120mm case fans

[Spike]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
M1A is medium speed genius. We are talking about low speed in which case it would be the 12L.

Also i am using the Silent Pure Power 420Watt. THere is no "fan controller" with it.

-Kevin

Oh, so thats what L, M, and H meant. It just never made sense till now :roll:

The OP asked about best noise to cfm ratio and, unless you are going for absolute quiet and care nothing for airflow, a medium speed fan hooked to a controller is the way to go. There had also been discussions on reducing voltage and noise using a controller so I explained one of the most popular setups.

In my opinion, the L1 is a waste of space in any size. Though I have only purchased an 80mm L1 fan, the 80mm M1 WAY out did it in terms of airflow and noise (when hooked to a controller). There are many other reports where people had better luck buying a M1A and reducing the voltage rather than using a L1 to begin with.

Some of us don't just buy a fan based on reviews which are very subjective, especially in the area of noise and cooling. We test the fan ourselves, determine whether or not it works for us, and then explain our experiences to everyone else. I'm sorry if you have had a bad histroy with TT, mine has been better. Though I have only owned a few of their products, all of them (except for some very old dragon orb cooler I had) have worked exceptionally well.

As for your TT PSU, what was the reason again you are using it? What happened to the Allied you were using? Kinda funny when a TT is the psu that saves the day...

-spike

 

[Gamingphreek]

Well that Allied unit had been running for over a year, and just after i bought it AT came out with a review that is was crap. But hell what was i going to do. Im not just going to trash it. Unfortunately one of the high quality Globe fans in it was giving me problems so i opened it up and either they were all over the place with the glue or a capacitor blew. So my dad, agaisnt my will had ordered a TT PSU, to replace his, (bought against my will as well) Powmax case and PSU. So he said i could use it until i got my new PSU. Personally i would rather have a loud unstable computer than no computer at all.
Im kind of torn between the OCZ PSU's and the Seasonic units at the moment. Im leaning towards the Powerstream series right now, but anything has to be quieter than this PSU. Even the Allied was quieter and cooler.

I have the 12M fans, which are medium speed panaflos. I used it but it emits an electronic buzz when i lower the voltage to a decent level. That happens with most high speed fans as they were not designed to run nearly that slow.

I would buy Panaflo, Acoustifan, or Nexus ANY DAY over TT. Even if they were $10 more.

I also do not base everything off of review. Otherwise i wouldn't have a computer as everything has a downside. I do not know why you are sticking up so much for TT. You keep saying how quiet and how good quality they are. I have owned multiple products and all the reviews go along with my opinion.

http://silentpcreview.com/article63-page2.html
Do you see TT ANYWHERE on that list. I cant imagine why :roll: ?

-Kevin

 

[Spike]

Parents never listen to you when you reccomend parts, trust me on that. Dad went out and bought a Dell... it was one of the saddest days of my life... *sniff*

Anyway, as for TT, I am not trying to stick up for them, just relaying my experience. I don't care what name a brand has as long as it works as it is supposed to and works the way I want it (which is not always the same thing). The few TT products I have owned have, with the exception of one, worked the way they were supposed to and worked very well at that. I have no complaints about them. Now, even with this I still did not buy TT fans to cool my case, I chose Enermax and Panaflo due to reviews, personal experiences, price, and, yes, even looks (though this played a minor role).

Thankfully I don't get an electronic buzz from my medium and high output fans when they are undervolted. That being said, my controller is 7-12v ranged, so I have never gone below 7v. They might emit a noise at 6, but from 7 on up they are fine.

I have read that link you posted before and found it interesting. That was one of the deciding factors when I bought my Enermax 120mm fan. You always have to take those reviews with a grain of salt because those people are usually trying for the quietest possible computer, which is not my goal. I want a quiet but very cool running computer. This means I will take a little more noise if it means alot more cooling. This does not mean I want a vantec tornado anywhere near my case, but it does mean I go for a M1A instead of a L1A for cooling purposes.

-spike

EDIT** Oh, and of your choices listed above I would go with the OCZ psu. Though I have little experience with the high end PSU's, those seem to have better builds than most and are more stable. I plan to buy one to try out when I go to a A64 system next fall.

 

[NietzscheRCN]

I would like to commend spike for his thuroughness and unbiased opinion. He stated that a product was as good as the competition and didn't put the other products down unlike some people. Why can't everyone stop giving advise based on biases? I can't count how many times I have read a thread that went from answering a question to a bitch fight over who makes what better.

 

[Spike]

Originally posted by: NietzscheRCN
I would like to commend spike for his thuroughness and unbiased opinion. He stated that a product was as good as the competition and didn't put the other products down unlike some people. Why can't everyone stop giving advise based on biases? I can't count how many times I have read a thread that went from answering a question to a bitch fight over who makes what better.

Thanks for the compliment but it would be a lie to say I was unbiased . Everyone has their opinions on products, thats just the way we are. I am trying to just relate what little experience I have with cooling fans, most of which has been gained in the last 6-9 months, while minimizing the amount of bias I add.

People do like to complain and even do some flaming, but for the most part we are just trying to relate our opinions in the most expediant way, which sometimes involves not so kind words. Now lets all join hands around the fire and sing praises to quiet yet powerful 120mm case fans...

-spike

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: NietzscheRCN
I would like to commend spike for his thuroughness and unbiased opinion. He stated that a product was as good as the competition and didn't put the other products down unlike some people. Why can't everyone stop giving advise based on biases? I can't count how many times I have read a thread that went from answering a question to a bitch fight over who makes what better.

I am not putting the products down, nor do i have a bias. I said TT is for entry level, they are not in the same league as Acoustifan, Panaflo, and Nexus. What makes you think that you can slip that little sly comment in there. I even cited numerous sources to back my stance up including one of the most trusted sights on the web. Maybe you should contribute to the thread instead of jumping in here and flaming someone.

Parents never listen to you when you reccomend parts, trust me on that. Dad went out and bought a Dell... it was one of the saddest days of my life... *sniff*

I feel your pain man, i feel your pain...

Well i think we have both made our point, and i also think that both of us had very valid arguments. Personally as i said above, Thermaltake is for entry level PC's, they are not CRAP as i once stated, but they are in a league below the high end parts.

As for my PSU gosh... You know its so easy to give advice but then going and doing it yourself, ouch it can be painful.
My case has 4 80mm Panaflo 12L's running at a little below half speed, a MSI 5900XT-VTD128 (Stock cooler is garaunteed to run under 15dba), a 92mm Panaflo 12L on my Thermalright SLK-947U. I also have a Seagate Barracuda HDD. So i suppose my system is fairly quiet.
THats why im torn, the Seasonic is quieter but less powerful, and with less features, the OCZ is louder but more powerful and more features. The question for me is how much louder?

Does anyone know if i order the OCZ, and it is too loud for my tastes will Newegg just let me RMA it if i put in for the RMA the next day, or does the product have to be defective?

-Kevin

 

[Spike]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: NietzscheRCN
I would like to commend spike for his thuroughness and unbiased opinion. He stated that a product was as good as the competition and didn't put the other products down unlike some people. Why can't everyone stop giving advise based on biases? I can't count how many times I have read a thread that went from answering a question to a bitch fight over who makes what better.

I am not putting the products down, nor do i have a bias. I said TT is for entry level, they are not in the same league as Acoustifan, Panaflo, and Nexus. What makes you think that you can slip that little sly comment in there. I even cited numerous sources to back my stance up including one of the most trusted sights on the web. Maybe you should contribute to the thread instead of jumping in here and flaming someone.

Parents never listen to you when you reccomend parts, trust me on that. Dad went out and bought a Dell... it was one of the saddest days of my life... *sniff*

I feel your pain man, i feel your pain...

Well i think we have both made our point, and i also think that both of us had very valid arguments. Personally as i said above, Thermaltake is for entry level PC's, they are not CRAP as i once stated, but they are in a league below the high end parts.

As for my PSU gosh... You know its so easy to give advice but then going and doing it yourself, ouch it can be painful.
My case has 4 80mm Panaflo 12L's running at a little below half speed, a MSI 5900XT-VTD128 (Stock cooler is garaunteed to run under 15dba), a 92mm Panaflo 12L on my Thermalright SLK-947U. I also have a Seagate Barracuda HDD. So i suppose my system is fairly quiet.
THats why im torn, the Seasonic is quieter but less powerful, and with less features, the OCZ is louder but more powerful and more features. The question for me is how much louder?

Does anyone know if i order the OCZ, and it is too loud for my tastes will Newegg just let me RMA it if i put in for the RMA the next day, or does the product have to be defective?

-Kevin

I believe that for Newegg you have to have some reason to return it but you can come up with just about anything. I have heard of people reuturning them claiming that they were not as "stable" as they wanted (variance of less than .5% on rails but it worked). You can usually get them to ignore the restocking fee, especially if you turn right around and buy a seasonic from them. I had them tell me they would wave the fee if I bought something from them within 30 days... and I did .

Yah, fans are easy to buy and compare because they are fairly cheap. A $100+ PSU is a little bit more of a jump so in that area I tend to lean more heavily on reviews/users experience. As of right now, when I build the OCZ will be my choice, but that could change. I have heard that they are not super-silent, but defitly not loud. I say buy it, try it, love it/hate it. Find a problem with it and return it if you hate it or keep it and tell me how much you love it so I can be jealous!

 

[xbassman]

Originally posted by: Mucker
Not very suprising at 12V, they are built to move air. They're pretty acceptable at low voltage.....even though someone that doesn't even own one will tell you differently.....

m

I wasn't fully awake yet, so I guess I didn't make myself clear.
Yes the TT fans are loud @ 12V and Yes they are loud at lowered voltage (probably 6 or 7 volts) using the TT fan controller.

His heatsink has a Panaflo 80mm U1A (38db) on it and you can't hear it over the TT's even when they are at the lowest speed.

Anyway, this morning I noticed the Yate Loon in my wife's Fortron PSU seems to be taking a dump, so I ordered this.

Somebody here spotted a discussion of them on SPCR. I wound up ordering 2 of them for 13.98 + 4.40 shipping. SPCR users were noticing the similarities to the Nexus fans (Yate Loon manufactured)

I'll let you guys know if they are any good. The price is definately right!
Oh, the Op @ SPCR said these are low speed (1350rpm) fans

 

[Mucker]

Originally posted by: Gamingphreek

Originally posted by: Mucker
Not very suprising at 12V, they are built to move air. They're pretty acceptable at low voltage.....even though someone that doesn't even own one will tell you differently.....

m

THese sly little comments isn't helping matters jackass.

The fact is TT stats are way off on that fan. 21Dba for a fan spinning at ~2200RPM. No not gonna happen. Panaflos (10000000x better than TT, yes i own many panaflos) running at ~2000 RPM are rated at 35dba. TT stats are way off and people know this. There silent pure powere PSU's are some of the noisiest things on this planet (Yes i am running one).

You keep saying at full speed they are loud. Well bring it down to 7v almost any fan would be quiet! But the fact is they are not as quiet as the Acoustifan the NExus, and the Panaflo. Those fans are quiet even at full speed.

As for the question about why these fans are so good. Well Nexus and Acoustifan use extremely high quality Ball Bearing motors, and spin slower but have a more aerodynamic fin. Panaflo developed a Fluid bearing (touted Hydro Wave Bearing) for a fan, much like the ones used on modern HDD (Except WD).

-Kevin

Resorting to name calling now Kev? Taking this a little personally aren't you? I stand by what I say: YOU ARE TOTALLY AND ABSOLUTELY UNQUALIFIED TO TALK ABOUT THE TT 120mm FAN. So just stop. You are allowed to rate the fans you have used, anything else you have to say is simply a fart in the wind.......

m :heart:

 

[NietzscheRCN]

I did not mean to flame anyone. I just wanted to point out that people have a tendency to become very caught up in unbecoming antics. I my self have done this on occasion when provoked. I am aware there are many higher end models availible that would be quieter perhaps. I do think for the money Tt fans undervolted are a good buy. Yes you can buy better, but is it worth double for what is a VERY small difference in dB's(And it is when undervolting). Tt's move air and that is what cools, yes undervolting them to be quieter could be considered counter intuitive. When you consider that it pushes as much air and is pretty much as quiet and cheaper what is there not to like. And the arguement that you have to use a fan controller is pretty mute in my opinion because any good psu comes with a fan only connector that is thermally controled and keeps voltage at bay. In terms of psu's I have the same conundrum. I am currently in the market for a quality, quiet psu. The OCZ is rock solid in terms of voltage as long as you stay in the powerstream family. You did not specify what seasonic you where looking at, but in general the are high quality psu's. I am looking into the S12-500 for my system. It uses a 120mm fan with every availible technology they offer. If you prefer 80mm then the tornado is great as well.

 

[Mucker]

I have an Antec 550 True Control, with 2 fan only connectors and built in fan controller. It has the ability to control both of my 120mm fans (120mm TT rear and 120mm Antec front) as well as the 2 PSU fans (92mm Antec and 80mm TT). I have a seperate Fan Mate 2 controller for my Zalman CPU fan. When I set the fan controllers to my desired noise/temperature liking, I maintain a very quiet system. The only noise that is prominent is from the hard drives whining. I have 1 WD Raptor, and 1 Seagate 7200rpm. The whine from the drives is much more distracting than the fans, it wouldn't matter if I bought the most expensive quiet fan on the planet or the cheapest at low voltage. It is a moot issue for me, all fans are whisper quiet, so I go with the least expensive ones.......leaves me with more greens backs to buy more :beer: :heart:

m

 

[Gamingphreek]

Yes but what you neglect or do not know that for every 1dba increase IIRC it is double the amount of sound. The sound increases exponentially ^2. Its a moot point now, TT fans are not bad but they are not high end nor are they meant to be.

As for the PSU i bit the bullet and bought the 520Watt OCZ Powerstream. If it is too loud, which it shouldn't be then ill return it in favour of the seasonic. The OCZ's are top of the line, second only to PCP&C.

-Kevin

 

[Mucker]

I live in a hot climate and years ago had an Antec case with stock 80mm fans. I decided to replace them with PC Power and Cooling 80mm Silencer fans. Boy, they were quiet, but you know what, I couldn't feel any air being pushed. Thing is, I couldn't speed up these silent running fans. They simply didn't work for me. At least with a high speed fan, you can slow it down to very tolerable noise levels and when you need cooling, just turn the knob! It is the best of both worlds solution and that is why I don't buy into the "silent fan" concept. The vendors have figured this out and are now sticking it to everyone with their slick advertising. They're laughing all the way to the bank. You could plot dBa vs. cfm/rpm on every fan sold and the curve would nearly be linear. You can only do so much with blade and bearing design. Hard drive noise and ambient noise will nullify any difference in dB between any fan turning the same rpm. I am sorry, I just don't buy into the silent fan arguement.

m

 

[NietzscheRCN]

Not to split hairs, but your equation is wrong. 10dBa increase is a doubling in perceived sound and vice versa. Sound does not increase in a linear fashion either, it is logrithmic.