Yet another raise thread: Well below mean&median wages in the region

[Jeff7]

I started off my current job right around the time the 2009 recession's effects were settling in. A few weeks after I was hired, a hiring freeze was announced, and over the following year or two there were three rounds of layoffs.
From what I can tell, I had received glowing reviews from my university instructors, and my employer was keen on swiping me up right as I graduated.
I was facing the prospect of student loan payments starting, which were going to be chipping away at the $30k in debt. A job was good at that point....and I really never learned how to negotiate anything, so I took the initial offer.


5 years later, I consistently get positive reviews. I'm primarily a mechanical engineer, but I can also do some circuit design and layout, and program embedded microcontrollers. I get the idea that crossover like that between mechanical and electrical is not all that common; I remember back in college that the mechs were on the verge of suicide any time Ohm's Law was brought up.

I've been looking over some of the Bureau of Labor Statistics pages on similar jobs in this area.
It looks like someone's been getting a damn good deal here, and it hasn't been me.
Getting me up to either the median or mean (there's not a large dollar difference between the two, though the median tends to be lower) would mean somewhere around a 40%-55% increase over where I'm at now.



I had a sense that I was worth more than what I've been getting, but I hadn't realized that the gap was so substantial.
Can anyone weigh in on this? What are the odds of getting that kind of an increase?





I'll say this much though, it's decent working there. The employee burden for health insurance is fairly low; I'm paying a few dollars a week out of pocket. 401k match is good for up to 3% of salary (50% on 6%) though the investment options are high on the fee side, casual work environment, good direct coworkers, and they look to keep the workweek at 40hrs when they can. If it gets slow in the winter, they don't typically look to send people home, but will instead try to find old projects or tasks that still need to get done. There is also generally good investment into new equipment to help keep the workforce productive, at least so far as tools for the shop floor are concerned; it'd be nice to see more investment in PCs though. SSDs are pretty cheap now; it feels weird to have programs take 30-60 seconds to load.

 

[postmortemIA]

Your company is thinking like it is still 2009. Most have wised up (both employees and employers) due to demand for engineers. What that means is if they don't give salaries close to medians, people leave, and they can't find replacements.

 

[Jeff7]

Your company is thinking like it is still 2009. Most have wised up (both employees and employers) due to demand for engineers. What that means is if they don't give salaries close to medians, people leave, and they can't find replacements.

I'll say this much, it did scare the company. The banking industry was a major source of revenue. With the recession, any renovations, upgrades, and new construction in that industry just stopped. They were too busy closing locations.
We've since branched out into other market sectors to get some diversification going, and it's been quite lucrative thus far with just the surface-scratchings of market penetration.

 

[tnt118]

I'm not in that field, but from what I see and read that kind of boost usually takes jumping ship to another employer. Maybe you could get a counter offer if you do find something and would prefer to stay but companies rarely seem interested in giving that much if their hand isn't forced.

 

[MongGrel]

In a bit of a similar situation myself, with a smaller company from the sounds of it.

 

[lxskllr]

Not familiar with the field, but I'd say the odds of getting a 50% raise are as close to zero without being zero as you can get :^D

If you don't want to jump ship, bring it to their attention that you /could/, and you'd like some extra money. Anything is better than nothing, and if they make an effort to get you adequately compensated over time, that'll slowly bring you into line with everyone else. If you think they're jerking you around, start looking for another job. No matter how much you like it now, being grossly underpaid will start eating at you.

 

[SunnyD]

You sound like you work at my company.

I've been job shopping for the last 8 months.

 

[Fritzo]

Haven't had a raise since 2007. As a result, I found another job after 17 years and put in my resignation on Friday. Merry Christmas boss!

 

[Engineer]

Your company is thinking like it is still 2009. Most have wised up (both employees and employers) due to demand for engineers. What that means is if they don't give salaries close to medians, people leave, and they can't find replacements.

From looking at some of the starting offer pay for engineers, I wouldn't make a statement like you did above at all. There are those that indeed recognize that you'll have to pay to get talent and then there are those that are floating amounts so obscenely low that all you can do is laugh at them. I'm sure they sit back and wonder why their ads are running 6 months at a time, with obviously no people filling the positions.

Haven't had a raise since 2007. As a result, I found another job after 17 years and put in my resignation on Friday. Merry Christmas boss!

and this is what it's going to take to finally break the pattern of low wages and low starting offers.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Can anyone weigh in on this? What are the odds of getting that kind of an increase?

The odds depend upon the job market in your area. Can you go to another company and make that kind of money? Can your current employer find somebody to replace you at somewhere around your current salary? You have almost ZERO chance of getting that kind of raise in one fell swoop. You'd need to either move to a different company or work something out with the current job where you're given regular increases over 5 years or so to get you up to where you belong.

 

[Jumpem]

Just be grateful that you are employed in your field.

 

[Ns1]

Unless you have an offer near the median I'm not sure what incentive they have to give you more money.

But fuck it ask for more money. What's the worst that could happen?

 

[Engineer]

Just be grateful that you are employed in your field.

and at this point, that's why the employers can set wages so low and not give raises for years upon years. They know employers are afraid and are sticking it to them. Sales and profits going up and up but hey, let's not give those that are helping produce these rising sales/profits any of it because they won't go anywhere because they are afraid.

 

[Jumpem]

and at this point, that's why the employers can set wages so low and not give raises for years upon years. They know employers are afraid and are sticking it to them. Sales and profits going up and up but hey, let's not give those that are helping produce these rising sales/profits any of it because they won't go anywhere because they are afraid.

I wouldn't be complaining about my pay after surviving three layoff events, while many of my former coworkers are much worse off.

 

[Engineer]

I wouldn't be complaining about my pay after surviving three layoff events, while many of my former coworkers are much worse off.

At what point do you finally stand up and say enough is enough? 95%+ of the gains in the country are going to the top. When does the guy in the trenches get his/her fair share of the growth? I suppose if everyone has that attitude, then never.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

You won't get a raise like that at your current company. Go test the market and see what your offers are (NEVER tell a prospective employer what you make now; tell them what you're LOOKING for).

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Just be grateful that you are employed in your field.

I wouldn't be complaining about my pay after surviving three layoff events, while many of my former coworkers are much worse off.

Aren't you the guy that comes into almost all vacation threads and complains what a waste they are, mainly because you can't afford them? With the attitude above, I'm not surprised. No offense intended, but the attitude above is for people with no skills (or at least, those who don't know how to value their skills) who have to cling to whatever they can get. Not marketable? Make yourself marketable. Have a plan and a strategy and implement it. I implemented my medium-term strategy in 2009 and it paid off in 2013 with a 70% raise when I told my former employer to go fuck themselves - after, of course, I made them jump through hoops to try to get me more money.

At what point do you finally stand up and say enough is enough? 95%+ of the gains in the country are going to the top. When does the guy in the trenches get his/her fair share of the growth? I suppose if everyone has that attitude, then never.

Exactly. I worked at a company where the "You're lucky to have a job" attitude was prevalent. Never again.

 

[purbeast0]

a major reason i left my first job out of college after 5 years was because my salary with 5 years experience there wasn't even close to what the median is. best thing i ever did for my career was leave that place. less than 3 years later, i was making more than double what i was making when i left that company.

 

[purbeast0]

You won't get a raise like that at your current company. Go test the market and see what your offers are (NEVER tell a prospective employer what you make now; tell them what you're LOOKING for).

this x 1000.

i wish i wasn't such a pussy when i was always job hunting as someone new in the work force.

if they ask you your current salary, tell them that it's irrelevant and that part of the reason you are looking is because you feel underpaid. just tell them what you're looking to make.

confidence is huge when looking for new jobs. something that changed my mentality big time was when i started having the attitude that i'm doing a company a favor for me working for them. most people (myself included when i was younger in my career) have the mindset that the company is doing you a favor for hiring you, and they try to act that way.

i simply act the other way now and the confidence has gotten me a lot more money than i had prior, and with a much better company.

 

[brianmanahan]

sounds like it is time to go job hunting!

when people ask for your current salary, make sure to factor in EVERYTHING - benefits, insurance, bonuses, the works.

i made the switch to a new company this year. had been working at a place with a pension, but they used that as an excuse to pay below market. i was like 40th percentile pay for my type of job.

so i spent a year or so looking around, and finally found another place that also had a pension but would pay at least 70th percentile pay as well. liking it so far.

 

[Fritzo]

You won't get a raise like that at your current company. Go test the market and see what your offers are (NEVER tell a prospective employer what you make now; tell them what you're LOOKING for).

Not telling a prospective employer what you're making now is difficult. If you don't tell them, you'll look uncooperative. If you lie and they find out, you're untrustworthy.

 

[MongGrel]

At what point do you finally stand up and say enough is enough? 95%+ of the gains in the country are going to the top. When does the guy in the trenches get his/her fair share of the growth? I suppose if everyone has that attitude, then never.

This.

And sorry I had to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETegyBzAQnc

 

[Engineer]

Not telling a prospective employer what you're making now is difficult. If you don't tell them, you'll look uncooperative. If you lie and they find out, you're untrustworthy.

Doesn't mean that you can't tell them what you expect to jump ship and move jobs though. I asked for $10,000 more than what I was making when I moved jobs last time (and they knew what I was making). I didn't get the full amount - instead $6,000 - but after factoring in insurance gains, it was still close to $10 grand.

 

[Jumpem]

At what point do you finally stand up and say enough is enough? 95%+ of the gains in the country are going to the top. When does the guy in the trenches get his/her fair share of the growth? I suppose if everyone has that attitude, then never.

I see your point of view. I just don't complain after many layoffs at my place of employment. I'm just happy to be working.

As for the people at the top, I would like to see a return of fifties era tax rates.

 

[Jumpem]

Aren't you the guy that comes into almost all vacation threads and complains what a waste they are, mainly because you can't afford them? With the attitude above, I'm not surprised. No offense intended, but the attitude above is for people with no skills (or at least, those who don't know how to value their skills) who have to cling to whatever they can get. Not marketable? Make yourself marketable. Have a plan and a strategy and implement it. I implemented my medium-term strategy in 2009 and it paid off in 2013 with a 70% raise when I told my former employer to go fuck themselves - after, of course, I made them jump through hoops to try to get me more money.

I'm an engineer, so I have marketable skills. There just is not a lot of work in my area, so I hold on to what I can. That is the feeling of most of my coworkers as well. People don't want to be forced to move due to a job loss.

As for vacations, I can afford them. I just don't see the value in them above other things in life. If my house and student loans were paid off, I was maxing out two 401ks and two IRAs, and had college funds for my kids I would spend after that on vacations. At this point I can't see spending $5k on something so temporary. :\