Yet another FL "stand your ground" case

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
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http://www.news-journalonline.com/breakingnews/2012/05/flagler-beach-man-accused-of-killing-neighbor-over-barking-dogs-freed-from-jail.html

I guess this guy claimed verbal threats alone were enough to justify deadly force, shot him 5 times, twice in the back as he fled...


"Flagler Beach man accused of killing neighbor over barking dogs freed from jail

Paul Miller, the man jailed after being accused of shooting his Flagler Beach neighbor five times -- including twice in the back -- during an argument over Miller's barking dogs, is free after posting bail.

Miller, 65, is charged in the slaying of his neighbor Dana Mulhall, 52, on March 14, according to a police report. Mulhall was unarmed when Miller opened fire, investigators said.

Miller posted $300,000 bail and was out of the Flagler County Inmate Facility on Tuesday night, a jail official said.

Miller shot Mulhall five times as Mulhall fled, investigators said.

One of Miller's defense attorneys, Melissa Moore, had argued during a bail hearing that the shooting fell under Florida's controversial Stand Your Ground law because Mulhall had threatened Miller. The Stand Your Ground law has drawn national criticism after neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman shot Trayvon Martin to death in Sanford. Martin, 17, was unarmed and walking back to his father's house when Zimmerman started following him. Zimmerman shot Martin after a confrontation and has claimed self-defense.

Zimmerman has been charged with second-degree murder and a state task force is currently examining the Stand Your Ground law.

Assistant State Attorney Mark Johnson has stated that the Stand Your Ground law doesn't fit the Miller case.

"Our position is that the Stand Your Ground law would not apply," Johnson said after a recent hearing. "There will be arguments made by both sides, and it will be up to a jury to decide which argument is correct."

Miller's barking dogs had been the source of a clash with Mulhall in January but on the afternoon of March 14 the situation turned deadly. Miller was inside his garage getting ready for a fishing trip when he heard Mulhall yelling at the two dogs, investigators said. Miller took his 9mm pistol from a cabinet and then walked outside and sat on his porch, investigators said. Mulhall walked out of his house and the two began to argue.

Some kids who walked by before the shooting said they saw Mulhall yelling and cursing at Miller.

Circuit Judge Raul Zambrano set bail at $300,000, which means Miller would have to put up $30,000 and an additional $300,000 worth of collateral to free him from the jail, said Doug Williams, the other defense attorney working on Miller's case. "
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
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Oct 30, 2000
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Completely different.

Shooters is at fault based on the information provided.

Especially with shots in the back.
 

Lithium381

Lifer
May 12, 2001
12,455
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This is not relevant to stand-your-ground . . . . they're trying to connect it to TM/GZ to get media
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
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Any questions?

Apparently one of his lawyers is/was thinking of tacking that tact with this comment, "One of Miller's defense attorneys, Melissa Moore, had argued during a bail hearing that the shooting fell under Florida's controversial Stand Your Ground law because Mulhall had threatened Miller."
This should be a quick decision by any jury that even the broad scope of SYG does not apply. How fucking dumb this asshole is, a man is dead over barking dogs??..
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
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There's another case in AZ at a taco bell when something provoked a 29 year old mentally challenged man who had the development of a 13 year old out walking the dog to his the windshield of a 22 year old, and the 22 year old 'feeling threatened' shot the 29 year old, claiming the 29 year old had a pipe threatening him the police never found.

He hasn't been arrested, since the incident in April.

I think it's a good idea, every argument should have a shooting.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
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who cares, the victim is probably white so its a non story. If the victim is Black and the perp is white however, get back to me - because it only matters in THAT case.
 

emperus

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Apr 6, 2012
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who cares, the victim is probably white so its a non story. If the victim is Black and the perp is white however, get back to me - because it only matters in THAT case.

Unlike the TM/Zimmerman case the "perp" was arrested. But don't let all the facts and common sense get in the way of your rant. Continue on....
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
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Completely different.

Shooters is at fault based on the information provided.

Especially with shots in the back.

Perhaps not in this case but in at least one other case SYG has been used in a case where someone was shot from behind or as they were turning to leave.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/article1233133.ece

Questionable cases

Whatever lawmakers' expectations, "stand your ground" arguments have resulted in freedom or reduced sentences for some unlikely defendants.

&#8226; An 18-year-old felon, convicted of cocaine and weapons charges, shot and wounded a neighbor in the stomach, then fled the scene and was involved in another nonfatal shootout two days later, according to police. He was granted immunity in the first shooting.

&#8226; Two men fell into the water while fighting on a dock. When one started climbing out of the water, the other shot him in the back of the head, killing him. He was acquitted after arguing "stand your ground."

&#8226; A Seventh-day Adventist was acting erratically, doing cartwheels through an apartment complex parking lot, pounding on cars and apartment windows and setting off alarms. A tenant who felt threatened by the man's behavior shot and killed him. He was not charged.

&#8226; A Citrus County man in a longstanding dispute with a neighbor shot and killed the man one night in 2009. He was not charged even though a witness and the location of two bullet wounds showed the victim was turning to leave when he was shot.

Even chasing and killing someone over a drug buy can be considered standing your ground.

Anthony Gonzalez Jr. was part of a 2010 drug deal that went sour when someone threatened Gonzalez with a gun. Gonzalez chased the man down and killed him during a high-speed gunbattle through Miami streets.

Before the "stand your ground'' law, Miami-Dade prosecutors would have had a strong murder case because Gonzalez could have retreated instead of chasing the other vehicle. But Gonzalez's lawyer argued he had a right to be in his car, was licensed to carry a gun and thought his life was in danger.

Soon after the filing of a "stand your ground'' motion, prosecutors agreed to a deal in which Gonzalez pleaded guilty to the lesser charge of manslaughter and got three years in prison.

"The limitations imposed on us by the 'stand your ground' laws made it impossible for any prosecutor to pursue murder charges,'' Griffith of the Miami-Dade State Attorney's Office said at the time. "This is certainly a very difficult thing to tell a grieving family member.''

People still want to say that there's nothing wrong with the law. I vehemently disagree with them.
 

corwin

Diamond Member
Jan 13, 2006
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Unlike the TM/Zimmerman case the "perp" was arrested. But don't let all the facts and common sense get in the way of your rant. Continue on....
And the situation surrounding each one is entirely different as well, but don't let the facts and common sense get in the way of your racism
 

emperus

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Apr 6, 2012
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And the situation surrounding each one is entirely different as well, but don't let the facts and common sense get in the way of your racism

Not sure what your post means. I'm also not sure you understand what the word racism means. If you did, you wouldn't be throwing it around the way you do.
 
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corwin

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Jan 13, 2006
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Not sure what your post means. I'm also not sure you understand what the word racism means.
My post means this was pretty clearly NOT self defense, no one was being physically beaten by another person so no comparison can be made...and i know exactly what the word racism means
 

emperus

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Apr 6, 2012
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My post means this was pretty clearly NOT self defense, no one was being physically beaten by another person so no comparison can be made...and i know exactly what the word racism means

I'm still confused. I'm not sure what your post has to do with mine. But knowing you, I'm sure I'll never understand.

Also, you should probably do some reaearch on the history of Racism/Segregation in this country and maybe you'll feel silly throwing it around the way you do.
 

corwin

Diamond Member
Jan 13, 2006
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I'm still confused. I'm not sure what your post has to do with mine. But knowing you, I'm sure I'll never understand.

Also, you should probably do some reaearch on the history of Racism/Segregation in this country and maybe you'll feel silly throwing it around the way you do.
I'm not surprised...and I know all about the "history" of it and your current racist rants...
 

Londo_Jowo

Lifer
Jan 31, 2010
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I'm still confused. I'm not sure what your post has to do with mine. But knowing you, I'm sure I'll never understand.

Also, you should probably do some reaearch on the history of Racism/Segregation in this country and maybe you'll feel silly throwing it around the way you do.

So what's your excuse for throwing it around the way you do?

The racist term has been thrown around so much it no longer has any real meaning as most are desensitized to the term.
 

emperus

Diamond Member
Apr 6, 2012
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So what's your excuse for throwing it around the way you do?

The racist term has been thrown around so much it no longer has any real meaning as most are desensitized to the term.

Do you guys follow each other around, or is their some listserv that you post on when one of you needs support? lol.

Please, reference the time I have "thrown it around". It may not have meaning to you as I'm sure you never understood what the word meant or the blood and tears that surround it anyhow. Hence why you throw it around so cavalierly. But to me it does have meaning.

Anything else you care to share?
 

schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,801
91
91
There's another case in AZ at a taco bell when something provoked a 29 year old mentally challenged man who had the development of a 13 year old out walking the dog to his the windshield of a 22 year old, and the 22 year old 'feeling threatened' shot the 29 year old, claiming the 29 year old had a pipe threatening him the police never found.

He hasn't been arrested, since the incident in April.

I think it's a good idea, every argument should have a shooting.

You're truly an asset to this forum Craig, I always know I can get the real facts from you :wub:

an independent eyewitness said Adkins swung his fist in the direction of the driver several times

Fists = deadly force. The 22 year old responded in kind. Problem not found.
 

cliftonite

Diamond Member
Jul 15, 2001
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You're truly an asset to this forum Craig, I always know I can get the real facts from you :wub:



Fists = deadly force. The 22 year old responded in kind. Problem not found.

Why don't you post the real facts?

&#8220;He swung his fist towards the driver window, and at some point the driver shot him,&#8221; says Phoenix Police Sgt. Tommy Thompson. &#8220;Just because we don&#8217;t book a person immediately does not mean we don&#8217;t charge a person at a later date.&#8221;

The other guy was in the car when Adkins swung. That equals deadly force?