yact- Big difference between 5.0L and 5.7L 4-barrel engines? UPDATE

[zCypher]

Just curious for you chevy engine buffs out there - is there a huge difference between the 305 and 350 engines (both carb. not F.I.)? I test drove a 1985 Trans Am with a 350, and a 1987 Camaro with a 305. Although the pedals felt very different in both cars I'm assuming that's just particular to the car/model or whatever. However, the 350 seemed a LOT more powerful between 40-150km/h. The speedometer would shoot past 100 clicks as if it were nothing. You reach insane speeds in seconds. With the 305, I didn't get to test at highway and above speeds but it didn't seem to pick up that quickly at all.

So I'm just wondering whether or not there is a huge difference between these two cars (I'm guessing NO), and whether or not there is a huge difference between these two engines. I know there are many different 305's and 350's (some 305's are close to the same power as some 350's)... but generally speaking is there a big difference or am I just imagining things? They were both automatic btw. I'm still waiting to test out some standard transmission Cams/Fbirds.

Any advice or info on the topic would be very much appreciated. Thanks

edit: i didn't time it but just by guessing by the looks of it (glances at the speedometer), the 305 *felt* as if the 0-60 would be about between 8-9 seconds. It felt kind of dissapointing, compared to how fast the 350 trans am felt. maybe i'm just crazy .. to put things to perspective a bit, the 305 i tested didn't really feel any faster than my friend's standard trans 86 v6 camaro.. slower even.. is that possible?

 

[notfred]

the 305 is a peice of trash. Never buy a chevy with a 305 in it if you want it to go fast, the 350 is a MUCH better motor. If you want a 5.0 liter motor that performs well, you want a ford, not the chevy 5.0 piece of garbage.

 

[thedarkwolf]

The only good thing about the 305 is you can yank it out and drop a 350 right in . Also only the 305 was available with a 5 speed in the 3rd gen f-bodies. The 350 put out to much torque for the 5 speed and was only available with an auto.

I'll let the chevy experts come in and tell you the exact difference between the two so I don't make a fool of myself.

 

[SuperSix]

Originally posted by: notfred
the 305 is a peice of trash. Never buy a chevy with a 305 in it if you want it to go fast, the 350 is a MUCH better motor. If you want a 5.0 liter motor that performs well, you want a ford, not the chevy 5.0 piece of garbage.

Yes, the highest volume V8 piece of trash ever made. That's a dumbass comment..

Anyway, he is right about the 305 - it's a bone, and more expensive to mod than the 350. The 350 is the king of aftermarket parts, and the least expensive to repair and hop-up of any motor manufactured. Unless the 305 is free, get the 350.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

The 305 has a much smaller bore, and the same stroke as the 350. The heads are different because of this, the valves are smaller. And like everyone's been saying "forget about it".

Edit:
Notfred: Forget about the Chevy 302 that was in the first Z-28s?

 

[RU482]

when I was in high school, my sister had an 84 camaro with a 305. while it was loads faster than my Cutlass with a 307, it couldn't even compare to the 350 Camaros my friends had

 

[CraigRT]

305's are reliable.. my dad had one in his 82 Caprice... it's slow, but they run well.. the 350 would be alot(!) faster.

 

[zCypher]

Thanks for the good replies!

Anyway, the two cars :

Camaro - 1987 - Red T-Top automatic comes with winter tires and a set of original mags, everything is all original (but it was repainted so it looks new) umodified and spotless (including exterior). Engine is OK looking. It's a 305. He's asking $2500 canadian (about 1500-1600 USD).. forget the mileage i think it was a little lower than trans am, about 120,000km (75k miles?)

Trans Am - 1985 - Red T-Top automatic kickass wheels already on it, no others included, paint looks new, interior is spotless NO ripped up seats, dash is perfect, all-original, Engine looks really clean and sounds good. It's a 350. He's asking $3400 canadian (about 2100 USD) ... car has 140,000km (88k miles) engine has 160,000km (100k miles)

So they're both red t-top and the same generation, but the trans am has the flip up lights of course and IMO looks better, and has the bigger engine (I believe trans ams of that year did not come with 350s, but the motor was swapped after the 305 was blown).

I kinda fell in love with the Trans Am when I test drove it. I want to test drive some Standards, but I may just try out my best friend's standard v6 cam to see what it feels like. I don't mind automatic for a big-engined fbody type car though (if I was getting a civic it would be standard without question though). The car (trans am) felt perfect to drive... it wasn't uncomfortable or weird... it wasn't stressful, everything was in the right place.

Hard to decide. I will know by next week pretty much whether or not I will be able to afford either one, but I sooooo want that trans am. argh. any more input would be appreciated.

 

[radioouman]

I had a friend who took an 88 or 89 Camaro with a 305/stick and started modifying it. He did all sorts of crap to it, like fabricated his own exhaust and had a different intake on it. He thought it was sort of quick, and would take it to the local drag strip every weekend.

It was exactly as fast as my stock 2000 Saturn SW2 up to 65-70 mph.

 

[zCypher]

Originally posted by: radioouman
I had a friend who took an 88 or 89 Camaro with a 305/stick and started modifying it. He did all sorts of crap to it, like fabricated his own exhaust and had a different intake on it. He thought it was sort of quick, and would take it to the local drag strip every weekend.

It was exactly as fast as my stock 2000 Saturn SW2 up to 65-70 mph.

Maybe he was simply losing time shifting? I doubt standard transmissions on camaros allow you to shift super fast, which will definitely cut into your 0-60 time even if your engine is powerful. You could easily lose a whole second to shifting, where you wouldn't lose anywhere near that much with an automatic Camaro.

So a 350 in an 85 generation Trans Am would get about 7s 0-60 right? But damn the acceleration CONTINUED after I went past 100, 120, 140kmh... that's the sweet part.

 

[desertdweller]

305 is a turd. I haven't played around too much with chevys, but my boat has a 305 4bbl.
in it and its only rated at like 205 hp. Plus I hear they have weak bottom ends; so they're
not worth building.

I am currently building a 350 for it, i'm shooting for about 400hp. I wouldn't even attempt
that with a 305.


DD

 

[Demon-Xanth]

I'd go for the T/A with all else being equal.

 

[zCypher]

Thanks again for the replies so far.

My next question is this. If I go with the Trans Am with a 350 - how the hell do I know the specs? That engine could have come from pretty much anywhere, right? And a 350 could be 245, 250, 275, 300, 320hp... right? What I mean is, just by the name "350" there really isn't any way to tell how powerful the engine actually is? For a non-mechanically-inclined guy like myself.

He said it had a turbo something or other shifting thingamajigger. NOT a turbocharger, but something that made the shifts faster? A turbo-something transmission? I don't know. Is that good? Pros/cons? Edit: I looked up some stuff on that, and some fbodies have "turbo hydromatic" transmissions.. could this be what the guy was talking about?

Would it be safe to assume that this engine has 245hp/320 ft-lbs ?

 

[desertdweller]

Originally posted by: zCypher
Thanks again for the replies so far.

My next question is this. If I go with the Trans Am with a 350 - how the hell do I know the specs? That engine could have come from pretty much anywhere, right? And a 350 could be 245, 250, 275, 300, 320hp... right? What I mean is, just by the name "350" there really isn't any way to tell how powerful the engine actually is? For a non-mechanically-inclined guy like myself.

He said it had a turbo something or other shifting thingamajigger. NOT a turbocharger, but something that made the shifts faster? A turbo-something transmission? I don't know. Is that good? Pros/cons? Edit: I looked up some stuff on that, and some fbodies have "turbo hydromatic" transmissions.. could this be what the guy was talking about?

Would it be safe to assume that this engine has 245hp/320 ft-lbs ?

The transmissions are called turbo hydromatic. A turbo 350 is thier light automatic, turbo 400 is stronger and
turbo 700 is thier overdrive transmission. The 350 will also respond much better to any engine upgrades you
want to do to it.

DD

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Most likely they'll have 700R4s which are TH-350's w/ an overdrive. There is a fair amount of aftermarket parts for them. The 350 for that year probably makes about 210-225HP. But if you're willing to do some work, an intake manifold, set of heads, and a cam will probably push you over 300. Just be careful of smog laws.

 

[zCypher]

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
Most likely they'll have 700R4s which are TH-350's w/ an overdrive. There is a fair amount of aftermarket parts for them. The 350 for that year probably makes about 210-225HP. But if you're willing to do some work, an intake manifold, set of heads, and a cam will probably push you over 300. Just be careful of smog laws.

I know...

However... I'm not sure I want to do many, if any, mods to my car. This is actually going to be my first car AND my daily driver. You might think WTF, but it's how I want it to be. I know the gas mileage will suck, but highway mileage will be OK, so whatever. Basically, having "fun" comes at a price... but you get what you pay for. having fun in a civic is dirt cheap but it's nowhere near as fun as an Fbody

So since its gonna be my daily driver I dont really wanna mod the shiznit out of it, I want it to last as long as possible the way it is, with the least possible repairs. I will get whatever repairs done that need doing, but I don't want to make MORE repairs necessary, know what I mean?

 

[HokieESM]

zCypher--you're right. Over the years, GM has made quite a few 350s... with power output from below 200hp, all the way up to 370 (back in the late 60s... although, those numbers are NOT SAE net horsepower). So someone telling you that they have a "350 under the hood" (or 5.7L for you metric-loving people) really doesn't tell you much. Although, almost all of the higher performance ones have four bolt mains.

If the car is from the 60s, it usually says the displacement AND horsepower rating on the air cleaner cover (the big round orange thing)--but people who are "all show and no go" love to change those stickers and put "higher rated" ones on (like ricers....). My personal favorite was a guy who had a 427/435 sticker (yes, the factory sticker from the tri-power) on a small block. I about died laughing.

Most other cars have a sticker SOMEWHERE under the hood for the stock configuration.

All bets are off after modification. A couple thousand dollars of modifications (particularly something that lets it breathe a littel better--like new heads and headers)into a small-block Chevy can really alter its performance characteristics.

 

[LAUST]

get the 350... or if you are really lookin for some power and can find one get a 400SB like my little brother has in his 76, that 400SB in stock form could light up his 33" mudders... now it's a 407 and can light up his 35" super swampers I've seen some old Camaros do some awesome times with those 400's

 

[zCypher]

Apparently the 305 gets 25mpg on the highway. Think the 350 would get about 20?

 

[zCypher]

anyone?

 

[Demon-Xanth]

25 seems high for that year. And there's probably only about 10% difference between the two at most.

 

[zCypher]

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
25 seems high for that year. And there's probably only about 10% difference between the two at most.

Really? Even though it's that much more powerful? That's pretty good. BTW I find these bigass V8s get pretty good mileage all things considered. I mean look at 4 cylinders that pump out equivalent HP... they don't get better mileage

 

[Demon-Xanth]

You are talking about the '80s ya know.

 

[zCypher]

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
You are talking about the '80s ya know.

Yes, I know..

??

I'm saying they get pretty good gas mileage all things considered.



........................ ?

edit: ANYWAY, I'm going to check out some more cars in Trois-Rivieres (2 hour drive), so I'll be back with an update later tonight after my date.

 

[SuperSix]

All mid to late-80's GM motors had horrible HP numbers - due to SMOG issues, bad head/flow design, and other factors. I gather that this person has replaced the motor in the Firebord, I would defiantely take the car to a good mechanic and have them look it over - depending on how well the transplant was made - you may have issues later on.

What type of induction does the 350 have? TPI? Carb? B/MFI?