Question 2023 upgrade...

[BoomerD]

Because of all the problems I've been having with my current PC, i7-9700K/32gb Corsair DDR4/EVGA 3070 GPU, Seasonic Focus 750 PSU, I'm looking to MAYBE upgrade later this month.

I will re-use one of my 2 cases, either an IBuyPower POS mid-tower case, or an ancient Coolermaster HAF 932 which will require new case fans and the addition of a USB 3. front panel. The Coolermaster, being a MUCH larger case will give me much more room for expansion, would allow me to use a Noctua air cooler, but if I go with an AIO, then I'm limited to a 240mm unit same as the IPB case.

So...I just added the Corsair RAM a month ago, I could go with a 12th gen Intel CPU and keep that, but if I go with a 13th gen, then I might have to buy DDR5. (but depending on the motherboard, I MIGHT have to do with a 12th gen CPU.)

Recommendations for CPU/Motherboard? I'd prefer to stay with the "flagship" model of whichever generation I get. No I5 or I7 models unless the performance is so much better than the I9 variant.

I DO NOT need storage...I have a couple of good (1TB WD Black and 2 TB Seagate) spinner HDD's, 2 240GB SSD's, a 1TB NVMe and a 2TB NVMe.

I know we have lots of AMD supporters here, but my VERY LIMITED experience with AMD/ATi has been...disappointing to say the least. (most of those were FAR from being flagship models of CPU or GPU with the exception of the X850XT PE GPU I bought some 15 years ago.) As such, I'd prefer only Intel processor recommendations.

Thanks.

EDIT: This will be used for gaming, (mostly older FPS shooters) surfing and watching videos. No video encoding, no graphics work other than games. No CAD or anything similar.

EDIT.2
Turns out, both Z690 and Z790 boards are available in DDR4 and DDR5.

Now then, I'vever built with MSI. I seem to remember that about 20 years ago they were considered bottom tier. Don't know if that's changed. I've pretty much only ever used ASUS in my builds, but have been looking at Gigabyte as well...HOWEVER, the "exploding PSU" debacle from this past year has me second guessing that.

 

[igor_kavinski]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BL3SCWH

These 40x40 pads cover the lga1700 perfectly.

I got me the same.

 

[BoomerD]

I got me the same.

hmm...OK. i thought the CPU was rectangular not square.

 

[Tech Junky]

hmm...OK. i thought the CPU was rectangular not square.

The die might be but the part that mates to the cooler is more square. What matters is it's effective and less messy to deal with.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-lga-1700-socket-pictured

37.5*45mm

Besides the point, it fits and there aren't any hotspots.

 

[igor_kavinski]

hmm...OK. i thought the CPU was rectangular not square.

Just checked and the pad does cover the CPU almost completely but it's wider so it will also partially cover the steel retention bracket around the CPU.

 

[BoomerD]

So...I've been dismantling my ancient 1156 rig tonight. Most of it will probably get taken to the e-waste disposal. Sad because the ASUS P7P55D-E Pro motherboard, i5-760 CPU, and Corsair DDR3-1600 (4x2GB) Are all in excellent condition. Only overclocked to play with it when it was new...always reverted back to stock.
Anyway...I want to keep my Noctua NH-U12P SE2 cooler. It's still more than good enough for quite a few CPU's, just not the i5-13600K that I bought. When I went to dismount it from the CPU...it was stuck...the TIM had hardened and was like cement. (Cleaned right off with 91% IPA) Oddly enough, temps NEVER got over about 60C...ever, so inspite of drying out, the TIM and cooler did their job...for more than 10 years.

 

[In2Photos]

So...I've been dismantling my ancient 1156 rig tonight. Most of it will probably get taken to the e-waste disposal. Sad because the ASUS P7P55D-E Pro motherboard, i5-760 CPU, and Corsair DDR3-1600 (4x2GB) Are all in excellent condition. Only overclocked to play with it when it was new...always reverted back to stock.
Anyway...I want to keep my Noctua NH-U12P SE2 cooler. It's still more than good enough for quite a few CPU's, just not the i5-13600K that I bought. When I went to dismount it from the CPU...it was stuck...the TIM had hardened and was like cement. (Cleaned right off with 91% IPA) Oddly enough, temps NEVER got over about 60C...ever, so inspite of drying out, the TIM and cooler did their job...for more than 10 years.

Same here with my i7-920 and Xigmatek Dark Knight cooler. I redid the paste a few years ago when I added more RAM, bought a GTX 1060 6GB and decided to overclock the CPU. First application of TIM lasted at least 10 years. I'm thinking about keeping most of my rig and maybe putting the parts out on display in my office for a little nostalgia.

 

[Motostu]

Paste is a right-of-passage. You've never really built a computer until you have used paste.

Some of us still go the extra mile and lap the contact surface of our heat sinks! In the early days, I even lapped the processor lid to eek out that last little bit of performance. At least I don't do that anymore.

 

[BoomerD]

I was dredging through some of my old Amazon orders. In December 2010, I paid $204.99 for the i5-760. 2 weeks ago, I bought the i5-13600K...paid $319.93. Not a big increase in price over the past 12 years for such a HUGE increase in performance.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Not a big increase in price over the past 12 years for such a HUGE increase in performance.

I hope no one from Intel sees your comment. Don't want them to think they are being too "generous" to us.

 

[BoomerD]

I hope no one from Intel sees your comment. Don't want them to think they are being too "generous" to us.

 

[BoomerD]

Hope to see your stock settings scores for Geekbench 5, Rapydmark at High and MemMaxx2!

Posted the GB and MM scores the other day. Ran Rapydmark 1.2a...everything was fine except the Cathedral 3D test. Everytime it reported test error. (even though it ran to completion) No idea what that's about.

esults of all tests:

Total time (all tests): 41.326 seconds

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Matrix multiplication
Iterations: 100M | Performance: 28,785,262 it/s (20th) | Time: 3.474 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: MulDivAddSub (int,double,int64_t)
Iterations: 100M | Performance: 34,590,108 it/s (20th) | Time: 2.891 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Trigonometric functions
Iterations: 100M | Performance: 50,607,288 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.976 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Floating point operations per second
Iterations: 4K | Performance: 2,237 it/s 577.300 GFLOPS (20th) | Time: 1.788 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Find prime numbers SQR method
Iterations: 50M | Performance: 35,561,876 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.406 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Fibonachi sequence (92)
Iterations: 1000M | Performance: 418,410,016 it/s (20th) | Time: 2.390 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Pi approximation Taylor series method
Iterations: 200 | Performance: 108 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.838 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Greatest Common Divisor (GCD) Euclid's algorithm
Iterations: 400M | Performance: 178,890,864 it/s (20th) | Time: 2.236 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Fill Memory 256 MB
Iterations: 6K | Performance: 1,949 it/s (20th) | Time: 3.078 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Copy Memory 256 MB
Iterations: 6K | Performance: 2,557 it/s (20th) | Time: 2.346 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Memory cache performance (max 4 threads)
Iterations: 10 | Performance: 11 it/s (4th) | Time: 3.541 s
Last result: SizeMem= 8 kB Iterations= 65536 Time= 2 ms
SizeMem= 16 kB Iterations= 32768 Time= 2 ms
SizeMem= 32 kB Iterations= 16384 Time= 2 ms
SizeMem= 64 kB Iterations= 8192 Time= 6 ms
SizeMem= 128 kB Iterations= 4096 Time= 6 ms
SizeMem= 256 kB Iterations= 2048 Time= 6 ms
SizeMem= 512 kB Iterations= 1024 Time= 6 ms
SizeMem= 1 MB Iterations= 512 Time= 6 ms
SizeMem= 2 MB Iterations= 256 Time= 9 ms
SizeMem= 4 MB Iterations= 128 Time= 12 ms
SizeMem= 8 MB Iterations= 64 Time= 20 ms
SizeMem= 16 MB Iterations= 32 Time= 52 ms
SizeMem= 32 MB Iterations= 16 Time= 63 ms
SizeMem= 64 MB Iterations= 8 Time= 64 ms
SizeMem= 128 MB Iterations= 4 Time= 77 ms


-------------------------------------
Test Type: Files Encrypt AES256 (10 MB)
Iterations: 2K | Performance: 1,353 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.478 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Memory Encrypt/Decrypt AES256 (1 MB)
Iterations: 400 | Performance: 461 it/s (20th) | Time: 0.866 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Memory Encrypt/Decrypt Blowfish448 (1 MB)
Iterations: 400 | Performance: 517 it/s (20th) | Time: 0.773 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Memory Compress/Decompress 1 MB (Gzip)
Iterations: 400 | Performance: 497 it/s (20th) | Time: 0.804 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Files Compress 10 MB (Gzip)
Iterations: 200 | Performance: 239 it/s (20th) | Time: 0.834 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: RSA Keys Generator (2048 bits)
Iterations: 200 | Performance: 162 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.234 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Hash SHA1/256/512 MD4/5 CRC32 RIPEMD160 (512 bytes)
Iterations: 100K | Performance: 25,354 it/s (20th) | Time: 3.944 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Random Numbers Generator (2048 bits)
Iterations: 20M | Performance: 14,771,049 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.354 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Bitcoin Address Generator
Iterations: 20K | Performance: 11,661 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.715 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Distances between points on Earth (Haversine)
Iterations: 100M | Performance: 73,529,408 it/s (20th) | Time: 1.360 s

-------------------------------------
Test Type: Cathedral 3D Test
Iterations: 1 | Performance: Test error | Time: 0

Yet the 3D test report says:

FPS average: 437 | min: 253 | max: 1237

I have no idea if any of that is bad or good.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Posted the GB and MM scores the other day. Ran Rapydmark 1.2a...everything was fine except the Cathedral 3D test. Everytime it reported test error. (even though it ran to completion) No idea what that's about.

Rapydmark should be run with the HIGH setting. You can select all tests and then scroll down and deselect the Cathedral test. It doesn't affect the total time taken to complete all tests.

 

[BoomerD]

Rapydmark should be run with the HIGH setting. You can select all tests and then scroll down and deselect the Cathedral test. It doesn't affect the total time taken to complete all tests.

OK. I'll try that after I get home.

 

[BoomerD]

OK. High stress test:

Once again, the Cathedral 3D test errored out. There was a couple of tests that pushed the CPU to 100% on all cores...and a couple of cores warmed right up...

 

[igor_kavinski]

OK. High stress test:

I don't see your Rapydmark screenshot anymore. Don't see your Memmaxx2 screenshot either in the other thread. Dunno what's the issue. Maybe forum taking its revenge from you?

I'm getting roughly 38 GB/s RAM bandwidth with E-cores. With them turned off, it increases to about 39.4 GB/s.

This is with DDR5-4600 CL28-30-30-60 (it's actually an EXPO DDR5-5600 kit that I got for about $100. Can't get it to run any better with PMIC VDD/VDDQ 1.25V and CPU/IMC at 1.17/1.225V).

I seem to remember that your Rapydmark score was about 226 sec. Mine is doing about 230 to 234 sec with air cooler so I guess that's good for a 12700K gimped with slow RAM?

 

[BoomerD]

I don't see your Rapydmark screenshot anymore. Don't see your Memmaxx2 screenshot either in the other thread. Dunno what's the issue. Maybe forum taking its revenge from you?

I'm getting roughly 38 GB/s RAM bandwidth with E-cores. With them turned off, it increases to about 39.4 GB/s.

This is with DDR5-4600 CL28-30-30-60 (it's actually an EXPO DDR5-5600 kit that I got for about $100. Can't get it to run any better with PMIC VDD/VDDQ 1.25V and CPU/IMC at 1.17/1.225V).

I seem to remember that your Rapydmark score was about 226 sec. Mine is doing about 230 to 234 sec with air cooler so I guess that's good for a 12700K gimped with slow RAM?

I don't know what's going on with that...I noticed it last night. Maybe after I get a couple of cups of coffee in mah belly...

heh...fixed.

 

[igor_kavinski]

heh...fixed.

Thanks!

May I have your Geekbench 5 URL? I think you posted it in some other thread. Can't seem to find it.

 

[BoomerD]

Thanks!

May I have your Geekbench 5 URL? I think you posted it in some other thread. Can't seem to find it.

Never had it installed. Here's the results:

Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-7D32 - Geekbench Browser

Benchmark results for a Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-7D32 with an Intel Core i5-13600K processor.

browser.geekbench.com

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/20207926

Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-7D32 - Geekbench Browser

Benchmark results for a Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-7D32 with an Intel Core i5-13600K processor.

browser.geekbench.com

 

[BoomerD]

Quick question. Just installed a second WD SN770 NVMe drive 1TB. (I now have one 2TB WD SN770 NVMe, (Disk 1, C: the boot drive) a 1TB HP EX950 NVMe, (Disk 2, F: ) ,a 2TB WD_Black HDD (Disk 0, E: ),and this one, (Disk 3, D: ).
In disk management, the disks are listed like this:
I don't care about the order...which one is Disk 1, etc...or the lettering...but WHY do I have "healthy EFI System Partition and healthy Recovery Partition" in disk 2? I don't remember that one ever being a boot disk in the previous computer. (Maybe...it does have a Windows folder...that would explain the "recovery partition, but what about the EMI System partition?) Can I delete BOTH of those partitions without killing the rest of the data on the drive?

Maybe it's nothing...but together, it looks like they take up 600 MB. (probably inconsequential in a 1TB drive)

Looks like I have two instances of Windows 10 installed in different drives. Keep both or delete one? How best to delete one?

 

[igor_kavinski]

Those two??? Don't. Just don't!

 

[BoomerD]

View attachment 77045

Those two??? Don't. Just don't!

Definitely don't want to delete those. That's my primary boot drive. I'm more concerned with deleting the partitions in Disk 2.

 

[solidsnake1298]

View attachment 77045

Those two??? Don't. Just don't!

He said disk 2. The HP NVMe drive. Currently his F drive.

It's possible it came from the factory formatted with those partitions. The EFI partition is essential if the OS boots from that drive, which doesn't currently appear to be the case with the HP drive.

If you decide to go through with deleting those partitions to recover the 600MB, I would backup the data on the main partition before doing so. The disk management utility built into computer management may be able to delete those partitions and expand the partition your F drive currently occupies. If not, MiniTool and EaseUS have free partition managers.

 

[BoomerD]

He said disk 2. The HP NVMe drive. Currently his F drive.

It's possible it came from the factory formatted with those partitions. The EFI partition is essential if the OS boots from that drive, which doesn't currently appear to be the case with the HP drive.

If you decide to go through with deleting those partitions to recover the 600MB, I would backup the data on the main partition before doing so. The disk management utility built into computer management may be able to delete those partitions and expand the partition your F drive currently occupies. If not, MiniTool and EaseUS have free partition managers.

I have a brand-spanking new drive. I can move everything I want to keep onto that drive, then just format drive 2 into a single partition.

 

[BoomerD]

He said disk 2. The HP NVMe drive. Currently his F drive.

It's possible it came from the factory formatted with those partitions. The EFI partition is essential if the OS boots from that drive, which doesn't currently appear to be the case with the HP drive.

If you decide to go through with deleting those partitions to recover the 600MB, I would backup the data on the main partition before doing so. The disk management utility built into computer management may be able to delete those partitions and expand the partition your F drive currently occupies. If not, MiniTool and EaseUS have free partition managers.

Thanks. I moved the data I wanted to keep, formatted the drive, used mini tool to remove the partitions and create a data drive.