YACT: Oil Filter

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: DrPizza
It's a balancing act between wasting money on oil changes and causing premature death of the engine.

Exactly 🙂 On one end of the spectrum is a new filter/oil change every 500 miles and on the other end never doing it.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: smithdj

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: PlasticJesus
That 3000 mile business is a bunch of crap. About every 5000 would be more like it.

My Nissan pickup gets it every 8000 to 11000. I usually change filter, change oil, and scan my computer for malware on the same day so I can keep track of it all.

No, it's not a bunch of crap. My Nissan Maxima requires changing the oil every 3,750 miles per the manufacturer. I do it every 3,000 miles just to be on the safe side.

Correct! Have you seen oil after even 3,000, That is the load of crap. The stuff is as black as tar.

No it isn't and there was a thread a while ago that had a link to car manufacturer test that showed it was actually better not to change it that often.

I see oil with over 3000 miles all the time with nothing wrog with it. The filter is of more concern.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: sao123
There are 2 reasons why it is recommended to change the oil filter every 3000 miles.
1: Oil collects dirt/unburnt fuel as your engine burns fuel. It also burns in your engine too. The filter filters out any solid particles which may collect in your oil, it also collects the sludge which collects from burning oil. These may eventually clog the filter and stop the flow of oil, which would cause the engine to malfunction.
2: Oil filters are made of special filtering paper. Over time, exposure to oil weakens the paper, and it may begin to tear and come out of the filter, thus putting more dirt & shredded filter in your engine.

Most conventional oil is safe to run for 6000 miles, provided you top it off occasionally, and change the filter every 3000 miles. Full Synthetic oil is rated such that it can be ran for 15000 miles, provided again you change the filter.
There are more expensive filters available which can filter properly for up to 7000 miles, they are not made of the same paper as conventional filters. They are denser, and have more filter layers in general.

Neither of the above practices should you follow if your vehicle is under warranty. Running oil/filter under any circumstances over 3000 miles voids your auto's warranty.

:roll: bullshit

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: sao123
There are 2 reasons why it is recommended to change the oil filter every 3000 miles.
1: Oil collects dirt/unburnt fuel as your engine burns fuel. It also burns in your engine too. The filter filters out any solid particles which may collect in your oil, it also collects the sludge which collects from burning oil. These may eventually clog the filter and stop the flow of oil, which would cause the engine to malfunction.
2: Oil filters are made of special filtering paper. Over time, exposure to oil weakens the paper, and it may begin to tear and come out of the filter, thus putting more dirt & shredded filter in your engine.

Most conventional oil is safe to run for 6000 miles, provided you top it off occasionally, and change the filter every 3000 miles. Full Synthetic oil is rated such that it can be ran for 15000 miles, provided again you change the filter.
There are more expensive filters available which can filter properly for up to 7000 miles, they are not made of the same paper as conventional filters. They are denser, and have more filter layers in general.

Neither of the above practices should you follow if your vehicle is under warranty. Running oil/filter under any circumstances over 3000 miles voids your auto's warranty.

Please know of what you speak before you open your mouth.

Ignore this post, it contains no useful information.

 

[sao123]

Have either of you ever read the fine print on your new car warranty?
It is clearly stated in such, that if all fluids and consumable parts are not changed as dictated in your owners manual, your warranty is void, furthermore you will be charged any monetary amount necessary for repairs caused by that negligence.
Secondly if you dont believe me, perhaps you could contact any of the major synthetic oil manufacturers or autmobile dealers and ask them if using extended the miles between oil changes can void your warranty, Chevrolet said yes, Mobile 1 said yes. Valvolie said yes.

Third:
have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about. You however, in stead of stating any facts, call my post bullshit out of your own ignorance.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: sao123
Have either of you ever read the fine print on your new car warranty?
It is clearly stated in such, that if all fluids and consumable parts are not changed as dictated in your owners manual, your warranty is void, furthermore you will be charged any monetary amount necessary for repairs caused by that negligence.
Secondly if you dont believe me, perhaps you could contact any of the major synthetic oil manufacturers or autmobile dealers and ask them if using extended the miles between oil changes can void your warranty, Chevrolet said yes, Mobile 1 said yes. Valvolie said yes.

Third:
have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about. You however, in stead of stating any facts, call my post bullshit out of your own ignorance.

Ok, for one, NO auto manufacturer recommends that you change the oil every 3,000 miles.

Second, most auto manufacturers have "Light Duty" intervals of 7,500 miles or more.

So, yes. You are correct. You need to look in your manual, and not listen to anything we say.

But under no circumstances will not changing your oil every 3,000 miles void your warranty.

As for your extended drain intervals thing.. What?

Neither Mobil1 or Valvoline endorse or even advertise extended drain intervals. Of course they're going to say it will void your warranty. As far as they're concerned, you need to do exactly as your owners manual says.

Running a synthetic also will not void your warranty. If you opt for extended drain intervals, that may technically void your warranty.. However, if you are intelligent enough to attempt extended drains, one would hope that you're also intelligent enough to both do oil analysis and to use a synthetic whos manufacturer advertises and stands behind their extended drain intervals with.. a warranty. In which case, your engines warranty becomes covered by the oil manufacturer(if they offer such a thing) instead of the OEM.

I shouldn't have been so harsh. You are correct in your reasons for needing to change a filter. Except that quality oil filters will not fall apart in an engine, but I digress. High quality filters are made with synthetic media, and have metal end caps. Low quality filters like Fram, with cardboard endcaps, are the ones that blow up and fall apart.

There are just too many variables to say "Conventional oil is good for XXXX", "synthetic is good for XXXX", "Change your oil every XXXX and your filter every XXXX".

There are huge differences in the different brands and weighs of oil. And more importantly, there are VAST differences in peoples driving habbits and environments.

OK, this is what it boils down to. RTFM!.

And also know the difference between "Severe", "Normal" and "Light Duty" service.

Hint: Frequent, short trips are not Light duty, they are severe.

 

[Pepsi90919]

Originally posted by: sao123
Have either of you ever read the fine print on your new car warranty?
It is clearly stated in such, that if all fluids and consumable parts are not changed as dictated in your owners manual, your warranty is void, furthermore you will be charged any monetary amount necessary for repairs caused by that negligence.
Secondly if you dont believe me, perhaps you could contact any of the major synthetic oil manufacturers or autmobile dealers and ask them if using extended the miles between oil changes can void your warranty, Chevrolet said yes, Mobile 1 said yes. Valvolie said yes.

Third:
have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about. You however, in stead of stating any facts, call my post bullshit out of your own ignorance.

this isn't 1977.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919

Originally posted by: sao123
Have either of you ever read the fine print on your new car warranty?
It is clearly stated in such, that if all fluids and consumable parts are not changed as dictated in your owners manual, your warranty is void, furthermore you will be charged any monetary amount necessary for repairs caused by that negligence.
Secondly if you dont believe me, perhaps you could contact any of the major synthetic oil manufacturers or autmobile dealers and ask them if using extended the miles between oil changes can void your warranty, Chevrolet said yes, Mobile 1 said yes. Valvolie said yes.

Third:
have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about. You however, in stead of stating any facts, call my post bullshit out of your own ignorance.

this isn't 1977.

That works, too.

😀

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: sao123
Have either of you ever read the fine print on your new car warranty?
It is clearly stated in such, that if all fluids and consumable parts are not changed as dictated in your owners manual, your warranty is void, furthermore you will be charged any monetary amount necessary for repairs caused by that negligence.
Secondly if you dont believe me, perhaps you could contact any of the major synthetic oil manufacturers or autmobile dealers and ask them if using extended the miles between oil changes can void your warranty, Chevrolet said yes, Mobile 1 said yes. Valvolie said yes.

Third:
have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about. You however, in stead of stating any facts, call my post bullshit out of your own ignorance.

Yeah I've read it and also worked at a dealership. What you said was WRONG.
It does not void your warranty unless the damage is directly attributable to the lack of maintenence as outlined in the owners manual.

Your two years of work does not impress me at all.

 

[StageLeft]

Of course not following the manual's specifications for fluid changing will void certain parts of the warranty, but as mentioned no car no recommends 3000 mile oil changes (that I'm aware of). Some go as high as 10k or higher _on conventional oil_. 3k oil change is like taking your money and throwing it in the fire.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Of course not following the manual's specifications for fluid changing will void certain parts of the warranty, but as mentioned no car no recommends 3000 mile oil changes (that I'm aware of). Some go as high as 10k or higher _on conventional oil_. 3k oil change is like taking your money and throwing it in the fire.

Again it does not void the warranty unless the failed part can be attributed to not following the guidelines.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: QuitBanningMe

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Of course not following the manual's specifications for fluid changing will void certain parts of the warranty, but as mentioned no car no recommends 3000 mile oil changes (that I'm aware of). Some go as high as 10k or higher _on conventional oil_. 3k oil change is like taking your money and throwing it in the fire.

Again it does not void the warranty unless the failed part can be attributed to not following the guidelines.

And since you work at a dealership you can well attest to the fact that they'll use any reason they can to avoid doing warranty work 🙂

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: QuitBanningMe

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Of course not following the manual's specifications for fluid changing will void certain parts of the warranty, but as mentioned no car no recommends 3000 mile oil changes (that I'm aware of). Some go as high as 10k or higher _on conventional oil_. 3k oil change is like taking your money and throwing it in the fire.

Again it does not void the warranty unless the failed part can be attributed to not following the guidelines.

And since you work at a dealership you can well attest to the fact that they'll use any reason they can to avoid doing warranty work 🙂

I did at one time and they are more likely to fix it no matter what the cause. They don't do warranty work for free it is reimbursed. How would they prove you didn't change the oil at 3000 miles Also it says in the OM that the maintenance schedules are provided and "may" be used.

My warranty as it pertains to this subject:
http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/QuitBanningMe/warranty.jpg

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: QuitBanningMe
I did at one time and they are more likely to fix it no matter what the cause. They don't do warranty work for free it is reimbursed.

My warranty as it pertains to this subject:
http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/QuitBanningMe/warranty.jpg

I suppose what would happen is you bring your car into nissan and they need to do major engine work, and if you can't show that you've been doing the oil pursuant to the manual, you are SOL. I don't know what leeway other manufactuers have, but Nissan seems a bit unforgiving, from what I've read.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: QuitBanningMe
I did at one time and they are more likely to fix it no matter what the cause. They don't do warranty work for free it is reimbursed.

My warranty as it pertains to this subject:
http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/QuitBanningMe/warranty.jpg

I suppose what would happen is you bring your car into nissan and they need to do major engine work, and if you can't show that you've been doing the oil pursuant to the manual, you are SOL. I don't know what leeway other manufactuers have, but Nissan seems a bit unforgiving, from what I've read.

Notice the manual is a Nissan (also the dealership I worked at). We never gave anyone any trouble fixing anything if it could be claimed under warranty. It is one of the reasons that is all I will drive.

 

[sao123]

Ok, for one, NO auto manufacturer recommends that you change the oil every 3,000 miles.

Probably not at present. Previous cars made prior to 1997 has this 3000 miles as their recommended oil change intervals. i did not mean to imply that this value was for every manufacturer or make of vehicle including (current).

I suppose what would happen is you bring your car into nissan and they need to do major engine work, and if you can't show that you've been doing the oil pursuant to the manual, you are SOL. I don't know what leeway other manufactuers have, but Nissan seems a bit unforgiving, from what I've read.

This is entirely up to the dealer. However, it is the dealers legal right to request to see reciepts from oil changes, providing foundational date for determining your fluid changing habits. If the dealer suspects "abuse" and you do not have reciepts, they may force you to pay for repairs.
To prevent this fro moccuring widely, Recently many chevy dealers have implemented a policy that goes something like this. All drivetrain warranty repair work has a deductable of $250. If you have all regularly scheduled maintenance performed at the dealship by dealership mechanics(oil, tires, fluids, etc), then the deductible is waived for all repairs.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: sao123

Ok, for one, NO auto manufacturer recommends that you change the oil every 3,000 miles.

Probably not at present. Previous cars made prior to 1997 has this 3000 miles as their recommended oil change intervals. i did not mean to imply that this value was for every manufacturer or make of vehicle including (current).

I suppose what would happen is you bring your car into nissan and they need to do major engine work, and if you can't show that you've been doing the oil pursuant to the manual, you are SOL. I don't know what leeway other manufactuers have, but Nissan seems a bit unforgiving, from what I've read.

This is entirely up to the dealer. However, it is the dealers legal right to request to see reciepts from oil changes, providing foundational date for determining your fluid changing habits. If the dealer suspects "abuse" and you do not have reciepts, they may force you to pay for repairs.
To prevent this fro moccuring widely, Recently many chevy dealers have implemented a policy that goes something like this. All drivetrain warranty repair work has a deductable of $250. If you have all regularly scheduled maintenance performed at the dealship by dealership mechanics(oil, tires, fluids, etc), then the deductible is waived for all repairs.

What receipts from oil changes? I change mine myself. The OM says I can. Any receipt would not be car specific.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: sao123

Ok, for one, NO auto manufacturer recommends that you change the oil every 3,000 miles.

Probably not at present. Previous cars made prior to 1997 has this 3000 miles as their recommended oil change intervals. i did not mean to imply that this value was for every manufacturer or make of vehicle including (current).

My Dad's 1987 Camry has a Normal change interval of 7500 miles..

The 3,000 mile oil change is a holdover from the 50s, 60s and 70s when engines were inefficient and lubricant understanding and technology was lacking.

It's up to the user to decide what is right for them based on their environment and driving habbits.

I had the oil in my Dad's Camry analyzed after 8 months and 4800 miles. The analysis tested positive for antifreeze and so revealed a head gasket leak. Because of the coolant contamination, the oil was degraded and wear was just beginning to accelerate. The wear numbers were very low considering the coolant contamination. This was mostly due to the extremely robust nature of the Mobil Delvac 1300 Super 15W-40 HDD conventional diesel oil we're running.

I eagerly await the next test results. I am theorizing that since the head gasket has been fixed, the oil will be absolutely fine after a similar ammount of time, since it was just beginning to loose effectiveness after almost 5,000 miles and a year in the crankcase.

 

[C'DaleRider]

have either of you ever worked in a garage as a certified auto mechanic? I have exactly 2 years doing such. In addition, I assisted my father in completely building a 1977 ford Fairlane from the ground up. I know what im talking about.

Wow. Everyone's such an expert..........:roll:

My little brother, an SAE certified mechanic with 20+ years of experience, claims to be no expert but rather an educated and experienced mechanic. There are still problems with cars that come into his shop that give him and his staff headaches. Such is life in auto repair.

These may eventually clog the filter and stop the flow of oil, which would cause the engine to malfunction.

You do understand that if the oil filter in any modern engine completely clogs and ceases to flow oil, the filter is simply bypassed....true, there would be no filtration of the oil, but there also would be no cessation of oil flow throughout the engine. Just enhanced engine wear and potentially clogging up some oil passages, but a clogged filter doesn't stop the flow of oil in a car.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Color does not necessarily mean that the oil is no longer doing what is supposed to be doing. Without doing a test on it, you have no way of knowing.

Dark oils have oxidized. You're right that you can't determine the effects that oxidation has on a particular oil without testing, as the additives may be unaffected but the base stock has oxidized or vice versa. It depends quite a bit on the oil. For most car engine oils, it's likely the additives are still good long after the oil goes dark. The only thing that really changes, then, is the oil viscosity. It will increase slightly as it oxidizes for a good oil, or quite a bit as it oxidizes for a lesser oil.

 

[sao123]

What receipts from oil changes? I change mine myself. The OM says I can. Any receipt would not be car specific.

How about the reciept of purchase of oil & filter?

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: sao123

What receipts from oil changes? I change mine myself. The OM says I can. Any receipt would not be car specific.

How about the reciept of purchase of oil & filter?

What would that prove? No more than if I said I changed the oil. Not to mention I buy both in bulk. I had enough oil filters before I bought the car to last the warranty period at the suggested intervals. (previous vehicle was same model)