256mb Radeon X1900XT vs 512mb 7900GTO

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: acegazda
what says you of the memory chip overheating and overall crappiness?

Huh?

Originally posted by: Elfear
Hmmm. Would you mind elaborating a bit on those points?

Too hot- If you mean too hot for a lot of overclocking than you're partially right. I've tried four X1900XT(X)'s and all have oced fairly well on the stock coolers. Does it run hotter than the 7900GTO? Yes. Does it run to hot to function correctly? No. In fact, it only runs about 10C higher than what a lot of 7900GTX owners are reporting (a 7900GTO would obviously run cooler still if left at stock speeds).

Too loud- This is correct for about 2 seconds on start up or if your case has extremely poor ventilation. None of the cards I used were bothersome, even during gaming. It is louder than the GTX cooler for sure but it's not that bad.

Too much power draw- Well, at stock the XT probably draws about 40W more than the GTO. If you ran your machine 24/7 for a month and at full load, you'd expect to pay an extra $2.88 by going with an X1900XT. Come on now, is that really a consideration?

If you're going for the "You have to pay extra money for a PSU" arguement, well that has a small amount of validity but any PSU you'd run a 7900GTO off of should be able to run an X1900XT too, unless you're already at the ragged edge of your PSU's capabilities.

I realize that most of what's posted on forums are opinions but I'm getting tired of the weaknesses of the X1900 series cards getting blown way out of proportion. Mountain out of a molehill so they say.

Too hot: Runs much hotter than any 7900 card, regardless of speed. Adds overall heat to your system which affects other components.

Too loud: WTF? At 50% speed on the stock cooler, it's very loud. I can hear the damn fan spinning up and down while I gaming with the sound turned up. There is no possible way anyone with normal hearing would not think that the stock X1900 fan is not loud. They're either deaf, or lying.

Too much power: The simple fact is the X1900's draw significantly more power than the 7900 series. No one's worried about the extra money on the electric bill, but it's the point of it more than anything. Plus, your PSU will get hotter which also means more heat in your case also.

Everyone has their opinions, but at least I'm giving mine as an actual owner of an X1900XT. As for "getting blown way out of proportion", that is up to each individula to decide. I truly wish I had taken more of the critical comments of the X1900's serioulsy. I listened to too many posters such as yourself that minimized the X1900 issues. Certainly this is only one persons opinion, but it is an informed opinion. To me, you are attempting to make molehills out of mountains.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Ike0069
Everyone has their opinions, but at least I'm giving mine as an actual owner of an X1900XT. As for "getting blown way out of proportion", that is up to each individula to decide. I truly wish I had taken more of the critical comments of the X1900's serioulsy. I listened to too many posters such as yourself that minimized the X1900 issues. Certainly this is only one persons opinion, but it is an informed opinion. To me, you are attempting to make molehills out of mountains.

Elfear has TWO X1900 cards (crossfire) in his rig right now so he is also speaking from experience. His is also an informed opinion.

 

[Munky]

Originally posted by: Matt2

Originally posted by: munky
Angle-independent AF on the x1900 series IS better than the old-skool AF on the 7-series. That's not a subjective matter, unless one happens to be a fanboy in denial.

I hope that wasnt directed at me munky.

I clearly stated that ATI's image quality was better than Nvidia's. I do however believe there are others (including me) who dont see the huge jaw dropping difference as you do.

LOL, I wasnt directing it at you. But it seems to that some people think the x1900 IQ lead is a myth, which is clearly not the case.

 

[CaiNaM]

Originally posted by: Ike0069
Too hot: Runs much hotter than any 7900 card, regardless of speed. Adds overall heat to your system which affects other components.

? it ads nothing to other components; it vents exh out the case... and you really stand by the fact you own one???

Too loud: WTF? At 50% speed on the stock cooler, it's very loud. I can hear the damn fan spinning up and down while I gaming with the sound turned up. There is no possible way anyone with normal hearing would not think that the stock X1900 fan is not loud. They're either deaf, or lying.

it's 12" away from my ear, and while it's noticeable, it's not that bad. in fact, i've heard 7900gt coolers almost as loud (the the gto has the much nicer gtx cooler).

Too much power: The simple fact is the X1900's draw significantly more power than the 7900 series. No one's worried about the extra money on the electric bill, but it's the point of it more than anything. Plus, your PSU will get hotter which also means more heat in your case also.

40w is "significant"?

and i suppose your psu blows air into your case also? you have a strange system.

Everyone has their opinions, but at least I'm giving mine as an actual owner of an X1900XT.

one the vents the air inside your case?

As for "getting blown way out of proportion", that is up to each individula to decide. I truly wish I had taken more of the critical comments of the X1900's serioulsy. I listened to too many posters such as yourself that minimized the X1900 issues. Certainly this is only one persons opinion, but it is an informed opinion. To me, you are attempting to make molehills out of mountains.

wow.. sounds more like you have an agenda...

yes, they are valid points for consideration, but i'm really not sure how 40w more power usage is really a "deal breaker". the noiser fan point is certainly valid, but again, mine (even overclocked) almost NEVER runs @ 50% or higher.. and it's not THAT loud. when i do notice it is when it changes speeds (if i have my sound med low or lower).

i'm sure some ppl will be more sensitive than others, but all i see is you putting high importance on the good points of nv and little to no value in the points in favor of ati.

 

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Originally posted by: Ike0069
Too hot: Runs much hotter than any 7900 card, regardless of speed. Adds overall heat to your system which affects other components.

? it ads nothing to other components; it vents exh out the case... and you really stand by the fact you own one???

Too loud: WTF? At 50% speed on the stock cooler, it's very loud. I can hear the damn fan spinning up and down while I gaming with the sound turned up. There is no possible way anyone with normal hearing would not think that the stock X1900 fan is not loud. They're either deaf, or lying.

it's 12" away from my ear, and while it's noticeable, it's not that bad. in fact, i've heard 7900gt coolers almost as loud (the the gto has the much nicer gtx cooler).

Too much power: The simple fact is the X1900's draw significantly more power than the 7900 series. No one's worried about the extra money on the electric bill, but it's the point of it more than anything. Plus, your PSU will get hotter which also means more heat in your case also.

40w is "significant"?

and i suppose your psu blows air into your case also? you have a strange system.

Everyone has their opinions, but at least I'm giving mine as an actual owner of an X1900XT.

one the vents the air inside your case?

As for "getting blown way out of proportion", that is up to each individula to decide. I truly wish I had taken more of the critical comments of the X1900's serioulsy. I listened to too many posters such as yourself that minimized the X1900 issues. Certainly this is only one persons opinion, but it is an informed opinion. To me, you are attempting to make molehills out of mountains.

wow.. sounds more like you have an agenda...

yes, they are valid points for consideration, but i'm really not sure how 40w more power usage is really a "deal breaker". the noiser fan point is certainly valid, but again, mine (even overclocked) almost NEVER runs @ 50% or higher.. and it's not THAT loud. when i do notice it is when it changes speeds (if i have my sound med low or lower).

i'm sure some ppl will be more sensitive than others, but all i see is you putting high importance on the good points of nv and little to no value in the points in favor of ati.

If you honestly think all the heat from your VC and PSU is removed from the inside of your case simply because you have a fan that exhausts outside the case, then you are just not very educated on simple heat transfer. I suppose that the a core temp of 75C gives off absolutley no radiant heat. :roll:

As for the power, there are many people who think that the extra power X1900's draw is not a concern, while many others think of it as a deal breaker. Read thru these forums and you will see many posters state the amount of power X1900's draw is the sole reason they went with an nVidia card, or decided not to upgrade at all. Each person just has to make that decision for themselves.

Anyways, no agenda here. As I said it was just my opinion; so the OP, or anyone else, can take that for what it's worth. I personally like to read negative users opinions, more so than the positive ones, and then see if the negatives are things that I am concerned with.

Also, I'm well aware the elfear owns X1900's. I never said he didn't as far as I remember. I was simply pointing out that I'm not just an ATI basher that only uses nVidia.

BTW, if these issues were not a big deal, then why the X1950. Hmm, maybe because it's alot faster...........No! They used DDR4 for what reason? It's faster.........No! It's because it uses less power and thereby runs slightly cooler also. Then they designed a much, much improved cooler. Why, because the original one didn't cool very well.......No! (it actually cools pretty good for a stock cooler) It's because it was extremely loud. The new cooler is awesome. ATI was simply trying to compete more with nVidia in power, heat, and noise.

 

[CaiNaM]

Originally posted by: Ike0069

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Originally posted by: Ike0069
Too hot: Runs much hotter than any 7900 card, regardless of speed. Adds overall heat to your system which affects other components.

? it ads nothing to other components; it vents exh out the case... and you really stand by the fact you own one???

Too loud: WTF? At 50% speed on the stock cooler, it's very loud. I can hear the damn fan spinning up and down while I gaming with the sound turned up. There is no possible way anyone with normal hearing would not think that the stock X1900 fan is not loud. They're either deaf, or lying.

it's 12" away from my ear, and while it's noticeable, it's not that bad. in fact, i've heard 7900gt coolers almost as loud (the the gto has the much nicer gtx cooler).

Too much power: The simple fact is the X1900's draw significantly more power than the 7900 series. No one's worried about the extra money on the electric bill, but it's the point of it more than anything. Plus, your PSU will get hotter which also means more heat in your case also.

40w is "significant"?

and i suppose your psu blows air into your case also? you have a strange system.

Everyone has their opinions, but at least I'm giving mine as an actual owner of an X1900XT.

one the vents the air inside your case?

As for "getting blown way out of proportion", that is up to each individula to decide. I truly wish I had taken more of the critical comments of the X1900's serioulsy. I listened to too many posters such as yourself that minimized the X1900 issues. Certainly this is only one persons opinion, but it is an informed opinion. To me, you are attempting to make molehills out of mountains.

wow.. sounds more like you have an agenda...

yes, they are valid points for consideration, but i'm really not sure how 40w more power usage is really a "deal breaker". the noiser fan point is certainly valid, but again, mine (even overclocked) almost NEVER runs @ 50% or higher.. and it's not THAT loud. when i do notice it is when it changes speeds (if i have my sound med low or lower).

i'm sure some ppl will be more sensitive than others, but all i see is you putting high importance on the good points of nv and little to no value in the points in favor of ati.

If you honestly think all the heat from your VC and PSU is removed from the inside of your case simply because you have a fan that exhausts outside the case, then you are just not very educated on simple heat transfer. I suppose that the a core temp of 75C gives off absolutley no radiant heat. :roll:

As for the power, there are many people who think that the extra power X1900's draw is not a concern, while many others think of it as a deal breaker. Read thru these forums and you will see many posters state the amount of power X1900's draw is the sole reason they went with an nVidia card, or decided not to upgrade at all. Each person just has to make that decision for themselves.

Anyways, no agenda here. As I said it was just my opinion; so the OP, or anyone else, can take that for what it's worth. I personally like to read negative users opinions, more so than the positive ones, and then see if the negatives are things that I am concerned with.

Also, I'm well aware the elfear owns X1900's. I never said he didn't as far as I remember. I was simply pointing out that I'm not just an ATI basher that only uses nVidia.

BTW, if these issues were not a big deal, then why the X1950. Hmm, maybe because it's alot faster...........No! They used DDR4 for what reason? It's faster.........No! It's because it uses less power and thereby runs slightly cooler also. Then they designed a much, much improved cooler. Why, because the original one didn't cool very well.......No! (it actually cools pretty good for a stock cooler) It's because it was extremely loud. The new cooler is awesome. ATI was simply trying to compete more with nVidia in power, heat, and noise.

so why the 7950? your logic (or lack of it) is simply amazing...

and yes, the 1900xt has absolutely no effect on other components. my case temp did not change one iota from the 7900 to the 1900 - any differences were immeasurable.

i don't believe anyone stated the 1900 cooler is "quiet".. i'm glad ati improved it with the 1950. i am also glad the GTO uses the GTX cooler - most GT coolers certainly had room for improvement, just as the 1900 series did.

why do i claim you have an agenda? easy. you list all negative points for the ati card, and they aren't even really factual; rather than saying it draws xx watts more power, or puts out xx deg. more heat, or xx more decibels, which would give the reader an idea and a way to form their own, unbiased opinoin, you simply state, "too hot, too loud, too...." while going on to claim the GTO is perfect - attempting to place your own blatantly biased opinion onto the reader...

you haven't shown a shred of objectivity in your posts, and the only conclusion is that you offer no real help to the readers; rather you just want to push your own agenda.

 

[Saku]

former nvidia fanboy here, just wanted to say two things:
- step-up program is doodoo
- X1900XT image quality is amazing

 

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM
so why the 7950? your logic (or lack of it) is simply amazing...

and yes, the 1900xt has absolutely no effect on other components. my case temp did not change one iota from the 7900 to the 1900 - any differences were immeasurable.

i don't believe anyone stated the 1900 cooler is "quiet".. i'm glad ati improved it with the 1950. i am also glad the GTO uses the GTX cooler - most GT coolers certainly had room for improvement, just as the 1900 series did.

why do i claim you have an agenda? easy. you list all negative points for the ati card, and they aren't even really factual; rather than saying it draws xx watts more power, or puts out xx deg. more heat, or xx more decibels, which would give the reader an idea and a way to form their own, unbiased opinoin, you simply state, "too hot, too loud, too...." while going on to claim the GTO is perfect - attempting to place your own blatantly biased opinion onto the reader...

you haven't shown a shred of objectivity in your posts, and the only conclusion is that you offer no real help to the readers; rather you just want to push your own agenda.

Uhh, the 7950GT is clocked quite a bit faster than a stock 7900GT, plus it adds 256MB RAM. Do you have any clue what you talking about?

And I will say that my case temps went up from my 6800GT with an NVsilencer. And radiant heat is a fact of physics, not something I'm making up.

Objectivity? I made one simple, short post that stated the X1900 was too hot, too loud, and uses too much power, and even though it's faster, the 7900GTO is the better deal. The OP wanted to hear what people thought was the better card. I stated my choice and the reasons. Simple enough.

Then everyone started quoting me and asking more questions, so I again stated my opinion on the subjects. I'm sorry you disagree with them, but that's fine. We don't all have to agree on everything.

But then you have to make smart ass comments about how my card and PSU should vent outside the case, but apparently then blow inside the case. Uneducated people should really not try and make others appear to be a fool, because they always end up the ones looking foolish.

Fact: As the temp of components inside your case increase, your case ambient temp will also increase in a proportional manner. Therefore, we know that hotter components will lead to higher ambient temps, which reduces cooling capability (using air cooling), thus raising component temps even more. It becomes a vicious cycle.

 

[josh6079]

I voted for the GTO because:

[*]I think most have SLI capable motherboards instead of CF capable ones. (Just a hunch but who really knows?)

[*]Better multi-GPU drivers/profiles for a more mature dual-GPU solution.

[*]The lower temps do help. Although they shouldn't be compared to ATI directly since ATI's GPU's structure is more complex, powerful, and shader-packed causing higher temps, they should be taken into consideration with the stock cooler. It doesn't exhaust heat out of the case, so having lower temps certainly doesn't hurt.

[*]It requires less power. While some don't see it as a deal breaker, if I decided to throw in a couple more hard drives, DVD drives, etc. it's nice to know that I've got that extra ~40W to spare instead of ~40W to less of what I need.

[*]A 7900GTX for how much? Sign me up. That is about the price that I waited for them to come down to, but that wasn't happening so I bought the X1900XT. Couple of weeks later, guess what pops up...

[*]E.....V.....G.....(yeah you know what I'm talking about)....A. Who wouldn't want that kind of service and upgradable options? I miss that company so much.

The one thing that would hold me back from getting this card:

[*]ATI's overclocking capabilities are much more elegant and user-friendly. My video card doesn't have to look like a cyborg in order to hit the frequencies I would want to hit being on water. Software voltage controls FTW.

[*]Angle Independent AF. There is no dispute, as of now it is unmatched.

[*]HDR+AA. It is borderline playable, but that is still playable in my book. I don't play Oblivion as much as I did, but I'm slowly coming back to it now and again.

[*]F@H. Hey, I work at a hospital, I like people. Anything to help. (Especially if it gives me good gameplay on the side)

[*]Powerconsumption. Yes, I listed this as a benefit I know but listen. With G80 and R600 rumored to take as many watts as we're hearing, and with no known estimate on what kind of refresh decreases we may or may not see, a PSU upgrade is inevitable. Get it over with and enjoy. The PSU is in my book the most important product in a computer.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: Ike0069

As for the power, there are many people who think that the extra power X1900's draw is not a concern, while many others think of it as a deal breaker. Read thru these forums and you will see many posters state the amount of power X1900's draw is the sole reason they went with an nVidia card, or decided not to upgrade at all. Each person just has to make that decision for themselves.

This kind of reasoning is exactly my point about mountains out of molehills. If people posting that the X1900XT uses WAY too much power would give a viable reason for holding to that opinion than I would have a lot more respect for them. If you are really worried about the extra $2.88 a month in electrical expenses (for those hardcore guys who run their rigs at load every hour of the month) than just state that as the reason behind your dislike of ATI. If the reason is that your 350W Powmax can't handle the extra requirements of the X1900XT than just state that. Seriously, I have yet to hear a really good excuse as to why the extra 40W power draw of the XT is such a huge deterrent.

 

[Madellga]

I voted for the GTO for the following reasons:

1) It has 512MB, a good advantage at 1920x1200 4AA 8AF

2) You don't need to buy a Zalman cooler, which costs 30 bucks more. That makes the deal even better for the GTO.

3) GTO can use centered timings on the LCD output, the ATI has the option but it just doesn't work. I have this problem on my second rig. Jiffy said he has the same issue.

I might be dumb for doing this, but I just got 2xGTOs from MSI. Both clock 700/800.

I'm selling the both my 7950GX2 and XT1900XT. And there will be a lot of money left.
Even better, the GTOs will depreciate much slower in value.

The GX2 is not worth the price difference and has some minor issues with 975/965 chipsets - performance drops if you change some settings in your computer (can be bios or driver settings) and you must clean/reinstall drivers to fix it. Sometimes I don't get video on a pure DOS session, for example when running backup programs (like Trueimage9). It is noisier than the GTO but much less than the X1900.

The X1900XT 512MB was a good deal and I played with it, compared images, shimmering etc etc. But I'm a silent PC guy and the X1900 noise dominates. There is the centered timing issue, as I don't like to stretch the image to unnatural resolutions.

If it was not for the GTO and X9150 prices would be a bit lower, I would have gotten a X1950XT XFire from Powercolor. If prices drop in the next weeks, I might get it and SLI the 2 GTOs. Just missing a good Conroe mobo with SLI.....I have the hacked drivers but not good idea to be stuck to an old version.

PS: A quick Thermal Transfer refresh course:
As for radiant heat, it is proportional to temperature^4 (TxTxTxT).
Quick math check
X1900 80C = 353K
GTO 60C = 333K
X1900/GTO = (353/333)^4 = 1.2628 => 26% more heat radiated inside the case

 

[rawr1234]

good points especially the +26% heat and extra noise because I wanna try to keep my pc on 24/7 (playing at day and downloading at night)

 

[tuteja1986]

Originally posted by: rawr1234
What do you guys think is the best bang for the buck ? as I hear the 7900GTO is just a 7900gtx underclocked and it comes with 512mb ram (better for vista & future games then 256mb) it is a tad slower then the X1900XT at stock speeds (a few fps) but can be easily clocked to 7900GTX speeds

how much power does this beast consume however ? Why hasnt Anandtech done any reviews on the 7900GTO ?

both cards are around $250

Firing Squad has a good review and they are much better at reviewing GPU than most Review site like Anandtech. http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/evga_e-geforce_7900_gto/

 

[rawr1234]

sweet a review in english of them side by side huge thanks tuteja

 

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: Ike0069

As for the power, there are many people who think that the extra power X1900's draw is not a concern, while many others think of it as a deal breaker. Read thru these forums and you will see many posters state the amount of power X1900's draw is the sole reason they went with an nVidia card, or decided not to upgrade at all. Each person just has to make that decision for themselves.

This kind of reasoning is exactly my point about mountains out of molehills. If people posting that the X1900XT uses WAY too much power would give a viable reason for holding to that opinion than I would have a lot more respect for them. If you are really worried about the extra $2.88 a month in electrical expenses (for those hardcore guys who run their rigs at load every hour of the month) than just state that as the reason behind your dislike of ATI. If the reason is that your 350W Powmax can't handle the extra requirements of the X1900XT than just state that. Seriously, I have yet to hear a really good excuse as to why the extra 40W power draw of the XT is such a huge deterrent.

We all understand that an extra 40W is not a big deal to you, but you have to realize not everyone can or wants to buy a PSU big enough to run x-fired X1900's. You have a lot of money invested in you rig, but not everyone has that advantage. Think of the small guy from time to time.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: Ike0069

We all understand that an extra 40W is not a big deal to you, but you have to realize not everyone can or wants to buy a PSU big enough to run x-fired X1900's. You have a lot of money invested in you rig, but not everyone has that advantage. Think of the small guy from time to time.

Don't try to play the "Well, you're just a rich guy that doesn't know the meaning of value" card. I always look for a the best bargains when I shop for computer parts. I paid as much for my X1900XTs as a lot of people pay for their single cards. I am not rich by any stretch of the imagination and I do know the value of a dollar. A PSU powerful enough to run oced X1900XTs has nothing to do with the requirements for a single XT or GTO. Your 500W Silverstone would be more than plenty for either card and probably for Crossfire as well. My 600W Enhance was only $100 which is a very reasonable price to pay for a decent PSU and certainly not over the top. I know of $50-60 PSU's that would run an XT just fine.

My point in the statement you quoted is that almost any modern PSU will run an XT just fine unless you really cheaped out and kept the 350W Powmax that came with your case. Anyone willing to pay $250 for a video card probably doesn't have a piece of dump PSU in their case.

 

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: Ike0069

We all understand that an extra 40W is not a big deal to you, but you have to realize not everyone can or wants to buy a PSU big enough to run x-fired X1900's. You have a lot of money invested in you rig, but not everyone has that advantage. Think of the small guy from time to time.

Don't try to play the "Well, you're just a rich guy that doesn't know the meaning of value" card. I always look for a the best bargains when I shop for computer parts. I paid as much for my X1900XTs as a lot of people pay for their single cards. I am not rich by any stretch of the imagination and I do know the value of a dollar. A PSU powerful enough to run oced X1900XTs has nothing to do with the requirements for a single XT or GTO. Your 500W Silverstone would be more than plenty for either card and probably for Crossfire as well. My 600W Enhance was only $100 which is a very reasonable price to pay for a decent PSU and certainly not over the top. I know of $50-60 PSU's that would run an XT just fine.

My point in the statement you quoted is that almost any modern PSU will run an XT just fine unless you really cheaped out and kept the 350W Powmax that came with your case. Anyone willing to pay $250 for a video card probably doesn't have a piece of dump PSU in their case.

I did have to buy a new PSU for this card and I had Fortron before. Not a cheap PSU, but it shold have been able to handle the load, it just did not for some reason.

As I stated earlier, it's not the extra $$ in monthly electric bills that is the point. In fact, you are the only person I've seen even bring that up.

The simple fact is that you can get a quieter/cooler running/lower power using card of similar speed for the same price. If all one cares about is pure FPS, then the X1900XT is the best overall choice. But when you factor other things in, the 7900GTO is a better choice IMO.

Now if these three things do not matter much to you, then that's great. I personally did not think the fan noise would bother me, but it really does.....alot. You also react as if the entire power issue should be a moot point. If so, then why the X1950XTX and now the X1950pro. Both are specifically designed to run cooler and use less power than their X1900 counterparts. Apparently ATI believes they needed a card that used less power and ran cooler, so I'm not sure exactly why you find this so difficult to comprehend. Now this doesn't mean that ATI belives that their X1900 series was a bad design, only that there is enough of a consumer concern that it was prudent introduce new cards that are more efficient in the power usage/heat generation areas.

So in summary, I don't hate my X1900XT, although I do hate the stock cooler. I actually thought about returning it and getting a GTO when they first hit the shelves (only had my X1900 <2 weeks), but decided against it. I also wish it hadn't required me to buy a new PSU, but it did. The card is very fast, and I really like using ATI TT, very nice program. But if I had a choice between the X1900XT 256 and the 7900GTO, I'd choose the GTO without hesitation. I believe it's the absolute best deal in VC's right now.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: Ike0069

I did have to buy a new PSU for this card and I had Fortron before. Not a cheap PSU, but it shold have been able to handle the load, it just did not for some reason.

As I stated earlier, it's not the extra $$ in monthly electric bills that is the point. In fact, you are the only person I've seen even bring that up.

The simple fact is that you can get a quieter/cooler running/lower power using card of similar speed for the same price. If all one cares about is pure FPS, then the X1900XT is the best overall choice. But when you factor other things in, the 7900GTO is a better choice IMO.

Now if these three things do not matter much to you, then that's great. I personally did not think the fan noise would bother me, but it really does.....alot. You also react as if the entire power issue should be a moot point. If so, then why the X1950XTX and now the X1950pro. Both are specifically designed to run cooler and use less power than their X1900 counterparts. Apparently ATI believes they needed a card that used less power and ran cooler, so I'm not sure exactly why you find this so difficult to comprehend. Now this doesn't mean that ATI belives that their X1900 series was a bad design, only that there is enough of a consumer concern that it was prudent introduce new cards that are more efficient in the power usage/heat generation areas.

So in summary, I don't hate my X1900XT, although I do hate the stock cooler. I actually thought about returning it and getting a GTO when they first hit the shelves (only had my X1900 <2 weeks), but decided against it. I also wish it hadn't required me to buy a new PSU, but it did. The card is very fast, and I really like using ATI TT, very nice program. But if I had a choice between the X1900XT 256 and the 7900GTO, I'd choose the GTO without hesitation. I believe it's the absolute best deal in VC's right now.

I guess my issue is that you don't make a very good debate. When you make a statement about ATI like "it uses too much power" than you need to back that up with a reason why you feel that way. Simply saying it takes too much power to run is useless as it gives no credence to what you're saying. I could very well say ATI is inferior because it's too red. Does that give any reason why ATI might be inferior because it's too red? Nope. It's just a statement without merit.

Anyway, enough of that. I don't believe we're really understanding each other here. I think both cards have their strengths and weaknesses and to say that one is perfect is misleading. Here's my opinion (yes my opinion) on how the cards break down.

7900GTO- Quieter cooler and ability to use EVGA's stepup program (never used it but heard it was ok). It does run ~15C cooler at stock and ~8-10C cooler oced. This does not equate to cooler case temps so I'm not sure if that is a big strength.

X1900XT 256MB- Ability for higher IQ, generally a bit faster at stock, HDR+AA (this may or may not be important to some users but I personally use it a lot).

 

[Ike0069]

Originally posted by: Elfear
I guess my issue is that you don't make a very good debate. When you make a statement about ATI like "it uses too much power" than you need to back that up with a reason why you feel that way. Simply saying it takes too much power to run is useless as it gives no credence to what you're saying. I could very well say ATI is inferior because it's too red. Does that give any reason why ATI might be inferior because it's too red? Nope. It's just a statement without merit.

Anyway, enough of that. I don't believe we're really understanding each other here. I think both cards have their strengths and weaknesses and to say that one is perfect is misleading. Here's my opinion (yes my opinion) on how the cards break down.

7900GTO- Quieter cooler and ability to use EVGA's stepup program (never used it but heard it was ok). It does run ~15C cooler at stock and ~8-10C cooler oced. This does not equate to cooler case temps so I'm not sure if that is a big strength.

X1900XT 256MB- Ability for higher IQ, generally a bit faster at stock, HDR+AA (this may or may not be important to some users but I personally use it a lot).

Fair enough. In my initial post I did only state that it was too hot, too...etc, with no real basis other than my opinion. What I was trying not to do initially is make it a really big deal by stating something absurd like "don't get a X1900 because you will have to upgrade your PSU no matter what".

I think the OP can now read thru this thread and make his own decision based on the pros and cons of each card as they've pretty much all come out. That was the initial point of this thread I think.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: Ike0069

Fair enough. In my initial post I did only state that it was too hot, too...etc, with no real basis other than my opinion. What I was trying not to do initially is make it a really big deal by stating something absurd like "don't get a X1900 because you will have to upgrade your PSU no matter what".

I think the OP can now read thru this thread and make his own decision based on the pros and cons of each card as they've pretty much all come out. That was the initial point of this thread I think.

Spoken like a gentleman. Thanks for keeping it real.