/reliable gains.

I've been snapping pics every week or so. I'm far from crazy about how I look right now, but comparing it to slightly less than two months ago is a pretty big 'whoa':

I'm wondering if I might be down to 180 or below before I really start to feel like I've lost most of the belly.

 

[z1ggy]

Keep it up!!

Just try and wean yourself off the smith machine slowly if you can... Or at least incorporate free weights on lighter sets if you're afraid of dropping weight, etc.

 

[rga]

Deadlifts never really made any sense to me. It seems like more a benchmark or demonstration that a legit exercise.

I mean, I know it can build strength like anything else, but it seems like a lot of unecessary risk.

...if you can't tell, I'm paranoid about messing my back up, giving myself a hernia, tearing a muscle or ligament, ect.

Picking up something heavy off the ground doesn't make sense to you? I've always thought the deadlift was one exercise that has real world application. Performing the deadlift with decent forn will allow you to pick up things on a daily basis with correct form, which will aid in the prevention of the type of injury you worry about.

 

[IHateMyJob2004]

Fuck me, that's a long post.

Cliffs:

Want upper body to be more huge, bruh. I barely look like I Even Lift (tm).

I'm still a beginner and hesistant to leave the safety/ease of dedicated machines, but I am 100% committed at this point, and am working damned hard at the gym. Just need to feel like I'm getting the most for my time. And not doing any damage.

Also, on a totally random note, I'm stupid-flexible for my size, but I still recognize that some machines simply do not let me move naturally.

I read a bunch of posts and I think the conversation is train wrecked.

Here's the deal. You want to look like you have a bigger upper body and more muscular in general.

1) you can run if you want. Just cap it at 3 miles.
2) Do stronglifts or starting strength. It doesn't matter which. Read about it and do it.

You'll get bigger in time. Don't worry.