Yes U.S. tax-payers are Israel's b1tch !

Drift3r

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Jun 3, 2003
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http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/1209/p16s01-wmgn.html

Economist tallies swelling cost of Israel to US
By David R. Francis | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor
Since 1973, Israel has cost the United States about $1.6 trillion. If divided by today's population, that is more than $5,700 per person.

This is an estimate by Thomas Stauffer, a consulting economist in Washington. For decades, his analyses of the Middle East scene have made him a frequent thorn in the side of the Israel lobby.

For the first time in many years, Mr. Stauffer has tallied the total cost to the US of its backing of Israel in its drawn-out, violent dispute with the Palestinians. So far, he figures, the bill adds up to more than twice the cost of the Vietnam War.

And now Israel wants more. In a meeting at the White House late last month, Israeli officials made a pitch for $4 billion in additional military aid to defray the rising costs of dealing with the intifada and suicide bombings. They also asked for more than $8 billion in loan guarantees to help the country's recession-bound economy.

Considering Israel's deep economic troubles, Stauffer doubts the Israel bonds covered by the loan guarantees will ever be repaid. The bonds are likely to be structured so they don't pay interest until they reach maturity. If Stauffer is right, the US would end up paying both principal and interest, perhaps 10 years out.

Israel's request could be part of a supplemental spending bill that's likely to be passed early next year, perhaps wrapped in with the cost of a war with Iraq.

Israel is the largest recipient of US foreign aid. It is already due to get $2.04 billion in military assistance and $720 million in economic aid in fiscal 2003. It has been getting $3 billion a year for years.

Adjusting the official aid to 2001 dollars in purchasing power, Israel has been given $240 billion since 1973, Stauffer reckons. In addition, the US has given Egypt $117 billion and Jordan $22 billion in foreign aid in return for signing peace treaties with Israel.

"Consequently, politically, if not administratively, those outlays are part of the total package of support for Israel," argues Stauffer in a lecture on the total costs of US Middle East policy, commissioned by the US Army War College, for a recent conference at the University of Maine.

These foreign-aid costs are well known. Many Americans would probably say it is money well spent to support a beleagured democracy of some strategic interest. But Stauffer wonders if Americans are aware of the full bill for supporting Israel since some costs, if not hidden, are little known.

One huge cost is not secret. It is the higher cost of oil and other economic damage to the US after Israel-Arab wars.

In 1973, for instance, Arab nations attacked Israel in an attempt to win back territories Israel had conquered in the 1967 war. President Nixon resupplied Israel with US arms, triggering the Arab oil embargo against the US.

That shortfall in oil deliveries kicked off a deep recession. The US lost $420 billion (in 2001 dollars) of output as a result, Stauffer calculates. And a boost in oil prices cost another $450 billion.

Afraid that Arab nations might use their oil clout again, the US set up a Strategic Petroleum Reserve. That has since cost, conservatively, $134 billion, Stauffer reckons.

Other US help includes:

? US Jewish charities and organizations have remitted grants or bought Israel bonds worth $50 billion to $60 billion. Though private in origin, the money is "a net drain" on the United States economy, says Stauffer.

? The US has already guaranteed $10 billion in commercial loans to Israel, and $600 million in "housing loans." (See editor's note below.) Stauffer expects the US Treasury to cover these.

? The US has given $2.5 billion to support Israel's Lavi fighter and Arrow missile projects.

? Israel buys discounted, serviceable "excess" US military equipment. Stauffer says these discounts amount to "several billion dollars" over recent years.

? Israel uses roughly 40 percent of its $1.8 billion per year in military aid, ostensibly earmarked for purchase of US weapons, to buy Israeli-made hardware. It also has won the right to require the Defense Department or US defense contractors to buy Israeli-made equipment or subsystems, paying 50 to 60 cents on every defense dollar the US gives to Israel.

US help, financial and technical, has enabled Israel to become a major weapons supplier. Weapons make up almost half of Israel's manufactured exports. US defense contractors often resent the buy-Israel requirements and the extra competition subsidized by US taxpayers.

? US policy and trade sanctions reduce US exports to the Middle East about $5 billion a year, costing 70,000 or so American jobs, Stauffer estimates. Not requiring Israel to use its US aid to buy American goods, as is usual in foreign aid, costs another 125,000 jobs.

? Israel has blocked some major US arms sales, such as F-15 fighter aircraft to Saudi Arabia in the mid-1980s. That cost $40 billion over 10 years, says Stauffer.

Stauffer's list will be controversial. He's been assisted in this research by a number of mostly retired military or diplomatic officials who do not go public for fear of being labeled anti-Semitic if they criticize America's policies toward Israel.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
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If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.

but american jews are americans right? not Israeli's
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
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Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.

but american jews are americans right? not Israeli's

Whatever you say. ;)

Seriously i think it's a conflict for most american jews. On the one hand this country has shuned them prior to wwII and even during the war and finally Israel is set up as a jewish state. Safe and free from persecution and always welcome IE it?s all about Jewish survival from 1000's of years of persecution. On the other thier loyalty to US and loving the US where they are born and raised. to a lessor extent like the american Irish contributing to IRA for freedom and self-determination.

Good Read
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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and another thing odd I read today
http://www.palestinechronicle.com/story.php?sid=20031124182322983
Germany built and delivered at no charge three Dolphin submarines to Israel in 1999 and 2000.

edt.
found more

http://www.dolphin.org.il/dolphins/
During the war, German firms were accused of co-operating with Iraq and assisting her to produce various types of chemical weapons. Public opinion in Germany and in Israel was stormy. In an attempt to calm down the hostile atmosphere against Germany, to compensate Israel for it's economical losses and in order to maintain the German shipyards occupied, the German chancellor, Helmut Kohl decided to grant Israel with 2 new Dolphin Class submarines. (In early 1995, Germany and Israel finalised an agreement for the third submarine, each country will bear half of the costs.)
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
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Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.


Are you HIGH?

So, America charges more taxes BASED ON RACE? :disgust:
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
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Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.


Are you HIGH?

So, America charges more taxes BASED ON RACE? :disgust:

no, on income, and since the jews control the world, they are in a damn high tax bracket..donchya know?

maybe you should complain about the US paying egypt nearly as much as israel. a payment of billions a year to keep them from starting wars.....nice huh?
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.


Are you HIGH?

So, America charges more taxes BASED ON RACE? :disgust:

no, on income, and since the jews control the world, they are in a damn high tax bracket..donchya know?

maybe you should complain about the US paying egypt nearly as much as israel. a payment of billions a year to keep them from starting wars.....nice huh?

Dahems an R little slow ya know?

Thats right.. Average income for american jew is above 78K while american is 38K thus more paid in taxes.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.


Are you HIGH?

So, America charges more taxes BASED ON RACE? :disgust:

no, on income, and since the jews control the world, they are in a damn high tax bracket..donchya know?

maybe you should complain about the US paying egypt nearly as much as israel. a payment of billions a year to keep them from starting wars.....nice huh?


Why do we give money to Israel? The British gave them the land they live on and now we pay them to live there?
 

Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Those figures are warped to represent a point of view, the reality is we don't know how much the alternative would cost..

The actual aid provided to Israel over a 30 year period amounts to $50 per person, per year, how much is it worth to have a staunch ally in a volatile part of the world ? It would be volatile whether Israel was there or not, look at the Iran-Iraq war or Lebanon, as examples.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
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well yes, considernig the arab states were the soviets b*tches. how much aid in terms on money/weapons from the former ussr did they get? oodles. its not so simple.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
well yes, considernig the arab states were the soviets b*tches. how much aid in terms on money/weapons from the former ussr did they get? oodles. its not so simple.

Now we have North Korea and China selling advanced weapons to the Arab States seeking to create a whole "region of evil" :D
 

Drift3r

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Jun 3, 2003
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
well yes, considernig the arab states were the soviets b*tches. how much aid in terms on money/weapons from the former ussr did they get? oodles. its not so simple.

Actuallly most Arab states stayed nuetral and bought from both sides or whoever would sell them what they needed. Of course it did not help the U.S. much that the Russians flooded the black and the legit arms market with their equipment in hopes of helping any virgining revolutions in the world.
 

Drift3r

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Jun 3, 2003
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Zebo
If it's any consolation I think American Jews pay more taxes per capita than any other demographic. So look at it that way.


Are you HIGH?

So, America charges more taxes BASED ON RACE? :disgust:

no, on income, and since the jews control the world, they are in a damn high tax bracket..donchya know?

maybe you should complain about the US paying egypt nearly as much as israel. a payment of billions a year to keep them from starting wars.....nice huh?


Actually we pay Eygpt through the UN so that A.) There won't be any massive startvation in Egypt B.) So that they eventually can control their sky rocketing birth rates and yes C.) As a reward for recognizing Israel as a nation. Of course I have no problems elimanating all U.S. welfare checks from Egypt if that means we can do the same to Israel and take away their U.S. welfare checks.
 

Spencer278

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Oct 11, 2002
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Originally posted by: Dead Parrot Sketch
Those figures are warped to represent a point of view, the reality is we don't know how much the alternative would cost..

The actual aid provided to Israel over a 30 year period amounts to $50 per person, per year, how much is it worth to have a staunch ally in a volatile part of the world ? It would be volatile whether Israel was there or not, look at the Iran-Iraq war or Lebanon, as examples.


Isreal is a usless ally. How many troops did they send in to Iraq In the last 2 gulf wars?
 

Drift3r

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Jun 3, 2003
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Originally posted by: Dead Parrot Sketch
Those figures are warped to represent a point of view, the reality is we don't know how much the alternative would cost..

The actual aid provided to Israel over a 30 year period amounts to $50 per person, per year, how much is it worth to have a staunch ally in a volatile part of the world ? It would be volatile whether Israel was there or not, look at the Iran-Iraq war or Lebanon, as examples.

It all revovles around our support of Israel. The Iran-Iraq war was to check radical Iran from threatening Israel. We installed Saddam in Iran to check Iran so that we could protect Israel and piss off the Russians.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
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and if the soviets had not provided the loads of weapons and training for the arab states?

yes, none of this sh*t would be happening. what did u think a cold war was anyways?
 

LilBlinbBlahIce

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Dec 31, 2001
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
and if the soviets had not provided the loads of weapons and training for the arab states?

yes, none of this sh*t would be happening.

Same if we hadn't armed Saddam, the Mujahiddin or Iran buddy.
 

Drift3r

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Jun 3, 2003
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Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
and if the soviets had not provided the loads of weapons and training for the arab states?

yes, none of this sh*t would be happening. what did u think a cold war was anyways?

No you are wrong. The only reasons why the Russian's flooded the weapons market was to cock block our weapon sales and to aide popular revolutions in other nations/regions of the world ( i.e. Central and South America ) were cheap weapon$ were needed. As far as the the training goes we did a our far share of training and arming ourselves in the ME. We armed many a dictator and sultan in the ME who made sure that they would never allow democary to flurish in their nations. In exchange they played nice and left Israel alone as long the money kept on flowing into their hands.

 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
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Originally posted by: LilBlinbBlahIce
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
and if the soviets had not provided the loads of weapons and training for the arab states?

yes, none of this sh*t would be happening.

Same if we hadn't armed Saddam, the Mujahiddin or Iran buddy.

that happened a little bit after the israeli wars eh?
 

AnImuS

Senior member
Sep 28, 2001
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Israel already has nuclear weapons and recently put them on subs. so i dont see how they need so much money to stop terrorist and not entire countries. I think every1 knows that israel would fall under the US nuke protection plan. Since we have so much 7000+ IIRC.

"In addition, the US has given Egypt $117 billion and Jordan $22 billion in foreign aid in return for signing peace treaties with Israel."

All that was needed was a threat from the US that it would join in.

We should just donate 10nukes to palestine and problem solved. Worked for paks and indies, US & Nk, US & Soviets, etc.

WMD'S are almost a 100% deterrence to wars.

 

Tom

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
13,293
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Originally posted by: Drift3r
Originally posted by: Dead Parrot Sketch
Those figures are warped to represent a point of view, the reality is we don't know how much the alternative would cost..

The actual aid provided to Israel over a 30 year period amounts to $50 per person, per year, how much is it worth to have a staunch ally in a volatile part of the world ? It would be volatile whether Israel was there or not, look at the Iran-Iraq war or Lebanon, as examples.

It all revovles around our support of Israel. The Iran-Iraq war was to check radical Iran from threatening Israel. We installed Saddam in Iran to check Iran so that we could protect Israel and piss off the Russians.


That's your opinion. It's my opinion that they the area is ruled by people who historically try solve their problems by death and war.


 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
Originally posted by: Dead Parrot Sketch
Originally posted by: Drift3r
Originally posted by: Dead Parrot Sketch
Those figures are warped to represent a point of view, the reality is we don't know how much the alternative would cost..

The actual aid provided to Israel over a 30 year period amounts to $50 per person, per year, how much is it worth to have a staunch ally in a volatile part of the world ? It would be volatile whether Israel was there or not, look at the Iran-Iraq war or Lebanon, as examples.

It all revovles around our support of Israel. The Iran-Iraq war was to check radical Iran from threatening Israel. We installed Saddam in Iran to check Iran so that we could protect Israel and piss off the Russians.


That's your opinion. It's my opinion that they the area is ruled by people who historically try solve their problems by death and war.
well historicly everyone in the world does that most of the time