2007 Honda Accord Engine Failure

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: jeffrey
Update

One of the replacement cylinder heads is missing a part, so it might be another day. Yes, that's right, the replacement part is not right.

Also, Honda of Noth America contacted me for follow-up and I was told it was assigned to the wrong person and that he didn't cover my geographic area. WTF!

Better Business Bureau is next.

It pays to be tenacious in these cases. Re-contact Honda NA, ask for supervisors, be friendly but firm.

Bottom line :

There is no acceptable reason for them not to

(A)- Replace the motor with something new and unaffected by a serious mistake in manufacture.

(B)- Get you a loaner of at least a new Accord.

 

[jeffrey]

Complaint with the Better Business Bureau has been filed for the following:

Replace the failed engine.
Cover enginge under an extended powertrain warranty.
Provide for a loaner/rental car during repairs.

 

[CptCrunch]

keep up with the complaints Jeffrey, they should have given you a loaner no questions asked.

 

[jeffrey]

Originally posted by: Arkaign

Originally posted by: jeffrey
Update

One of the replacement cylinder heads is missing a part, so it might be another day. Yes, that's right, the replacement part is not right.

Also, Honda of Noth America contacted me for follow-up and I was told it was assigned to the wrong person and that he didn't cover my geographic area. WTF!

Better Business Bureau is next.

It pays to be tenacious in these cases. Re-contact Honda NA, ask for supervisors, be friendly but firm.

Bottom line :

There is no acceptable reason for them not to

(A)- Replace the motor with something new and unaffected by a serious mistake in manufacture.

(B)- Get you a loaner of at least a new Accord.

I re-contacted Honda of North America and demanded to speak to my case manager's supervisor. At first they resisted, but then I made a REAL stink and voila re-assigned. I am now assigned to the Regional Manager, whom I have left a message for and not heard back from yet.

 

[jeffrey]

Regional Manager has finally approved a rental car after 5 days without the car. Wheels are starting to turn.

 

[evident]

you're really dealing with a douchebag dealership it seems. it sucks that it had to be a honda dealership, but i guess there are bad apples w/ every car make . i would never do business there again. make sure you're in constant contact w/ the regional manager and let them know your situation and how the dealer has been treating you and if it's not too late, speak with the manager about going to another dealer to have the work done.

 

[jeffrey]

Latest and greatest:

I'm in my rental now for two days. Dealership called me and stated that they got in a replacement part for the replacement part (cylinder head they received was bad) and installed it. They turned on the engine and the engine had low oil pressure! They have ordered a new oil pump and will try and install tomorrow.

I still have not accepted this repair that they keep trying to piece together. I have received my Better Business Bureau case file information today and will submit tomorrow.

 

[Indyboy2]

low oil psi thats not good,lets see what causes low oil psi,excessive clearance cam,rods,mains,,bad oil pump but it did not have low oil psi before i assume?Plugged oil sump screen,or maybe when the installed the head they left a plug out somewhere in the head or maybe just the sender is bad wonder if they checked it with a manual gauge

 

[Vette73]

Yea with low oil pressure make sure you keep all reciepts and ask them how long the warranty is NOW.

 

[SparkyJJO]

timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

You get a quieter engine with less vibration. There are advantages. That said, I'd take a bit more noise if I didn't have to spend $800 replacing it every 105K miles (less for older models).

 

[SparkyJJO]

Originally posted by: thomsbrain

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

You get a quieter engine with less vibration. There are advantages. That said, I'd take a bit more noise if I didn't have to spend $800 replacing it every 105K miles (less for older models).

Hardly worth it IMO. Timing chain >>>> timing belt. And there are plenty of quiet motors with chains too. I'll never trust a motor with timing belt.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

Do you mean in general, or is there something special about the Honda design?

It doesn't cost much to replace it yourself, and occurs only once or twice in the lifespan of your average car.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

Do you mean in general, or is there something special about the Honda design?

It doesn't cost much to replace it yourself, and occurs only once or twice in the lifespan of your average car.

Timing belts in general. Let's put something in your motor, that is rubber, more prone to breakage, and that if it does break it will cause your pistons to collide with your valves, breaking stuff even worse. Terrific.

And not everyone has the know-how to replace that stuff themselves. I could, but what's the point, just avoid the problem altogether by getting something else.

 

[Bignate603]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
timing belt is the stupidest design ever. Dummies at honda should know better, there are problems with them and they still use it.

Do you mean in general, or is there something special about the Honda design?

It doesn't cost much to replace it yourself, and occurs only once or twice in the lifespan of your average car.

Timing belts in general. Let's put something in your motor, that is rubber, more prone to breakage, and that if it does break it will cause your pistons to collide with your valves, breaking stuff even worse. Terrific.

And not everyone has the know-how to replace that stuff themselves. I could, but what's the point, just avoid the problem altogether by getting something else.

A timing belt on an interference engine is a bad idea. It's more prone to break and when it does it can be catastrophic.

 

[thecritic]

Originally posted by: Bignate603
A timing belt on an interference engine is a bad idea. It's more prone to break and when it does it can be catastrophic.

Chains don't last forever either. Chain driven engines are also more sensitive to oil change intervals. In addition, when they do fail, the labor to replace a chain is significantly higher than a belt. Chain systems are hardly bulletproof either, just look at some of the early GM Ecotec engines. The chain tensioners failed on a number of those and it damaged the interference design. Or, know of anyone who owned an early VW VR6 engine? Those chain tensioners lasted around 100k, and new tensioners ran well over $1500.

Also, the weakest link in the timing belt system isn't the belt itself. In most cases, the belt is fine, it's the other components such as the tensioner, tensioner roller, idler roller or the water pump that fails, causing the belt to jump and damage the engine.

Still, I'm not a fan of the Honda V6 timing belts because they are very expensive to replace. A proper 105k service for a Honda V6, including valve adjustment, runs between $1200 to $1600.

 

[Bignate603]

Originally posted by: thecritic

Originally posted by: Bignate603
A timing belt on an interference engine is a bad idea. It's more prone to break and when it does it can be catastrophic.

Chains don't last forever either. Chain driven engines are also more sensitive to oil change intervals. In addition, when they do fail, the labor to replace a chain is significantly higher than a belt. Chain systems are hardly bulletproof either, just look at some of the early GM Ecotec engines. The chain tensioners failed on a number of those and it damaged the interference design. Or, know of anyone who owned an early VW VR6 engine? Those chain tensioners lasted around 100k, and new tensioners ran well over $1500.

Also, the weakest link in the timing belt system isn't the belt itself. In most cases, the belt is fine, it's the other components such as the tensioner, tensioner roller, idler roller or the water pump that fails, causing the belt to jump and damage the engine.

Still, I'm not a fan of the Honda V6 timing belts because they are very expensive to replace. A proper 105k service for a Honda V6, including valve adjustment, runs between $1200 to $1600.

Depends on the chain. I've got a buick V6 where the chain is as simple as you could ask for. Pop off the water pump and cover, change the chain and tensioners, and pop it all back together. Maybe a 2 hours shade tree mechanic job.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Originally posted by: thecritic

Originally posted by: Bignate603
A timing belt on an interference engine is a bad idea. It's more prone to break and when it does it can be catastrophic.

Chains don't last forever either. Chain driven engines are also more sensitive to oil change intervals. In addition, when they do fail, the labor to replace a chain is significantly higher than a belt. Chain systems are hardly bulletproof either, just look at some of the early GM Ecotec engines. The chain tensioners failed on a number of those and it damaged the interference design. Or, know of anyone who owned an early VW VR6 engine? Those chain tensioners lasted around 100k, and new tensioners ran well over $1500.

Also, the weakest link in the timing belt system isn't the belt itself. In most cases, the belt is fine, it's the other components such as the tensioner, tensioner roller, idler roller or the water pump that fails, causing the belt to jump and damage the engine.

Still, I'm not a fan of the Honda V6 timing belts because they are very expensive to replace. A proper 105k service for a Honda V6, including valve adjustment, runs between $1200 to $1600.

A lot cheaper and easier to just remember to change your oil on time. If you don't, you deserve to have your motor blow up
I know chains aren't bulletproof, but a metal chain by nature is stronger than a rubber belt and much less likely to break. That's all.

 

[BassBomb]

Nissan chains are great, they can well outlast 95% of the car itself.
My Nissan Stanza (sold at 200k km) got to well over 300k km before the people I sold it to decided to sell it.
Their other car Nissan Maxima got to almost 400k km
My I30 got to 240k km before we sold it.

None of the above ever needed a chain replacement

Back to the problem at hand, timing belt is a very normal maintenance when the car is getting somewhat old and always worthwhile

 

[thecritic]

Originally posted by: SparkyJJO
A lot cheaper and easier to just remember to change your oil on time. If you don't, you deserve to have your motor blow up
I know chains aren't bulletproof, but a metal chain by nature is stronger than a rubber belt and much less likely to break. That's all.

Breakage isn't the only issue with chains.

Chain stretch also occurs, but the tensioner takes care of that.

 

[fstime]

What about Audi's idiotic idea of putting the chain in the rear of the 4.2 engine, I think you have to remove the whole engine to replace the tensioners which tend to wear after a short period of time.

Believe me, if you see the complexity of that engine, it would scare most.

Guess it wasn't such a good idea to mount their engines 2 inches behind the radiator.

 

[halik]

If it's just a small imprint (not an actual chip), It's fine

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: BouZouki
What about Audi's idiotic idea of putting the chain in the rear of the 4.2 engine, I think you have to remove the whole engine to replace the tensioners which tend to wear after a short period of time.

Believe me, if you see the complexity of that engine, it would scare most.

Guess it wasn't such a good idea to mount their engines 2 inches behind the radiator.

WTF are you talking about? The old 4.2 had a timing belt in the front and the new one has a chain...

 

[fstime]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: BouZouki
What about Audi's idiotic idea of putting the chain in the rear of the 4.2 engine, I think you have to remove the whole engine to replace the tensioners which tend to wear after a short period of time.

Believe me, if you see the complexity of that engine, it would scare most.

Guess it wasn't such a good idea to mount their engines 2 inches behind the radiator.

WTF are you talking about? The old 4.2 had a timing belt in the front and the new one has a chain...

I'm talking about the 4.2 out of the Audi S4.

And from your post, it sounds like you knew what I was talking about.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: BouZouki

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: BouZouki
What about Audi's idiotic idea of putting the chain in the rear of the 4.2 engine, I think you have to remove the whole engine to replace the tensioners which tend to wear after a short period of time.

Believe me, if you see the complexity of that engine, it would scare most.

Guess it wasn't such a good idea to mount their engines 2 inches behind the radiator.

WTF are you talking about? The old 4.2 had a timing belt in the front and the new one has a chain...

I'm talking about the 4.2 out of the Audi S4.

And from your post, it sounds like you knew what I was talking about.

Haha 0 reading comprehension on my part, i thought you said the timing belt is in the rear ...