wow, treasury bills yielding negative return for first time in history

[HeXploiT]

Originally posted by: JS80
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...KEI6F4&refer=worldwide

cliffs: If you invested $1 million in three-month bills at today?s negative discount rate of 0.01 percent, for a price of 100.002556, at maturity you would receive the par value for a loss of $25.56.


This is the next asset bubble. I'd be looking to short treasuries (TLT) or go long short treasury ETF (TBT) in the near future. I remember studying about this happening to Japanese Treasuries in college...never thought it would ever happen to US.

The entire market is totally out of whack. I will quote Ron Paul.
"The market is smarter than all those entities manipulating it".
In essence it means the markets will ultimately find their true value regardless of what sort of manipulation is going on behind the scenes.
Loving the Ultrashort financial ETF's especially SKF. Probably be making a move on ProShares Ultra Silver very soon.

T-bills...
Just think, people are paying the government to hold their cash!??

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Where am I supposed to put my damn money?

Here

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Awesome You're so pissed you're repeating and babbling Awesome :thumbsup:

I'd post the same thing, because once again my point was true. But I'll avoid doing so because you'll never get the point.

I guess you decide my emotions now. Must be nice being god :laugh:

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

Congrats, you've found another way to fail!

Guess we'll see about that the next 4 years as the screws turn on you radical righties.

Sorry Dave, Obama and the Democrats are more on my side than a miserable failure like you. I'll actually make more money under Obama than Bush if he passes his tax plan. You on the other hand will still be begging for handouts and bouncing from one miserable failure to the next.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Where am I supposed to put my damn money?

Nonperishables? For the coming barter economy.

 

[Cuda1447]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

I'm still waiting for proof of that.

 

[PokerGuy]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: child of wonder

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Where am I supposed to put my damn money?

Gold, silver, etc.

Value of the dollar will drop again as inflation takes hold from these massive bailouts.

Because the market would never have priced that in already. Everybody knows that won't eventually happen.

hehehe , I think we need a "sarcasm" tag available for posts

 

[PokerGuy]

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

I'm still waiting for proof of that.[/quote]

Most educated? :laugh:

Dave is like one of those action movies that so bad that it's actually funny when it wasn't intended to be funny. He's such an idiot the rest of us get a good chuckle out of his idiot posts, even though he intends them to be taken seriously :laugh: I just wish the mods would put a cap on his posts, there is only so much stupidity one can handle at a time.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: PokerGuy

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

I'm still waiting for proof of that.

Most educated? :laugh:

Dave is like one of those action movies that so bad that it's actually funny when it wasn't intended to be funny. He's such an idiot the rest of us get a good chuckle out of his idiot posts, even though he intends them to be taken seriously :laugh: I just wish the mods would put a cap on his posts, there is only so much stupidity one can handle at a time.
[/quote]I continue to swing between your opinion of him and another that says he's simply a troll.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Perry404

Originally posted by: JS80
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...KEI6F4&refer=worldwide

cliffs: If you invested $1 million in three-month bills at today?s negative discount rate of 0.01 percent, for a price of 100.002556, at maturity you would receive the par value for a loss of $25.56.


This is the next asset bubble. I'd be looking to short treasuries (TLT) or go long short treasury ETF (TBT) in the near future. I remember studying about this happening to Japanese Treasuries in college...never thought it would ever happen to US.

The entire market is totally out of whack. I will quote Ron Paul.
"The market is smarter than all those entities manipulating it".
In essence it means the markets will ultimately find their true value regardless of what sort of manipulation is going on behind the scenes.
Loving the Ultrashort financial ETF's especially SKF. Probably be making a move on ProShares Ultra Silver very soon.

T-bills...
Just think, people are paying the government to hold their cash!??

lol, quoting Ron Paul to make a point that people far smarter than him have been making for decades, if not centuries.

Wow, you're so...epic...in doing so.

 

[StarsFan4Life]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: JS80
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...KEI6F4&refer=worldwide

cliffs: If you invested $1 million in three-month bills at today?s negative discount rate of 0.01 percent, for a price of 100.002556, at maturity you would receive the par value for a loss of $25.56.


This is the next asset bubble. I'd be looking to short treasuries (TLT) or go long short treasury ETF (TBT) in the near future. I remember studying about this happening to Japanese Treasuries in college...never thought it would ever happen to US.

You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

I love when people blame Bush. Ironically, the one's who had control of all of this have had control of the government for the last 2-3 years......*cough* Democrats *cough*

 

[HeXploiT]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Perry404

Originally posted by: JS80
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...KEI6F4&refer=worldwide

cliffs: If you invested $1 million in three-month bills at today?s negative discount rate of 0.01 percent, for a price of 100.002556, at maturity you would receive the par value for a loss of $25.56.


This is the next asset bubble. I'd be looking to short treasuries (TLT) or go long short treasury ETF (TBT) in the near future. I remember studying about this happening to Japanese Treasuries in college...never thought it would ever happen to US.

The entire market is totally out of whack. I will quote Ron Paul.
"The market is smarter than all those entities manipulating it".
In essence it means the markets will ultimately find their true value regardless of what sort of manipulation is going on behind the scenes.
Loving the Ultrashort financial ETF's especially SKF. Probably be making a move on ProShares Ultra Silver very soon.

T-bills...
Just think, people are paying the government to hold their cash!??

lol, quoting Ron Paul to make a point that people far smarter than him have been making for decades, if not centuries.

Wow, you're so...epic...in doing so.

Your insult was far from epic and your "lol" was obviously contrived.

 

[L00PY]

Originally posted by: Fern
I saw that, it's hard to figure.

Best I can come up with is that it's foreign money flowing into US $'s and it's probably easier to put in T-Bills than exchange into and hold regular currency.

Wierdness

Fern

Edit: Maybe somebody's betting on some serious deflation?

Best I can tell is that it's a combination of things. First off there's what the article mentioned, the year end effect. At the end of the year, managers would like to be able to show that they have a significant portion of their funds in something stable like T-Bills. The incoming rush has pushed the yield down. There's also the foreign effect, where such an investment might still yield positive returns when currency exchanges are considered. Finally, there is enough uncertainty in the market now that people are willing to pay to park their millions anywhere where they're guaranteed to get it back. The instability in the financial sector, compounded by the Lehman induced money market woes, means people are willing to pay that premium for the best guarantee out there.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: StarsFan4Life

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

I love when people blame Bush. Ironically, the one's who had control of all of this have had control of the government for the last 2-3 years......*cough* Democrats *cough*

Go ahead keep lying.

I hope you can't stand it and leave.

Have your bags packed yet?

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: Perry404

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Perry404

Originally posted by: JS80
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...KEI6F4&refer=worldwide

cliffs: If you invested $1 million in three-month bills at today?s negative discount rate of 0.01 percent, for a price of 100.002556, at maturity you would receive the par value for a loss of $25.56.


This is the next asset bubble. I'd be looking to short treasuries (TLT) or go long short treasury ETF (TBT) in the near future. I remember studying about this happening to Japanese Treasuries in college...never thought it would ever happen to US.

The entire market is totally out of whack. I will quote Ron Paul.
"The market is smarter than all those entities manipulating it".
In essence it means the markets will ultimately find their true value regardless of what sort of manipulation is going on behind the scenes.
Loving the Ultrashort financial ETF's especially SKF. Probably be making a move on ProShares Ultra Silver very soon.

T-bills...
Just think, people are paying the government to hold their cash!??

lol, quoting Ron Paul to make a point that people far smarter than him have been making for decades, if not centuries.

Wow, you're so...epic...in doing so.

Your insult was far from epic and your "lol" was obviously contrived.

No, I really did laugh.

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Go ahead keep lying.

I hope you can't stand it and leave.

Have your bags packed yet?

After passing these garbled words through my asshat to english translator, what dave was really trying to say was, "I'd like waffles, with a side of bacon. And a glass of orange juice please!"

Your right, it is fun to just make shit up!

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Svnla

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Svnla
I read the story today and scratch my head. Why would anyone doesn't want to get any interest? At least spread your $$ around in 30 days CDs.

Let see, $250K limit per bank, over 3000 banks with FDIC insurance = at least $750 million

Safety, ease of management. Do you want to manage 3000 bank accounts? Most portfolio managers don't easier.

Safety? FDIC is as good as Tbill the last time I checked (within the amount limit)

Ease of management? 1 account vs. 3000? 1 is better but for half of the interest of $750 million, I would more than glad to handle all those accounts. Let see $750 million @ 1% CDs = $7.5 million. I would love to take half of that. Filthy rich people, PM me now!!!!

It's a combination of safety. Do you have any idea what managing 3,000 accounts would entail? How much time, effort, money, would be wrapped up in investing that? I am in a wealth management role and it's not a simple thing to manage and I don't have anywhere near that.

For example, you actually have to fill out 3,000 Patriot Act forms. Then, you have to wire 3,000 separate funds, of which, that movement of money would probably require registration and more compliance information. Just moving the money through Fed Wires would cost 24,000 (fed wire costs $8). That's not even including what happens if you want to move it out? Then that's another 24,000. Then there's account maintenance fees. Not to mention tracking the money.

I know you're kinda having fun with the idea, but it's pretty damn complex.

What about a money market fund? You could still get a ~2.5% yield, and I believe all of the major investment firms accept very large investments.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Svnla

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Svnla
I read the story today and scratch my head. Why would anyone doesn't want to get any interest? At least spread your $$ around in 30 days CDs.

Let see, $250K limit per bank, over 3000 banks with FDIC insurance = at least $750 million

Safety, ease of management. Do you want to manage 3000 bank accounts? Most portfolio managers don't easier.

Safety? FDIC is as good as Tbill the last time I checked (within the amount limit)

Ease of management? 1 account vs. 3000? 1 is better but for half of the interest of $750 million, I would more than glad to handle all those accounts. Let see $750 million @ 1% CDs = $7.5 million. I would love to take half of that. Filthy rich people, PM me now!!!!

<----- tongue in cheek, I know big time $$ managers won't able to do so

Institutional money managers can't invest the $500 billion fund in 2 million bank CDs. It's easier to roll their money to treasuries, and the demand is so huge right now it's negative yielding. My guess is those funds are not "allowed" to hold cash and "must" buy treasuries.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Svnla

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: Svnla
I read the story today and scratch my head. Why would anyone doesn't want to get any interest? At least spread your $$ around in 30 days CDs.

Let see, $250K limit per bank, over 3000 banks with FDIC insurance = at least $750 million

Safety, ease of management. Do you want to manage 3000 bank accounts? Most portfolio managers don't easier.

Safety? FDIC is as good as Tbill the last time I checked (within the amount limit)

Ease of management? 1 account vs. 3000? 1 is better but for half of the interest of $750 million, I would more than glad to handle all those accounts. Let see $750 million @ 1% CDs = $7.5 million. I would love to take half of that. Filthy rich people, PM me now!!!!

It's a combination of safety. Do you have any idea what managing 3,000 accounts would entail? How much time, effort, money, would be wrapped up in investing that? I am in a wealth management role and it's not a simple thing to manage and I don't have anywhere near that.

For example, you actually have to fill out 3,000 Patriot Act forms. Then, you have to wire 3,000 separate funds, of which, that movement of money would probably require registration and more compliance information. Just moving the money through Fed Wires would cost 24,000 (fed wire costs $8). That's not even including what happens if you want to move it out? Then that's another 24,000. Then there's account maintenance fees. Not to mention tracking the money.

I know you're kinda having fun with the idea, but it's pretty damn complex.

What about a money market fund? You could still get a ~2.5% yield, and I believe all of the major investment firms accept very large investments.

He's talking about money market fund managers. They are the ones buying treasuries.

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

Congrats, you've found another way to fail!

LOL, you stole my thunder, jackass! :thumbsup::laugh:

 

[Cattlegod]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

aww good going, you just gave him the biggest hard on to go along with his 10 dollar a gallon gas.

edit: well at least I see you are referencing his own comment in another thread, so it isn't all bad

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Cattlegod

Originally posted by: Cuda1447

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

You may be the most educated American on the internet, but you're also the biggest annoyance.

aww good going, you just gave him the biggest hard on to go along with his 10 dollar a gallon gas.

edit: well at least I see you are referencing his own comment in another thread, so it isn't all bad

Are you all packed and ready to go?

There can't be anything for you stay in Michigan for.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: alchemize

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You have got to be proud of what Bush and your buds have accomplished.

come on dude, we get it, you hate Bush. So do a ton of people.

Say something that doesn't relate to him for one post man, just one.

I do everyday.

I say something that relates to Obama and the Democrats making the Bush and the Republcan supporters want to leave the country on a daily basis.

When just one actually leaves it will be my personal "Mission Accomplished".

Congrats, you've found another way to fail!

Guess we'll see about that the next 4 years as the screws turn on you radical righties.

Hope so.
Cause then they'll all get voted out (just like last time) and the favor will get returned.

 

[RU482]

wow, I came into this thread actually interested, and it got hijacked by partisians.

Why the hell do you guys have to do this to every thread??