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XP Pro SP2 Firewall

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imported_Bassmaster

Member
Hi I'm new to XP being a recent convert from 2k. I'm wondering about the Windows firewall. I was wondering if it protects outbound also? If not, could I use it with a 3rd party app like Sygate or just use Sygate only anyways? Is it like other FW's that you only want 1 instance running? Thank you.
 
Originally posted by: Bassmaster
Hi I'm new to XP being a recent convert from 2k. I'm wondering about the Windows firewall. I was wondering if it protects outbound also? If not, could I use it with a 3rd party app like Sygate or just use Sygate only anyways? Is it like other FW's that you only want 1 instance running? Thank you.
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It is inbound only. If you want to use another FW, you should disable the MS one (most current FW's will do that for you when they install)

Bill
 
SP2 firewall does not protect outbound,use a third party software like Sygate,Kerio etc... then you can disable the WinXP firewall.

Yep use only one in Windows.

Welcome to the AT forums Bassmaster.
 
The SP2 firewall is inbound only, but that doesn't mean you should use anything else. An outbound filtering firewall does not help security at the host-level. If malicious code gets on your system the possibility exists for it to do whatever it wants, with or without your knowledge. Immutable Law of Security #1 is if a bad guy can persuade you to run his program on your computer, it's not your computer anymore.

The SP2 firewall is even unnecessary if your machine is the only one in its network. For example, I only have one PC and my Xbox in my network. My router gives me all the protection I need. If you have more then one computer in your network it is best to use the SP2 firewall; threats can come from within your network.
 
Thanks KoolDrew. I only have this pc and use cable. So, not knowing anything about the Windows firewall, should I use that or stay with Sygate? I understand that once inside outbound is iffy at best but how good is XP's built-in firewall? I am not ready yet to take MS's word when it comes to security but will listen to others and their opinions. I've just started using XP so have no clue about it as of yet. Thanks.
 
I would just use the SP2 firewall. Sygate does not add any security benefits and just complicates things further. Also, do you even have a router? A router would help security and since you would only have one PC in your network you would be safe with just the protection from the router.

So I should get a router. Why?
 
No, I don't have a hardware fw. Read your link and googled it and like it though. So if I get a router do I only use that or use that and Windows FW?

BTW, what's the best router to get for security and your money's worth?
 
I would always use a free third party firewall which monitors outbound connections over Windows firewall.
Whilst its true that malicious apps could get out without your knowledge anyway, there's tons of other stuff that tries to sneak off onto the web without your consent.

I'm amazed the ammount of times that my software firewall has asked me whether I'd like to allow 'insert app name here' internet access for no good reason whatsoever.
Outbound filtering gives you that bit of extra control over what can access the internet, and when you'd like it to.
 
Originally posted by: Canterwood
I would always use a free third party firewall which monitors outbound connections over Windows firewall.
Whilst its true that malicious apps could get out without your knowledge anyway, there's tons of other stuff that tries to sneak off onto the web without your consent.

I'm amazed the ammount of times that my software firewall has asked me whether I'd like to allow 'insert app name here' internet access for no good reason whatsoever.
Outbound filtering gives you that bit of extra control over what can access the internet, and when you'd like it to.
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I'll ditto that. I game on 56k and need every bit I can get to go to the game. It pisses me off that every piece of new software needs to phone home and use up my bandwidth for no tangible benefit to me.
 
If I were to get a router, would I still be able to use Sygate with it?
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Yes you can use a router still.I'm actually using a hardware based firewall router with my WinXP SP2 firewall.
 
Bassmaster, all this firewall inbound, outbound that you are talking about is a bit overkill, all you really have to do is block what wants to get in, after all if nothing gets in and you don't download something bad, like a trojan packed into a .exe file then nothing is going to go out.

A firewall is a great thing to have, but no matter what security you have in your system it's all going to work only as good as the user and experience. What it seems like you're looking for is something to do it all for you and there is a lot that does, to a point, but then all you're doing is going overboard.

No one needs to run a software firewall on top of a hardware firewall if they understand security and how to look for it and avoid it in the first place. Also there are times when running both can have negative effects with a connection.

If you really truly want to learn computer security, then basic information is out there on the web. In time you'll know the difference between a trojan, how to spot them running in the system, how to remove them and what they really are compared to a virus and spyware, not to mention how to avoid all of these in the system and a cracker as well, not a hacker. Crackers are the ones that crack into systems, which people call hackers, which isn't correct.

Also one last note, if you're into gaming, you have to remember that a software firewall filters packets coming and going and online gaming, your ping rates will be effected by a software firewall. Hardware firewalls are the only way to get gaming performance in online playing without packet filtering.
 
DasFox, while I agree that in the case of trojans once the box is compromised it's compromised. But it seems he's using it to help control what software on his box does, as such I think it's a perfectly reasonable use...
 
No one needs to run a software firewall on top of a hardware firewall if they understand security and how to look for it and avoid it in the first place. Also there are times when running both can have negative effects with a connection.

If you really truly want to learn computer security, then basic information is out there on the web. In time you'll know the difference between a trojan, how to spot them running in the system, how to remove them and what they really are compared to a virus and spyware, not to mention how to avoid all of these in the system and a cracker as well, not a hacker. Crackers are the ones that crack into systems, which people call hackers, which isn't correct.

Also one last note, if you're into gaming, you have to remember that a software firewall filters packets coming and going and online gaming, your ping rates will be effected by a software firewall. Hardware firewalls are the only way to get gaming performance in online playing without packet filtering.
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In my case I have one of lowest pings on my gaming servers,I also use SpywareBlaster,Ad-aware,Spybot and anti spyware in SystemSuite 6 too to name a few,as to me using software firewall,it may seem overkill to you but I don't get any problems and I also have plenty of ram and X2 dual core processor,security is how good you want it to be and personal preference 🙂
 
Well yes, sorry don't take me wrong, a lot of people are using all these virus, spyware apps sitting at run up and filtering packets, but truthfully security has to be taken as a ACTIVE role, not passive. If anyone really cares for it, otherwise you are only doing a dis-service to yourself.

Those that truly want to expand their knowledge and skills will in the long run be better off and less dependant on alot of apps that are not needed.

And in the end that will only help to bring a overall all-around improvement in system performance.

Yes there are heaps of people running software firewalls thinking their pings are great, but they are not as good, if you where only using a hardware firewall.

You might not really see or notice a difference but it's there. Software firewalls have to filter the traffic, inbound and outbound, there just is no way around that and when that happens there is a slight loss.
 
The bottom line is that with any home-office broadband connection, a hardware firewall should be considered a bare minimum, and supplementing it with a software firewall on one or more computers (and don't forget anti-virus software) is almost always a good idea.
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Taken from here..

Layers of defense are the best approach, so you should have two firewalls (software and hardware), two anti-virus (online and software), and three programs to fight Trojans, worms, spyware and other pests (PestPatrol, BOClean and SpyBot). IEClean makes it easy to remove browser related files. RoboForm protects and keeps track of your passwords and personal information. What about interference? Using two software firewalls is not a good idea. That is why you should use a hardware and software combination.
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Link.
 
Thanks guys. DasFox, you're probably correct in that it's overkill but I just want to make sure since I don't know all that stuff you're talking about yet. I don't have to worry about system resources, so I figure I want to be as protected as possible until the day I might. But that's why I'm asking in this thread, to learn from people like you guys that do know. 🙂

bsobel, is correct and it's more wanting to know what software I have, and know I have installed, is doing. I don't like anything starting up without my permission or calling home without me knowing it. For the starting up on booting, I use System Monitor but I would like a firewall to let me know about other progs calling home.

Thank you all so much for the help so far. It's greatly appreciated. 🙂

Can anyone give me any advice on what router to get that does a good job for the price? I don't do any gaming at all if that matters.
 
mem that's not correct, they only sell consumers on all this, BECAUSE the average computer user is into USING a PC, not learning about it. The truth is real computer security does not need or require this "Layers" of defense as you might think.

Ok here is the run down, yes tools are need, BUT experience is the REAL LAYER for protection.

1 Firewall
1 or 2 Anti Virus Program
1 Trojan Scanner Program
4-5 Spyware programs

Why the hugh amount of Spyware apps, because not one spyware applicaton on the market detects everything. Why a trojan scanner, because not one virus program on the market will detect all trojans. Trojans are not viruses and vice versa. And you only need the virus scanner running in the background at startup.

With 2 Antivirus programs sometimes in Windows the system has problems with this and even the antivirus programs themselves, so 2 can be good because alot of antivirus programs out there don't even find everything. So far Symantec has been good at this, detecting many signatures.

Running spyware and all sorts of other types of programs like what we are suggesting here, in the background is not needed, all this does is waste system resources.

As a home user you should be taking a more active approach and scanning the system manually from time to time, BECAUSE many system applications running in the background as watchdogs are not 100% effective, but doing a manual scan is.

Now if we want to go about all of this, from a Corporate, business view, then this is different, there will need to be more automation, but at the smaller levels of computing like HOME user, Education is your best LAYER of defense, not slapping in 20 apps running in the background thinking you are safe, this is not so.

Look the TRUTH is what are we selling here? Do we want DRONE computer users, or do we want to educate them and show them ways in which things are done, not just simply what the masses are doing, BECAUSE of a lack of experience.

Bassmaster get tools, antivirus, spyware, trojan and a firewall, do yourself a favor and learn a little and even in learning your system isn't going to blowup from spyware overload. As a small home user learn to use the tools, scanning the system often, not just relying on them sitting in the taskbar watching.

Take a ACTIVE role and learn and in the end you'll know that YOU are the best LAYER of protection, because tools aren't perfect, no software is!

ALOHA
 
Bassmaster get tools, antivirus, spyware, trojan and a firewall, do yourself a favor and learn a little and even in learning your system isn't going to blowup from spyware overload. As a small home user learn to use the tools, scanning the system often, not just relying on them sitting in the taskbar watching.

Take a ACTIVE role and learn and in the end you'll know that YOU are the best LAYER of protection, because tools aren't perfect, no software is!

ALOHA
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I agree, that's what I'm doing by asking here. I am also reading online doing google searches etc. and have for a while also. This wasn't my first stop in asking questions. It's just that I have been reading a lot of threads here and I respected your knowledge and opinions so I thought I would ask.

The only thing I have running is Sygate, MS Anti-Spyware and AVG. I also have programs so I can do a manual scan for spyware. I don't worry at all about viruses and trojans or any spyware. I only use Opera so I don't worry about any ActiveX and before I open anything, I check it manually with AVG.

I agree with you about learning more about it myself as that's the best protection in the end. Thank you for your help so far. 🙂
 
Yes learning about security is always best, especially if you have something you are concerned over. Otherwise if you're just the average, websurfing, IM chat, email user, which alot are and aren't concerned to learned, for whatever reason, not interested, no time, etc., then that is why articles like that one are published about loading up the system to the fullest with heaps of armor. Because quite honestly, YES that type of user needs to take this approach. But this does not mean this is the way real PC security really works, it's just what I guess you could call:

"The Average Joes Security System"

And users who aren't the average joes in computing do not run their systems like this!

ALOHA
 
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