X1800XT - questions about 2D/3D modes and OC

[mauri]

I just received my new card yesterday, X1800XT 256MB. I was looking to buy X1900XT for a very long time, but my monitor broke down and I had to buy a new monitor also. So my maximum budget for the card was 350?.

The X1900XT was 160? more expensive, so it wasn't a realistic choice for me (not enough money), so I narrowed it between X1800XT (that I have now) and 7900GT. 7900GT Isn't widely available available here at the moment and basic models (not the overclocked ones) are as expensive as the X1800XT is. And both have 256MB of memory. so I went with X1800XT.

Image quality seems to be good, I haven't been able to test it a lot with games yet, but first run with stock settings and with 2GB of RAM And A64 3500+@2.5GHz gave me around 8900 points in 3DMark05. I guess that is close to normal result with my setup?

Now there are few questions that are bugging my mind: Does X1800XT use some kind of a different 2D/3D -modes with frequencies and core/memory voltages? I've read from several threads here that X1800 -series have built in voltage control, but how do I use it? does it increase voltages for example when using ATIs own Overdrive?

And is ATI Tools the best utility for tweaking the cards overclocking, fan speed and other options? I had problems even during using Ati own command center and its overdrive (which crashed immediately). I installed ATI Tools, but I don't know the safe limits/steps to try out with the card, or what are the safe GPU core and memory voltages using stock cooling? Any advice to that would be appreciated.

 

[VERTIGGO]

ATI Tools gives me artifacts at sub-stock speeds, so I'm leary of using it on my X1900s. CCC did crash for me too, and so I use ATI tray tools, which has lots of features except overclock support (so far), but I don't really want to risk my boards for 3-5 fps.

 

[mauri]

I thought that Ati Tray Tools doesn't support X1x00 -series, but thanks for the info. I have to check it out. Mostly I'm interested in watching the temperatures and tweaking the fan,but I know I'm going to overclock it at some point.

Overclocking my old X800XL was so easy with Ati Tray Tools. I might just have to get use to Ati Tools. It would be interesting to know more about the voltage tweaking, but I'm not sure if it is wise without watercooling.

 

[Bull Dog]

Originally posted by: VERTIGGO
ATI Tools gives me artifacts at sub-stock speeds, so I'm leary of using it on my X1900s. CCC did crash for me too, and so I use ATI tray tools, which has lots of features except overclock support (so far), but I don't really want to risk my boards for 3-5 fps.

The reason why is that you forgot to up your voltage from stock 2D to stock 3D voltage, plus you need to make sure you disable the ATI hot key poller.

 

[mauri]

what is the "ATI hot key poller"?

 

[Golgatha]

Originally posted by: Bull Dog

Originally posted by: VERTIGGO
ATI Tools gives me artifacts at sub-stock speeds, so I'm leary of using it on my X1900s. CCC did crash for me too, and so I use ATI tray tools, which has lots of features except overclock support (so far), but I don't really want to risk my boards for 3-5 fps.

The reason why is that you forgot to up your voltage from stock 2D to stock 3D voltage, plus you need to make sure you disable the ATI hot key poller.

The latest ATI Tools beta version supports the X1800XT boards. However, I am wondering too what the stock 3D voltages are for these boards, so I know where to set my 3D settings?

 

[Elfear]

ATI Tool Beta 13 or 14 work great for overclocking the X1*** cards. You just disable the ATI Hotkey and ATI Smart services (Control Panel -> Admin Tools -> Services). Than, like others have mentioned, you increase the 2D volts up to stock 3D volts (1.4V) and start ocing.

The newest version of ATI Tray Tools also works great with the new ATI cards. Just remember to disable overclocking when you install it.

Originally posted by: VERTIGGO
ATI Tools gives me artifacts at sub-stock speeds, so I'm leary of using it on my X1900s.

Like Bull Dog mentioned, you're volts were probably still at 2D levels (1.175V).

but I don't really want to risk my boards for 3-5 fps.

Well oc it more than.

If you're only going to oc it 5% or so than it isn't worth it. You've got to make that thing beg for mercy and then you'll see some impressive gains in the games you play.

 

[Extelleron]

Just flash the X1800XT w/ the X1800XT PE BIOS for 695/1600.

 

[mauri]

Originally posted by: Extelleron
Just flash the X1800XT w/ the X1800XT PE BIOS for 695/1600.

Will it work? I only have 256MB of ram. What are the percentages that the flshing works, and is it irreversible? If something goes wrong can I still cover my original BIOS. I suppose that there are some sites where i could have more information about it. does anyone know a good one?

 

[CCityInstaller]

Originally posted by: Extelleron
Just flash the X1800XT w/ the X1800XT PE BIOS for 695/1600.

What X1800XT PE bios? I haven't run across a PE version while I was doing my research for which card to purchase.

 

[CCityInstaller]

Originally posted by: CCityInstaller

Originally posted by: Extelleron
Just flash the X1800XT w/ the X1800XT PE BIOS for 695/1600.

What X1800XT PE bios? I haven't run across a PE version while I was doing my research for which card to purchase.

Nevermind, Google is my friend. Mauri, I would first make sure your card can handle the higher core/memory speeds before flashing the bios. I can run at PE speeds with my stock bios, so I see no need to flash it and risk ruining my card. I would also highly suggest you pick up an Artic Cooling Accelero X2 heastink for your card. It dropped my temps almost 12C and it is whisper quiet, even with the fan running at 75% all the time.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Elfear

Like Bull Dog mentioned, you're volts were probably still at 2D levels (1.175V).

Does this only apply to the X1800XT or the X1800XL also?? Cause if I increase the voltage even to 1.150 from default 1.075, the temps go up on the voltage reuglators to uncomfortable levels while overclocking. I don't even wanna imagine what would happen if I put it to 1.4v.

While reading an article over at TechpowerUp on overclocking the X1800XL it didn't mention anything about ATITool showing 2D volts instead of 3D volts. They went to a maximum of 1.25v on the core.

Anyone have any links showing what is correct?

 

[VERTIGGO]

dude you're right I was just thinking 1.175V was kind of low. I'll try that

 

[JBT]

X1800's use less voltage than the 1900's 1.4vcore is the 3d voltage for the 1900's its a bit lower on the x1800's, I don't remember what it is for them though.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: JBT
X1800's use less voltage than the 1900's 1.4vcore is the 3d voltage for the 1900's its a bit lower on the x1800's, I don't remember what it is for them though.

Well the OP has an X1800XT...not an X1900, so I don't know why ElFear told him to do 1.4vcore. He might kill his card. Or was ElFear replying to someone else...it wasn't clear in his post.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: thilan29

Originally posted by: JBT
X1800's use less voltage than the 1900's 1.4vcore is the 3d voltage for the 1900's its a bit lower on the x1800's, I don't remember what it is for them though.

Well the OP has an X1800XT...not an X1900, so I don't know why ElFear told him to do 1.4vcore. He might kill his card. Or was ElFear replying to someone else...it wasn't clear in his post.

Sorry my post wasn't clear. I was replying to VERTIGGO who has an X1900XT. I believe the X1800XT uses 1.3V or 1.35V on the core. I've seen guys use 1.25-1.3V on X1800XLs (including my brother) with good success. You just have to watch the temps since the XL cooler isn't as good as the XT cooler.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: thilan29

Originally posted by: JBT
X1800's use less voltage than the 1900's 1.4vcore is the 3d voltage for the 1900's its a bit lower on the x1800's, I don't remember what it is for them though.

Well the OP has an X1800XT...not an X1900, so I don't know why ElFear told him to do 1.4vcore. He might kill his card. Or was ElFear replying to someone else...it wasn't clear in his post.

Sorry my post wasn't clear. I was replying to VERTIGGO who has an X1900XT. I believe the X1800XT uses 1.3V or 1.35V on the core. I've seen guys use 1.25-1.3V on X1800XLs (including my brother) with good success. You just have to watch the temps since the XL cooler isn't as good as the XT cooler.

Hey thanks for the reply. I can do 600MHz with 1.15vcore but the temps get too high. I'm waiting for my watercooling setup to come in so I can clock it some more. Now I just need to find a way to cool the VRMs.

 

[the Chase]

The stock 3D voltage for the X1800XT (mine anyway) is 1.275. I've had it up to 1.475 on a Zalman VF700 so far with no issues other than it still runs a bit too hot for my liking even with the improved cooling. For the memory a lot of times for the X1800XT's it actually helps to decrease the voltage(I'm at 2.058) for the highest memory overclocks.

thilan 29- what water cooling are you going with?

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: the Chase
The stock 3D voltage for the X1800XT (mine anyway) is 1.275. I've had it up to 1.475 on a Zalman VF700 so far with no issues other than it still runs a bit too hot for my liking even with the improved cooling. For the memory a lot of times for the X1800XT's it actually helps to decrease the voltage(I'm at 2.058) for the highest memory overclocks.

thilan 29- what water cooling are you going with?

I'm gonna go with the Gigabyte Galaxy kit but ditch the CPU waterblock (CPU runs cool enough with Thermaltake Big Typhoon) and just put a DangerDen Maze4 Acetal waterblock on the GPU. The reviews I've read of the kit are all positive and it's 1/2 tubing, plus it only cost about $150 without the GPU block of course.

I was thinking of one of the Swiftech kits but they were pretty expensive so I didn't bother.

 

[VERTIGGO]

How much should I expect out of an XT? My pc crashed and the last clock I saw was 637/725.

 

[5150Joker]

Originally posted by: VERTIGGO
How much should I expect out of an XT? My pc crashed and the last clock I saw was 637/725.

You must be doing something wrong. You should get at least 700 mhz core out of the card with 1.4v.

 

[JBT]

you should atleast get 690 core, 1600 memory. I havn't seen a single card not being able to atleast get that.

Lol I just re-read my post about the voltage. It would help if I put some type of punctuation in my sentances.... Sorry if anyone was confused about what what I said.
IE X1800XT's use less on their vcore at stock, and X1900Xt's use more.

 

[mauri]

Well, I'm not going to flash the card, but I'm still interested of overclocking it with ATI Tools. I tried to disable ATI Hotkey and ATI Smart services (Control Panel -> Admin Tools -> Services) with no success. Do you just disable them, or should they be deleted somehow? overclocking with ATI Tools haven't been a success for me so far, it just crashes even under stock clocks. I might be doing something wrong.

And ATI Tools are showing my core voltage as 1.275, so I guess that is the Vcore for the GPU (after disablig 2D/3D difference in ATI Tools)? I haven't tried to overclock it that hard yet, but with ATI CCC overdrive my card topped out at around 670/760 . After that it the windows crashed. I was hoping it would atleast hit to the top of the Overdrive (690/800).

 

[JBT]

With overtime simply slide the clocks to 690/800 you will be fine.... To disable hotkeypoller and smart services: start > run > msconfig > services un check both ATI apps. Reboot and they will be disabled.

 

[Golgatha]

Originally posted by: 5150Joker

Originally posted by: VERTIGGO
How much should I expect out of an XT? My pc crashed and the last clock I saw was 637/725.

You must be doing something wrong. You should get at least 700 mhz core out of the card with 1.4v.

My memory has absolutely no problem getting 800Mhz, but the core seems to artifact lower than 690 core on my card even at 1.4V. I haven't disabled the background services though, but I think the Beta ATI Tools stops those services before attempting to OC your card.