YAWoWT: Rogues can dodge ranged attacks!

[CKent]

Link :laugh:

This is worse than the warrior one (what was it exactly? A CM not knowing which stance(s) a certain skill could be used in?). Especially considering hunters are already a sore spot; they have two "bug" advantages over us rogues; their pets can see us stealthed (they share this bug with warlocks) and their mark, which is already overpowered because it makes us visible in stealth for a full 2 minutes, is bugged to stay on us even when the hunter who cast it dies. All this on top of having the natural advantages of a ranged class over a melee class which can't charge/intercept.

It's no wonder class balance and its twin, itemization, are in such slipshod shape; the people running this game don't know a thing about it.

 

[ndee]

Why are you always so whiny about Rogues?

 

[Zugzwang152]

I quit WoW, but I did play a standard 21/8/22 prep rogue for a while.


While it was annoying when the rogue's advantages were whittled away with every patch, frmo a neutral point of view, it did bring them back to semi-balance. A rogue with an epic weapon is going to be tough for pretty much any class to handle 1 on 1, with the exception of druid maybe. It's just that the days of owning everyone up, down, and sideways with a shanker are over...

 

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: ndee
Why are you always so whiny about Rogues?

He is a rogue.

 

[CVSiN]

yah i still play my 60 rogue every once in a while...

but i play my hunter 99% of the time

rogues felt gimped for a while after all the nerfs

 

[Schadenfroh]

Originally posted by: CVSiN
rogues felt gimped for a while after all the nerfs

I would not know.

You are cheap shotted
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
You have been Kidney shotted
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
You have died.

 

[CVSiN]

Originally posted by: Schadenfroh

Originally posted by: CVSiN
rogues felt gimped for a while after all the nerfs

I would not know.

You are cheap shotted
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
You have been Kidney shotted
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
"You cannot do that while stunned"
You have died.

heh... stun chains dont work anymore... people have stun objects from the battlegrounds...

instant stun chain breaker..

thats the old days when we did own anyone we got first jump on.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: ndee
Why are you always so whiny about Rogues?

I don't whine about rogues, I voice valid complaints. Why are you whining about that?

Regardless, I'm very interested in balance. I don't want to easily kill anyone I go up against; some of the most fun I've had is doing the STV arena event, even when I lose it's thrilling and it's always a great test of skill. The rogue class is horribly underpowered in WoW, that's a fact.

Regardless this thread is about proof Blizzard knows nothing about the game they run, not class balance.

 

[Noema]

Originally posted by: ndee
Why are you always so whiny about Rogues?

He's not whinning about Rogues.

He's mocking Blizzard's braindead CMs.

 

[ndee]

The Rogues are underpowered?! lol

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: ndee
The Rogues are underpowered?! lol

Well let's see, in PvE 4 other classes can do just about as much damage as us while offering far more utility. 3 of them do it from range, meaning they don't soak up any healing. In PvP, everything you can think of (and a few things you can't) takes us out of stealth. In group PvP where these things are constantly going off, we may as well not stealth, as it'll just be broken. 99% of PvP, even on PvP servers, now takes place in the battlegrounds, where it's group PvP. Yeah, I'd say we're pretty broken.

 

[ndee]

A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: ndee
A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

I never said rogues were underpowered 1v1. Good luck finding 1v1 PvP these days though. Nice dodge on the PvE issue.

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: RBachman

Originally posted by: ndee
A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

I never said rogues were underpowered 1v1. Good luck finding 1v1 PvP these days though. Nice dodge on the PvE issue.

IDK about you but i do fine at 60 in all blues and some buyable epics in PVE and PVP

learn2play n00b

 

[ndee]

Originally posted by: RBachman

Originally posted by: ndee
A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

I never said rogues were underpowered 1v1. Good luck finding 1v1 PvP these days though. Nice dodge on the PvE issue.

I just noticed your posts in alot of WoW threads that's all. Our Rogue also pwns the BGs of course with some help but a Rogue is also pretty hardcore when visible.

Not sure about PVE but in PVP, I'd say it's one of the stronger classes, up there with Priests and Druids.

 

[CVSiN]

Originally posted by: ndee

Originally posted by: RBachman

Originally posted by: ndee
A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

I never said rogues were underpowered 1v1. Good luck finding 1v1 PvP these days though. Nice dodge on the PvE issue.

I just noticed your posts in alot of WoW threads that's all. Our Rogue also pwns the BGs of course with some help but a Rogue is also pretty hardcore when visible.

Not sure about PVE but in PVP, I'd say it's one of the stronger classes, up there with Priests and Druids.

haha um nope..
most of the rogues I know have rerolled and only play when needed.
including myself..
Hunter is way more useful in groups and raids as well as group PVP.
Rogues just dont do much for a group except offer the priest/healer a mana sieve.
yes i can duel with the best of them but PVP is not about duels..
its about groups and tactics.. and ranged classes and heavy tanks own that department

 

[Anubis]

Originally posted by: CVSiN

Originally posted by: ndee

Originally posted by: RBachman

Originally posted by: ndee
A Rogue in our guild pwns about everyone in 1-on-1 and he also rocks in the BGs. He just knows his class very very well.

I never said rogues were underpowered 1v1. Good luck finding 1v1 PvP these days though. Nice dodge on the PvE issue.

I just noticed your posts in alot of WoW threads that's all. Our Rogue also pwns the BGs of course with some help but a Rogue is also pretty hardcore when visible.

Not sure about PVE but in PVP, I'd say it's one of the stronger classes, up there with Priests and Druids.

haha um nope..
most of the rogues I know have rerolled and only play when needed.
including myself..
Hunter is way more useful in groups and raids as well as group PVP.
Rogues just dont do much for a group except offer the priest/healer a mana sieve.
yes i can duel with the best of them but PVP is not about duels..
its about groups and tactics.. and ranged classes and heavy tanks own that department

if you think that rogues are useless and eaisly replaced you are a just wrong, in my last UBRS 10 man run last night I as a rogue did the MOST damage by a long shot and took the 2nd to LEAST amount of healing, i was also the only person that didnt die in the raid,

if you are a rogue and require a LOT of healing then you are pulling argo which means your tank isnt doing his job, with a good tank you shoudl be able to go all out and just feint when its there and never pull argo unless the tank dies, which woudl be the healers fault if that happenes

in group PVP thr 5 man ninja group as we call it, usially 4 rogues and a druiit OWN av as we can take and hold a GY very eaisly, yes we are easy targets when out of stealth but just be aware and you wont be taken out as often as you think

 

[uhohs]

agreed, rogues are gimped right now, especially in pve. and we're the last class to get "re-evaluated".

/me is sad he made a rogue.

 

[NeoV]

if you think rogues are gimped, learn to play or get in a real guild

we farm MC and are on the 3rd boss in BWL, and a rogue and a mage fight for the top dps spot every time

Try killing Vael without at least a handful of rogues dishing out huge dps


As for PvP...three words...stealth, stun, and vanish

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: Anubis
if you think that rogues are useless and eaisly replaced you are a just wrong, in my last UBRS 10 man run last night I as a rogue did the MOST damage by a long shot and took the 2nd to LEAST amount of healing, i was also the only person that didnt die in the raid,

if you are a rogue and require a LOT of healing then you are pulling argo which means your tank isnt doing his job, with a good tank you shoudl be able to go all out and just feint when its there and never pull argo unless the tank dies, which woudl be the healers fault if that happenes

in group PVP thr 5 man ninja group as we call it, usially 4 rogues and a druiit OWN av as we can take and hold a GY very eaisly, yes we are easy targets when out of stealth but just be aware and you wont be taken out as often as you think

Wait till you're doing at least ZG and tell us what you think. We don't take damage because we get aggro, we take it because mobs have huge AoE damage, most of which is spell-based or otherwise not dodge/block/parry-able. This isn't just bosses, this is every trash mob you come across. Our damage doesn't scale well with gear and we have terrible itemization. I did worthy damage way back in ubrs too...

As for PvP, my only real issues are non-damaging attacks (fear, demo shout, spells we resist, etc) taking us out of stealth, and the hunter bugs; their mark staying on us after they die (and being overpowered BS anyway) and their pets seeing us when we're stealthed. I think addressing those issues would go a long way toward evening us up. Well, and a double crit ambush+backstab doing more than 1k against a warrior would be nice...

 

[BigPoppa]

Warrior CM issue:

Tseric thought that enrage was a poppable ability for warriors. In truth is it activates when the warrior is crit by someone else. The warrior community doesn't like Tseric much, and that episode helped push it over the top.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: NeoV
if you think rogues are gimped, learn to play or get in a real guild

we farm MC and are on the 3rd boss in BWL, and a rogue and a mage fight for the top dps spot every time

Try killing Vael without at least a handful of rogues dishing out huge dps


As for PvP...three words...stealth, stun, and vanish

I didn't say rogues don't top meters, I said other classes with actual utility (let me know if a rogue ever buffs you...) come way too close, and without the downside of soaking up tons of healer mana.

Vael - one fight doesn't balance a class.

Stealth in group PvP, which makes up almost all PvP these days, even on servers with world PvP, is a lot harder to maintain than you obviously think. AoEs are going off constantly, and ones which shouldn't break stealth break it anyway (see my last reply for specific examples). Also as I said (must be nice ignoring points that don't fit with your point of view rather than addressing them...) there are two glaring bugs affecting stealth in a highly detrimental fashion.

 

[rh71]

Everyone likes to complain... :roll: how these guys don't know what they're doing and how things *should be* but the reality is that everything has bugs/issues/problems.

The other reality is that most of those who complain about it so loudly have no clue how to actually fix it either. I guess you could say I'm sick of "I can do it better" complainers.

 

[CKent]

Originally posted by: rh71
Everyone likes to complain... :roll: how these guys don't know what they're doing and how things *should be* but the reality is that everything has bugs/issues/problems.

The other reality is that most of those who complain about it so loudly have no clue how to actually fix it either. I guess you could say I'm sick of "I can do it better" complainers.

My complaint is backed up by solid facts; 4 other classes usurping rogues' PvE role, as any damage meter can tell you, and unfixed bugs admitted by Blizzard affecting PvP. I've offered solutions; buff rogue damage for PvE, fix bugs and make non-damaging AoEs not break stealth. Next time don't skip step 1) Read or 2) Think. These are integral to having an effective step 3) Post.

 

[CKent]

You've all done a fabulous job pulling this post off topic to flame me without knowing a thing about the actual issues, you must be proud. Now please, shoo~ I hear there's a thread in OT where a guy said he'd bang Jessica Alba despite the size of her feet, shouldn't you guys be in there setting him straight?