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Zen 2 for Distributed Computing: Any interest?

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biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
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If you can tell me how its doing that would be great.
EDIT: Calculations corrected for 8 hour tasks or 3 tasks per day.

Your 3900X is doing about 32,352 24264 ppd based on average points of 40 tasks (337 points/task).

The Rosetta tasks are highly heterogeneous though so the the RAC will be the best measure over a long period of time.

My 3700x (16 threads) is doing about 23,104 17088 PPD based on 60 tasks (356 points/tasks).

My 2700X (16 threads) does about 13104 PPD based on 60 tasks (273 points/task).

Mark's 2970WX (48 threads) does about 36432 PPD based on 60 tasks (253 points/task).

I find my 3700X was unstable and the source of the problem was RAM speed. I had to clock back from 3200 to 2933. EDIT: My 2700X was stable @ 3200. I wonder if my x470 MB is the source of that problem.
 
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Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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Problem is the agesa version in the bios compatible with 3000 series most likely. I have TWO 3900x's One uses AGESA 1.0.0.1 and unstable over 2666. The other is agesa 1.0.0.2 and is stable at 3733 !

So how are my 2 doing ? Especially the one with the 1070ti, that should be the fast one.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,038
5,856
126
I could use a 240mm AIO WC kit for my 3600. This R5 1600 95W stock heatsink just isn't working out. My Rosewill Magnetar case has room for mounting a 240mm rad in front, according to specs. (And a 360mm, if I remove the 5.25" bay, but I have a BD-RE drive in there, that I don't want to get rid of.)

Will trade my R5 1600 (used, working, that came out of this rig), for $70 Paypal, that I can use to order a CoolerMaster ML Lite 240mm RGB AIO WC kit (currently $54.99 after promo, for like 24 more hours). ($70 being enough to pay for shipping the R5 1600 out to you too, because I'm flat broke right now.)

Otherwise, without the WC, I'm going to have to sit out the rest of the PrimeGrid race, my CPU got to 99C, and stayed at 94.5C, even after reducing my load to 40% CPU cores (4 threads of PrimeGrid) in BOINC. Ambient temps is like 85-90F in my computer lab. At least I have some fans blowing on me. :(
 
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Markfw

CPU Moderator, VC&G Moderator, Elite Member
Super Moderator
May 16, 2002
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I could use a 240mm AIO WC kit for my 3600. This R5 1600 95W stock heatsink just isn't working out. My Rosewill Magnetar case has room for mounting a 240mm rad in front, according to specs. (And a 360mm, if I remove the 5.25" bay, but I have a BD-RE drive in there, that I don't want to get rid of.)

Will trade my R5 1600 (used, working, that came out of this rig), for $70 Paypal, that I can use to order a CoolerMaster ML Lite 240mm RGB AIO WC kit (currently $54.99 after promo, for like 24 more hours). ($70 being enough to pay for shipping the R5 1600 out to you too, because I'm flat broke right now.)

Otherwise, without the WC, I'm going to have to sit out the rest of the PrimeGrid race, my CPU got to 99C, and stayed at 94.5C, even after reducing my load to 40% CPU cores (4 threads of PrimeGrid) in BOINC. Ambient temps is like 85-90F in my computer lab. At least I have some fans blowing on me. :(
I wish you told me that before I ordered one for $105
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,038
5,856
126
Well, sorry, I didn't know that I needed a WC kit then. :(

Nevermind, I'm going to try to put this 120mm AIO WC kit on, see what it can do. My experience with my other identical ML120L unit, was that it was far less effective than the 240mm AIO WC was. That way I don't need to sell anything, or pay anyone back.

But if someone wants my old R5 1600, I'll still sell it for $70 Paypal, CPU only. (And if someone buys that, I will order a ML240L RGB for $54.99 + tax, if in the next 24 hours.)

(And I do have RAM + boards, just ask in PM.)

Edit: I spied on my shelf, one of those old-fashioned high-end AMD coolers, the 125W TDP ones with the four heatpipes (rectangular), 80mm fan, and copper core, brand-new. Pulled it off the shelf, used the pre-applied paste, cleaned the paste off of my CPU, attached the two clips back on, and... still over 90C, with the case sides off, the two GPUs NOT crunching or mining, only running 4 PrimeGrid threads? Whaaaat?
 
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IEC

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Jun 10, 2004
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Looks like "good" chiplets are capable of 4400MHz+ at 1.35V while "bad" chiplets are capable of 4300MHz or so at 1.35V based on what I'm seeing on Reddit as well as on my chip (1st chiplet = 4425 @ 1.35V, 2nd chiplet = 4325 @ 1.35V). Substantially less voltage is needed for 4.0, 4.1, or 4.2 GHz clocks. You can also do per-core and per-CCX clocks to min/max your OC per core. This actually seems to be the best approach right now on Zen 2.

Locking 4500MHz and running Cinebench R20 led to it beating my OC'd 8700K in ST performance, but this might only be reasonably attainable with 3950X or later production Zen 2. Early chiplets don't seem to want to run much beyond 4400MHz (and on bad chips, 4300MHz) without high voltage.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,038
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Ok, I adjusted DVID (Vcore) to -0.102V, and DVID (SOC) to "Normal" rather than "Auto". (In either case, vSoC was reported in Ryzen Master as 1.1V.)

Weird thing is, temps seem to not be getting as high, with MORE threads running. Four threads, six threads, 95C. Ten threads, 89C, and Core#6 is sleeping most of the time.

I'm having difficulty understanding how these CPUs work, as far as work done versus heat output.

I also don't understand why my 3600 idles at 59-66C, with nothing "crunching", in Windows, with the "Ryzen Balanced Power Plan".

Did I get an extremely poorly-binned CPU? Or did it degrade? I've heard of some dying completely, in Gigabyte older pre-X570 boards, with these early BIOSes.

When I shut the PC down to change out the heatsink, it did take quite a bit of time to boot up again, and the BIOS settings had gotten reset (but not the time). Not sure why.

Edit: Anyways, happy ending, I guess (?). Back on PrimeGrid, 10 threads working, 86C, running an older AMD 125W 4-heatpipe copper-cored stock heatsink w/80mm fan. (Maybe 60mm fan?)

Edit: Now why does Task Manager report 3.25Ghz, and Ryzen Master reports 3.8Ghz+?
 
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biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,770
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The PrimeGrid PPSllr app is AVX2 so it draws a lot of power. The bios on my x470 board is not supporting overclocking on my 3700X (Core performance boost is disabled?) so it runs at the base clock of 3.6 GHz under full load. For the PPSllr app, I get the max PPD by turning off SMT in the bios and running 1 task per core. Alternatively, you can simulate SMT "off" by only using 50% of the threads in the boinc manager computing preferences.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,038
5,856
126
Yeah, running BOINC with 50% of CPU count, for PrimeGrid PPSllr, pushes temps in Ryzen Master up to 94.5C and pins them there, whereas, running all 12 threads (100% CPU count), on my R5 3600, has temps of 91-92C.

I tried a manual OC of 4000Mhz, and 1.350V. It sort of worked, but with 12 threads working, temps hit 117C, then the PC rebooted. Not sure if it was because of temps, or because it needed more voltage (because of temps).
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,770
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Do you have precision boost overdrive enabled in the bios? It's supposed to be disabled by default in the x570 boards. For PPSllr, I wouldn't overclock at all. Alternatively, you could choose "normal" and then "increase" the negative vcore offset until you are comfortable with the temps. The vcore on my 3700X is 1.06 @3.6 GHz.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,038
5,856
126
I just bought another 3700X. I really shouldn't have, but damn, I am really caught up in the excitement!
I just did too!
Hey, you're making my lone 3600 jelly. :p

Anyways, thinking of possibly replacing my 2700 @ 4.0Ghz, with something 3rd-Gen, not sure what at this point. It's a nice dream, I already spent money that I didn't really have, on the 3600. But I'm cranking away on PrimeGrid with it, putting it to good use.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,665
263
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Are you sure your mbrd isn't over-volting your cpu? What's the default for these cpu's?

I just bought another 3700X. I really shouldn't have, but damn, I am really caught up in the excitement!
And I've decided I'll be joining you guys in the near future :D, but 1st I needed to find out what mbrd I want, I know I want the X570 chipset, I'm not bothered by the few extra watts it burns over earlier chipsets as hopefully the zen2 setup will use much less power than my ivybridge-e rig anyway & much better features :). Btw, it'll be my 1st AMD rig in, err, years! Since I bought a S754 for my 2nd rig in the mid 2000s!

Talking of power, what power draw figures are you guys getting from the Zen2? (wall figures preferably).
 
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biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
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Talking of power, what power draw figures are you guys getting from the Zen2? (wall figures preferably).
I have some power draw data from the wall for a 3700X@3.6 GHz in an X470 board.

ODLK project: 91 watts
Rosetta@home: 101 watts
PrimeGrid PPSllr project (AVX2):
2 threads per task: 140 watts
SMT off in bios and 1 task per core: 124 watts

I did order an X570 board for the second 3700X: Gigabyte X570 AORUS Pro WiFi (Review)
 
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phoenicis

Member
Nov 26, 2017
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I got tired of hating you all due to new toy envy so I took the plunge with a 3700X and Taichi X570.

Took IEC's advice to tame with a 100mv offset which leaves it running at 4.1GHz, with cpu temp of 71C, pulling 161W from the wall (with 1080ti idling) running PPSllr Primegrid tasks. Overkilled it with a Liqtech II 280mm AIO I already had lying around although even that had it at 85C at stock.

3700X @4.1GHz PrimeGrid PPSllr x 8 tasks HT on @ 1800 secs per task
7960X @3.6GHz PrimeGrid PPSllr x 15 tasks HT on @ 1450 secs per task

By way of comparison, a quick test with a stock Ryzen 2700, x 7 tasks HT on, achieved roughly 3900 secs per task.

The 7960X (AVX512) could maybe do better but it has finally met it's match with this sub-project and is thermally throttling :eek:
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,770
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3700X @4.1GHz PrimeGrid PPSllr x 8 tasks HT on @ 1800 secs per task
At 3.6 GHz with SMT off and 8 tasks per 8 cores, I see 1760 seconds for each task. Overclocking doesn't seem to help on PPSllr tasks so what's limiting? Cache speed or the links between CPU and CCX's? Clearly I don't understand how these processors work.
 

phoenicis

Member
Nov 26, 2017
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At 3.6 GHz with SMT off and 8 tasks per 8 cores, I see 1760 seconds for each task. Overclocking doesn't seem to help on PPSllr tasks so what's limiting? Cache speed or the links between CPU and CCX's? Clearly I don't understand how these processors work.
Me too! There's definitely something interesting going on. At stock, the cpu had a higher Cinebench score but was slower at Primegrid despite drawing more power. There appears to be some kind of limitation taking place with AVX2 that isn't related to clockspeed or temps. Amps perhaps? I really dunno :confused:
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,770
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I tried underclocking to 3.4 GHz but I must have screwed up the settings in the bios since the computer froze up after 10 minutes or so. :(
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,665
263
126
I have some power draw data from the wall for a 3700X@3.6 GHz in an X470 board.

ODLK project: 91 watts
Rosetta@home: 101 watts
PrimeGrid PPSllr project (AVX2): 2 threads per task: 140 watts, SMT off in bios and 1 task per core: 124 watts

I did order an X570 board for the second 3700X: Gigabyte X570 AORUS Pro WiFi (Review)
Nice:cool:, so for R@H your 8C16T beast pulls just 101w (16 threads?), whilst my i7 4930k @4.1 GHz 6C12T running 12 threads pulls 248w!! Lol.
Is there anyway to benchmark Rosetta?
 

biodoc

Diamond Member
Dec 29, 2005
5,770
1,209
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s there anyway to benchmark Rosetta?
There's no easy way since the tasks are so heterogeneous. There are times when I'll fire up a spreadsheet and calculate the average run time and points for 60-80 tasks and then calculate PPD.
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
23,665
263
126
Ok thanks. Trying to think of a project that's easy to compare speeds........ Milkyway@home I think, as long as we choose the same credit WU results.
Know any other projects that are easy & consistent to benchmark? Folding maybe?
Would like a direct comparision to my rig, & current gen Intel's.
 

phoenicis

Member
Nov 26, 2017
56
63
61
I tried underclocking to 3.4 GHz but I must have screwed up the settings in the bios since the computer froze up after 10 minutes or so. :(
So I noticed within HWInfo that the 3700X is throttling when left to PBO with cores taking it in turns to drop to 3.2GHz from their typical 4.1GHz. It's likely the power limit being exceeded as PBO seems to throw way too much voltage at the cpu ….. in the region of 1.275, after droop, when boosting to 4.1GHz crunching Primegrid.

I tried to replicate your 3.6Ghz approach but didn't do as well with PPSllr tasks taking 1850 secs (8 tasks SMT on) although power draw from the wall did drop to 139W. Perhaps my memory speed/timings aren't as good or I've lost the silicon lottery.

Other alternatives I've tested are:
4Ghz @ 1.113 vcore giving 1645 secs per task pulling 152w
4.1GHz @ 1.175 vcore giving 1580 secs per task pulling 167w

Until somebody smarter than me manages to tame auto boost for AVX2 workloads I'll probably stick with the 4GHz settings .

Edit: Needed a bit more to be stable at 4Ghz. Currently sitting at 1.125 after droop.
 
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