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Would you rather have lighter cars with less safety features?

theeedude

theeedude

Lifer
I think I'd give up some safety features for a big weight reduction. Meaning cheaper, more fun, better handling, economical car, all things being equal. I mean people give up safety for fun when they ride motorcycles, bicycles, do a lot of other fun activities, but for some reason manufacturers build up all cars for safety minded consumer, which means your average RWD sports car is well over 3000lbs now.
 
If everyone else was driving one the risk wouldn't be doubled....

But according to your wording of the poll... no
 
Originally posted by: senseamp
but for some reason manufacturers build up all cars for safety minded consumer, which means your average RWD sports car is well over 3000lbs now.
Click to expand...

There's this thing called laws which is why they have to.
 
I don't see how we'd ever be able to take a step backwards in terms of safety. Our society just doesn't work that way.

Rather than dumping safety for weight, I would prefer that more composites be used in the construction of cars. If more automakers would commit to using composites then the cost of manufacturing would come way down.
 
As already stated, we really have little choice in the matter. Laws are being passed every year requiring more and more safety equipment as well as better mileage for cars to be used on public roads.
 
If it's my only car? No, because I got to cart the family around, and the weight savings doesn't make a family car that much more fun to drive when you're never driving it fast anyway.

For my fun car? Definitely. I'd love dropping the car down to 1300 lbs.
 
We can always pay even more for safety features as well as the lighter weights. Just requires more expensive materials.
 
Not safety, but I would for trim and comfort features. If my seat is comfortable they could strip out a huge amount of the plastic trim, sound deadening, and things like that.
 
Originally posted by: ayabe
Rather than dumping safety for weight, I would prefer that more composites be used in the construction of cars. If more automakers would commit to using composites then the cost of manufacturing would come way down.
Click to expand...

Just speculation:

The BMW 335i and G37 are about the same size. Both have ~330HP 6-cylinder engines (according to Edmunds). But the BMW 335i costs about $5,000 more for similar spec, and weighs several hundred pounds less.

I've been told the cost of using aluminum is really high compared to steel, and high-end composites like kevlar and carbon fiber would give you a Chevy Malibu with a Maserati pricetag. (GM actually did something along these lines in the 90s, building a super-aerodynamic composite car with a dinky engine and great fuel economy. They cost as much as a house.)

There's also the question of where the weight is coming from. The main reason why cars are much quieter than they once were is the massive amount of heavy noise insulation spread through the cabin, which adds a lot of weight. A fancy stereo adds weight. Climate control systems, with their fancy ducting and compressors, can add a LOT of weight. And so it goes on.

Then again, this is already something of a moot point. Small, light sports cars like the Mazda Miata are far more dangerous than a big Saab convertible, and weigh something like eight hundred pounds less.

Originally posted by: zerocool84
Originally posted by: senseamp
but for some reason manufacturers build up all cars for safety minded consumer, which means your average RWD sports car is well over 3000lbs now.
Click to expand...

There's this thing called laws which is why they have to.
Click to expand...

Meh. The Chevy Aveo is sold in the US, and the thing is a freakin' deathtrap.
 
Originally posted by: zerocool84
Originally posted by: senseamp
but for some reason manufacturers build up all cars for safety minded consumer, which means your average RWD sports car is well over 3000lbs now.
Click to expand...

There's this thing called laws which is why they have to.
Click to expand...

Yep.

Just about all makers keep saying Safety or Gas milage, pick one not both when congress and states keep adding both safety and milage standards.


I use to have a 75 Monza (V8) Only thing safe about it was... well... ahh... oh yea it had seatbelts. 🙂


The best safety device is in the drivers seat. If it works right then the majority of safety equipment is wasted.
 
Originally posted by: Cheesehead
Originally posted by: ayabe
Rather than dumping safety for weight, I would prefer that more composites be used in the construction of cars. If more automakers would commit to using composites then the cost of manufacturing would come way down.
Click to expand...

Just speculation:

The BMW 335i and G37 are about the same size. Both have ~330HP 6-cylinder engines (according to Edmunds). But the BMW 335i costs about $5,000 more for similar spec, and weighs several hundred pounds less.
Click to expand...

They are within 50lbs of each other. That's something like $100/lb you have to pay to get weight savings. I think the price difference goes somewhere else.
 
I'd prefer a lighter vehicle. With the right engineering, there's no reason a light vehicle can't be safe.

I think cars keep getting heavier because it's easier to add metal instead of re-engineering something.
 
Originally posted by: JDub02
I'd prefer a lighter vehicle. With the right engineering, there's no reason a light vehicle can't be safe.

I think cars keep getting heavier because it's easier to add metal instead of re-engineering something.
Click to expand...

If it was the 60's or 70's I would agree. But even mazda had a hard time getting weight off the current Miata. They had to shave metal from under rthe shift knob and other little 1oz here 2 oz there type things.

Car companies go out of there way to cut weight. Weight is a double edge sword as it hurts your power numbers and gas milage.

I remember how much metal was in my old 75 Monza vs any car i have owned from the mid 80's up that was a lot of plastic.
 
Can?t put a price on safety.

I?m quite content in the knowledge that if I crash my car in a high speed accident I?ve got a good chance of being able to walk away from it unscathed.
 
Originally posted by: Cheesehead
Originally posted by: ayabe
Rather than dumping safety for weight, I would prefer that more composites be used in the construction of cars. If more automakers would commit to using composites then the cost of manufacturing would come way down.
Click to expand...

Just speculation:

The BMW 335i and G37 are about the same size. Both have ~330HP 6-cylinder engines (according to Edmunds). But the BMW 335i costs about $5,000 more for similar spec, and weighs several hundred pounds less.

I've been told the cost of using aluminum is really high compared to steel, and high-end composites like kevlar and carbon fiber would give you a Chevy Malibu with a Maserati pricetag. (GM actually did something along these lines in the 90s, building a super-aerodynamic composite car with a dinky engine and great fuel economy. They cost as much as a house.)

There's also the question of where the weight is coming from. The main reason why cars are much quieter than they once were is the massive amount of heavy noise insulation spread through the cabin, which adds a lot of weight. A fancy stereo adds weight. Climate control systems, with their fancy ducting and compressors, can add a LOT of weight. And so it goes on.

Then again, this is already something of a moot point. Small, light sports cars like the Mazda Miata are far more dangerous than a big Saab convertible, and weigh something like eight hundred pounds less.
Click to expand...

Well aluminum fluctuates in price quite a bit, it was at an all time high for the past couple years, but took a nosedive in '08. Some MFG's swap aluminum bits in and out of models depending on it's price.

For example, my '06 WRX has some aluminum front suspension pieces that were removed from the '07 model due to cost.

My point is, that techniques for manufacturing composite materials are still incredibly labor intensive, work that can't be done with machines in a lot of cases. But I think the processes could be improved if GM, Ford, Honda, etc got together and got serious about making affordable cars made with these materials.



 
Originally posted by: Bignate603
Not safety, but I would for trim and comfort features. If my seat is comfortable they could strip out a huge amount of the plastic trim, sound deadening, and things like that.
Click to expand...

^^^

I would prefer fewer electronic controls and luxury items, and only the necessary safety items (seatbelts, airbags, ABS, traction control, etc).

Also, what is the deal with cars getting larger with each new model redesign? For example, the Accord used to be a compact car, then a mid-sized car, and now the current version is full-size. I may be in the minority here, but I would prefer a smaller vehicle - less material for the body and it should weigh less.
 
If it was legal, I'd rather just ride around in a monster truck. I'm talking six foot tall wheels, the whole works. Not only could I see for miles but I could just roll right over retard drivers instead of totaling my own vehicle. Self-preservation.
 
Originally posted by: KentState
They are within 50lbs of each other. That's something like $100/lb you have to pay to get weight savings. I think the price difference goes somewhere else.
Click to expand...


The Edmunds example said a bit more than that....but, then again, the G37 in question was full of doodads and the BMW wasn't.
 
Originally posted by: senseamp
I think I'd give up some safety features for a big weight reduction. Meaning cheaper, more fun, better handling, economical car, all things being equal. I mean people give up safety for fun when they ride motorcycles, bicycles, do a lot of other fun activities, but for some reason manufacturers build up all cars for safety minded consumer, which means your average RWD sports car is well over 3000lbs now.
Click to expand...

Not all of them are. Just build them smaller.
 
Originally posted by: JDub02
I'd prefer a lighter vehicle. With the right engineering, there's no reason a light vehicle can't be safe.

I think cars keep getting heavier because it's easier to add metal instead of re-engineering something.
Click to expand...
So they've actually been producing the same cars for the last 40 years or so? Just re-skinning them?
 
Originally posted by: woodie1
As already stated, we really have little choice in the matter. Laws are being passed every year requiring more and more safety equipment as well as better mileage for cars to be used on public roads.
Click to expand...

Catch 22. Demand more MPG but also demand more equipment causing more weight. Plus then moving heavy americans around you've got a little problem here 😛
 
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