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WTF? Justice Dept will require Arab visitors to be fingerprinted?

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Let me just say this. Before September 11, the ATOT forums would be all shocked and outraged by this kinda news. But with the Bush administration and a huge national tragedy (which Arabs DID take part in of course) we don't really care about being PC anymore, not at all. The sudden change in everyone's political views leads me to believe ATOT forum-goers really are pretty young and malleable


Two words: Times change.

Learn it, live it, know it.

I agree with Ashcroft this is a good idea.
 
take notice "visitors" meaning this applies to tourists who are just there to visit disneyland
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Good point. Maybe we should ask these "visitors" if they're here to see the Magic Kingdom, or if they're here to blow it up.
rolleye.gif
 
Originally posted by: Citrix
Let me just say this. Before September 11, the ATOT forums would be all shocked and outraged by this kinda news. But with the Bush administration and a huge national tragedy (which Arabs DID take part in of course) we don't really care about being PC anymore, not at all. The sudden change in everyone's political views leads me to believe ATOT forum-goers really are pretty young and malleable


Two words: Times change.

Learn it, live it, know it.

I agree with Ashcroft this is a good idea.
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True, true, but rather than accept post-September 11 changes I would like to believe there's a way back to how things were...

In any case, I don't see how fingerprinting will solve the problem. The hijackers all had expired visas. Who was there to tell 'em to leave? How will that be solved now? Sure, INS should take care of it, but didn't we just decide to dissolve the INS? Won't this fingerprinting thing make it harder to track expired visas by adding more bureaucracy and information management??

 
Better idea - Put Blockbuster in charge of tracking down and kicking out individuals who are in the country on expired visas. If they can track down people who return rentals late and don't pay, they sure as hell can track down individuals with expired visas.

Let's face it folks, one of the main culprits of the 9/11 attacks was our immigration policy and execution. Just about every person that was involved in the attacks had no business being in the country.

That said, I can't say that I disagree with the Justice Department's decision. If you are currently at war with an organization operating out of a certain region, it only makes sense to scrutinize people coming from that region. I would say that I'd like to see that happen with all immigrants but that is infeasible given the number of visitors the USA receives every year.

I would have also liked to see Congress involved in this in some fashion as well. The Justice Dept doing this on its own red-flags and makes easy prey for Bush/Ashcroft haters.
 
I think they should stop immigration altogether and let America be for Americans ONLY! Anyone who is non-White looking, fingerprint em, and make them wear idtags!!!





j/k...lmao. This is silly.
 
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
So would a better solution be to just keep all the Arab visitors out?
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Hey sounds like a plan to me!
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And the millions already here, leagally or not, what do you do with them? Some have actually made a great contribution like AMEX's CEO and the thousands of other professionals from that area. Also, what is an arab and how whould you make the distinction in your policy? For example, If a Swiss guy orginally from Saudi wnted to come here how would we know he was'nt just Swiss?
 
Queasy,

Why don't we just declare war on those countries then? That's a surefire way to screen them out and shut 'em down, and I'd be all for it. If America's at war with someone, why do I care about their rights? Why should I feel sorry for 'em? They f**ked with us for too long, and we've seen through their "blame the terrorists" smokescreen, and now they must suffer the consequences!!!

I guess what really pisses me off is this New Cold War bullsh*t going on. The government cannot declare war, but they keep pickin' and scrapin' any which way they can, and all it does is rile up Americans' hate but it doesn't solve the problem.
 
The only way this will prevent crime is if they have a prior record. I think this is just a show for the public to feel safe.
 
In any case, I don't see how fingerprinting will solve the problem. The hijackers all had expired visas. Who was there to tell 'em to leave? How will that be solved now? Sure, INS should take care of it, but didn't we just decide to dissolve the INS? Won't this fingerprinting thing make it harder to track expired visas by adding more bureaucracy and information management??
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Well you could compare it to a database of known/supected criminals. They do exist. Have them send them in advance with the visa paperwork so they can be processed, fingerprint them again when they get here to verify their identity. It's all about developing and sharing info.
 
Originally posted by: uncJIGGA
Let me just say this. Before September 11, the ATOT forums would be all shocked and outraged by this kinda news. But with the Bush administration and a huge national tragedy (which Arabs DID take part in of course) we don't really care about being PC anymore, not at all. The sudden change in everyone's political views leads me to believe ATOT forum-goers really are pretty young and malleable.
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Not true. My support for printing and photographing ALL foreign visitors existed before 9/11 and hasn't changed. Too many people are going AWOL from their student / tourist visa, and this could help the successor to INS with hunting them down and deporting them. It's not fair to legal immigrants for these people to be abusing the system this way.

 
Originally posted by: minendo
I think that every person that enters this country should be finger printed and photographed.
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I agree 100% If you don't like it, stay in your own crap country.

 
The only way this will prevent crime is if they have a prior record. I think this is just a show for the public to feel safe.
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I don't agree. What if the CIA was surveiling a known or suspected/terrorist and he had a meeting with a bunch of people say in a hotel somewhere. They coud go in after that mtg and lift all the fingerprints. Now you would have fingerprints of a bunch of suspected terrorists for your database. No you wouldn't be able to put a face on it, but so what. You would eventually if they tried getting in the country and it matched/flagged as a suspected terrorist. Maybe other countries have their fingerprints, Israel for example. I think this is a good first step in the right direction.
 
Originally posted by: uncJIGGA
Originally posted by: Citrix
Let me just say this. Before September 11, the ATOT forums would be all shocked and outraged by this kinda news. But with the Bush administration and a huge national tragedy (which Arabs DID take part in of course) we don't really care about being PC anymore, not at all. The sudden change in everyone's political views leads me to believe ATOT forum-goers really are pretty young and malleable


Two words: Times change.

Learn it, live it, know it.

I agree with Ashcroft this is a good idea.
Click to expand...
True, true, but rather than accept post-September 11 changes I would like to believe there's a way back to how things were...

In any case, I don't see how fingerprinting will solve the problem. The hijackers all had expired visas. Who was there to tell 'em to leave? How will that be solved now? Sure, INS should take care of it, but didn't we just decide to dissolve the INS? Won't this fingerprinting thing make it harder to track expired visas by adding more bureaucracy and information management??
Click to expand...

If we go back to how it was, then more skyscrappers are going to fall. We've learned that our lax attitude and performance with immigration doesn't work well enough.
 
Originally posted by: Spoooon
If they are going to be fingerprinting Arab visitors, they should be fingerprinting every visitor.
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In theory, I agree with you; however, our resources are not infinite, and therefore we have to target our application of our resources.

Fact:
Several fanatical religious sects of the "church" of Islam have declared a Holy War on U.S. and it's way of life.
These sects typically shun non-Arabs.
Therefore, the greatest threat lies with Arab immigrants. Not trying to be racist...

I say we install tracking devices on _all_ foreign nationals; we do it with wildlife, so why not? Don't even try to throw the Bill of Rights at me, non-citizens are not afforded the protection of the Bill of Rights.

 
Does anyone here knows or have a guess on the percentage of student visa and tourist visa thats being misused as a mean to gain entry and stay in the US illegally?
 
Hey I have a better idea why not just enforce the immigrations laws already on the books? If they deported these terrorists once thier visas had expired *THEY* wounld'nt have been here to learn to fly and crash into buildings. Once again they won't and don't enforce these laws because it gets expensive real quick and it's easier to pass feel good regualtions which will do little to prevent the ones willing to make the ulimate sacifice. Ever actually callled INS on a group of illegals? It's laughable phone call and they never come out. Try it sometime you'll get a kick out of it.
 
who say Middle Eastern men will be targeted.
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Read the entire article not just the headline next time. Some extremist groups are afraid that arab men may be targeted. I think it is a good idea for a large percentage of visitors to our country be fingerprinted. After all they are not citizens and they do not enjoy the same rights and freedoms that citizens do. If you want something to be genuinely worried about, read up on the Patriot Act. That targets US citizens and actually denies gauranteed rights such as unlawful search and seizure. Don't you love it when Congress passes reactionary legislation? I can't wait untill someone brings that one to the court.
 
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