Would it be a waste of time to start taking a multivitamin?

[Legend]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

 

[Legend]

And not to mention that so many foods are already fortified. Cereal for example. It's got a centrum built in.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

Well, that's good if you're eating the perfect diet. Personally, my diet is pretty atrocious... but it's probably better than most people out there. For the pennies that each cost, they're worth it to me just incase i'm not getting enough of whatever i'm supposed to need.

 

[Legend]

Even so, so many consumer foods are fortified. Cereal, bread, grains, milk, orange juice, etc. What are you eating that doesn't give you these common, elementary nutrients? Hell, Mcdonalds burgers have iron, folate, calcium in them.

 

[Looney]

It's not the common nutrients that i'm concerned about.

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: Looney
It's not the common nutrients that i'm concerned about.

What vitamins are you taking? Everything in centrum is common.

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I just realized this is most likely a false positive. Why are the children taking vitamins? Because they have well intentioned parents. These kids are probably already getting evertying from normal vitamins in cereal, and their parents just raised them better in general (probably encourage eating some healthy food too...).

 

[Looney]

Centrum Forte. Like i said though, for a few pennies a day, i'm willing to piss out 90% of it, as long as it covers me for those days i'm missing. Personally, i think it's stupid not to.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I just realized this is most likely a false positive. Why are the children taking vitamins? Because they have well intentioned parents. These kids are probably already getting evertying from normal vitamins in cereal, and their parents just raised them better in general (probably encourage eating some healthy food too...).

False positive? What kind of authority do you have on this?

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: Looney

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I just realized this is most likely a false positive. Why are the children taking vitamins? Because they have well intentioned parents. These kids are probably already getting evertying from normal vitamins in cereal, and their parents just raised them better in general (probably encourage eating some healthy food too...).

False positive? What kind of authority do you have on this?

A source was never provided. There was never a reason to believe any direct correlation.

I could give dozens of links of studies saying that multivitamins are worthless.

 

[Throwmeabone]

I truly feel good when I take vitamins, but who knows maybe it's psychological. I could never get all that crap in through food though anyway.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: Looney

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

Well, that's good if you're eating the perfect diet. Personally, my diet is pretty atrocious... but it's probably better than most people out there. For the pennies that each cost, they're worth it to me just incase i'm not getting enough of whatever i'm supposed to need.

My diet certainly isn't atrocious, except for the RC Cola.. but I don't have the time or energy to cook a 3 course meal with spinach, artichokes, mussels, codfish, etc.. So I drink Ovaltine in my coffee and take vitamins. Fruits are a pain. I don't like most, and the ones that you can buy a lot of and keep for a long time, like apples, are nutritionally empty.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I just realized this is most likely a false positive. Why are the children taking vitamins? Because they have well intentioned parents. These kids are probably already getting evertying from normal vitamins in cereal, and their parents just raised them better in general (probably encourage eating some healthy food too...).

No, it wasn't a poll. It was an experiment in which one group of kids were given vitamins and the other weren't.

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I just realized this is most likely a false positive. Why are the children taking vitamins? Because they have well intentioned parents. These kids are probably already getting evertying from normal vitamins in cereal, and their parents just raised them better in general (probably encourage eating some healthy food too...).

No, it wasn't a poll. It was an experiment in which one group of kids were given vitamins and the other weren't.

What did they eat? Source?

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Looney

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

Well, that's good if you're eating the perfect diet. Personally, my diet is pretty atrocious... but it's probably better than most people out there. For the pennies that each cost, they're worth it to me just incase i'm not getting enough of whatever i'm supposed to need.

My diet certainly isn't atrocious, except for the RC Cola.. but I don't have the time or energy to cook a 3 course meal with spinach, artichokes, mussels, codfish, etc.. So I drink Ovaltine in my coffee and take vitamins. Fruits are a pain. I don't like most, and the ones that you can buy a lot of and keep for a long time, like apples, are nutritionally empty.

Apples are not nutritionally empty. They just don't have vitamin names to describe all of its nutrients.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=15


I guess the whole "there's SO MUCH MORE" speech went over your head.

 

[Legend]

See, I can talk about studies too, but back them up:

http://www.cbc.ca/story/science/national/2002/07/05/vitamindiseases_020705.html

OXFORD, ENGLAND - Daily doses of vitamins do nothing to guard against diseases, according to a new study.
The report, published in the journal The Lancet, says people who are at high risk of getting heart disease, cancer or other ailments are better off eating fresh fruit and vegetables to protect themselves.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3703498.stm

Vitamin supplements do nothing to prevent gut cancers and may shorten life expectancy, research suggests.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Looney

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

Well, that's good if you're eating the perfect diet. Personally, my diet is pretty atrocious... but it's probably better than most people out there. For the pennies that each cost, they're worth it to me just incase i'm not getting enough of whatever i'm supposed to need.

My diet certainly isn't atrocious, except for the RC Cola.. but I don't have the time or energy to cook a 3 course meal with spinach, artichokes, mussels, codfish, etc.. So I drink Ovaltine in my coffee and take vitamins. Fruits are a pain. I don't like most, and the ones that you can buy a lot of and keep for a long time, like apples, are nutritionally empty.

Apples are not nutritionally empty. They just don't have vitamin names to describe all of its nutrients.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=15


I guess the whole "there's SO MUCH MORE" speech went over your head.

Because your "so much more" stuff is unsupported. Most of the compounds we use that are in food are well known. There's no great mystery. Regardless of that, since apples are mostly air-as the low concentration of known nutrients shows- they are probably low on your theoretical nutrients. That article talks about what an apple contains, but doesn't mention amounts.

 

[Legend]

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Looney

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe

Originally posted by: Legend

Originally posted by: mercanucaribe
It can't hurt. Even if you're pissing 90% of them away, the other 10% is something your body wouldn't have had.

If stuff like Centrum helps you, then that should be a huge warning flag: You're not getting the most basic of nutrients found in any half decent food.

People need to understand that Vitamins are the most basic, essential nutrients needed to survive the short term. There's so many other nutrients out there. Stuff we don't even understand, like Kiwi's strong antioxidant effects are yet to be understood.

The types of fats, and carbs, and protein you eat are immensely important as well.

A study showed that schoolchildren who took vitamins had higher IQs... No matter how well you eat, chances are you aren't getting 100% of your RDA of something. Even most fruits actually have very small amounts of most vitamins. You act like no matter what you eat you'll get all of everything. Even someone eating a "balanced diet" can benefit from more of some vitamins. Fact is vitamins can't do any harm... it's not like they destroy those magical other things you think exist in food.

I think you completely missed my point. I'm saying that if cheap vitamins help you, your diet is atrocious and the real problem is to address that. Simply spaming your body with cheap, synthetic forms of minerals is not going to make up for that. You're still likely digesting a terribly imbalanced diet, with no omega 3 fats, trans fats, simple carbs, saturated fats, and empty calories.

Sure, if the kids are drinking soda, and eating pizza, cheap vitamins will help. But eating healthy is dozens of times healthier.

There is SO MUCH MORE than what is in a centrum. Resveratrol in grapes is much more powerful than any of the antioxidants found in centrum. You get it from red grapes and peanuts. ECGC found in green tea is one of the most powerful antioxidants that we know of, and it's not found in typical diet.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146

Fruits, vegetables, meat, nuts, beans, rice, etc contain everything that those cheap vitamins have and more. And they come in forms that are much, much more bio available than cheap mineral forms, which cheap vitamins contain. They contain good carbs, proteins, fats, etc.

To say you can't get all of what the RDA from real food is absolutely ridiculous. It's so easy to get vitamin C, calcium, iron, etc. These things are in everything.


For example:

Spinach:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=43

Brocolli:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=9

Seasame seeds:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=84

Peanuts:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=101

Oranges:
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=37

Well, that's good if you're eating the perfect diet. Personally, my diet is pretty atrocious... but it's probably better than most people out there. For the pennies that each cost, they're worth it to me just incase i'm not getting enough of whatever i'm supposed to need.

My diet certainly isn't atrocious, except for the RC Cola.. but I don't have the time or energy to cook a 3 course meal with spinach, artichokes, mussels, codfish, etc.. So I drink Ovaltine in my coffee and take vitamins. Fruits are a pain. I don't like most, and the ones that you can buy a lot of and keep for a long time, like apples, are nutritionally empty.

Apples are not nutritionally empty. They just don't have vitamin names to describe all of its nutrients.

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=15


I guess the whole "there's SO MUCH MORE" speech went over your head.

Because your "so much more" stuff is unsupported. Most of the compounds we use that are in food are well known. There's no great mystery. Regardless of that, since apples are mostly air-as the low concentration of known nutrients shows- they are probably low on your theoretical nutrients.

rofl

I gave you a source with references.

You talk about a study, with no source.

Unfounded?

Review Study Provides Even More Reasons to Enjoy Apples

A major review study published in the May 2004 issue of the Nutrition Journal provides dozens of reasons to enjoy an apple every day.

A review study is one that looks at the results of many other studies. This one included an analysis of 85 studies. Apples were found to be most consistently associated with a reduced risk of cancer, heart disease, asthma, and type 2 diabetes when compared to other fruits and vegetables. In addition, eating apples was also associated with increased lung function and increased weight loss.

Here are some of the reasons why:

Apples are a rich and very important source of phytochemicals, including flavonoids and phenols, in the American diet and in Europe. In the United States, 22% of the phenolic compounds consumed from fruits come from apples, making them the largest source of phenols in the American diet.

When compared to other fruits, apples ranked second in total concentration of phenolic compounds, and perhaps more importantly, had the highest portion of free phenols. Since free phenols are not bound to other compounds in the fruit, they may be more available for absorption into the bloodstream.

Apples are also an excellent source of antioxidants, and when compared to many other commonly consumed fruits in the United States, were found to have the second highest level of antioxidant activity. Many of the phytochemicals found in apples, including quercetin, catechin, phloridzin and chlorogenic acid, are strong antioxidants. .

The total antioxidant activity of 100 grams of whole apple (with the peel) was found to be equivalent to the antioxidant effect of about 1500 mg of vitamin C. (However, the amount of vitamin C in 100 g of apples is only about 5.7 mg. Nearly all of the antioxidant activity from apples comes from a variety of other compounds.)

Oh, but they're clearly making it all up...

References

* Bazzano LA, He J, Ogden LG, Loria CM, Whelton PK. Dietary fiber intake and reduced risk of coronary heart disease in US men and women: the National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey I Epidemiologic Follow-up Study. Arch Intern Med. 2003 Sep 8;163(16):1897-904.
* Boyer J, Liu RH. Apple phytochemicals and their health benefits. Nutr J. 2004 May 12;3(1):5.
* Cho E, Seddon JM, Rosner B, Willett WC, Hankinson SE. Prospective study of intake of fruits, vegetables, vitamins, and carotenoids and risk of age-related maculopathy. Arch Ophthalmol. 2004 Jun;122(6):883-92.
* Consumers Union of United States, Inc. Do you know what you're eating? An analysis of US government data on pesticide residues in foods. Consumers Union of United States, Inc. Edward Groth III, PhD, Project Director, Charles M. Benbrook, PhD, Consultant, Public Service Projects Department, Technical Division. Feb 1999.
* Ensminger AH, Esminger M. K. J. e. al. Food for Health: A Nutrition Encyclopedia. Clovis, California: Pegus Press; 1986.
* Fernandez ML. Soluble fiber and nondigestible carbohydrate effects on plasma lipids and cardiovascular risk. Curr Opin Lipidol 2001 Feb;12(1):35-40.
* Heinerman J. Heinerman's New encyclopedia of Fruits and Vegetables. Prentice Hall 1995.
* Honow R, Laube N, Schneider A, Kessler T, Hesse. Influence of grapefruit-, orange- and apple-juice consumption on urinary variables and risk of crystallization. Br J Nutr. Aug;90(2):295-300.
* Huxley RR, Neil HAW. The relation between dietary flavonol intake and coronary heart disease mortality: a meta-analysis of prospective cohort studies,. European Journal of Clinical Nutrition (2003) 57, 904-908.
* Kern M, Tjaden Z, Ngiewih Y, Puppel N, Will F, Dietrich H, Pahlke G, Marko D. Inhibitors of the epidermal growth factor receptor in apple juice extract. Mol Nutr Food Res. 2005 Mar 9;49(4):317-328 [Epub ahead of print].
* Knekt P, Jarvinen R, Reunanen A, Maatela J. Flavonoid intake and coronary mortality in Finland: a cohort study. BMJ 1996 Feb 24;312 (7029): 478-81.
* Liu RH, Liu J, Chen B. Apples prevent mammary tumors in rats. J Agric Food Chem. 2005 Mar 23;53(6):2341-3.
* Mahan K, Escott-Stump S. Krause's Food, Nutrition, and Diet Therapy. WB Saunders Company; Philadelphia, 1996.
* Pearson DA, Tan CH, German JB, et al. Apple juice inhibits low density lipoprotein oxidation. Life Sci 1999;64(21):1913-20.
* Puel C, Quintin A, Mathey J, Obled C, Davicco MJ, Lebecque P, Kati-Coulibaly S, Horcajada MN, Coxam V. Prevention of bone loss by phloridzin, an apple polyphenol, in ovariectomized rats under inflammation conditions. Calcif Tissue Int. 2005 Nov;77(5):311-8. Epub 2005 Nov 16.
* Sable-Amplis R, Sicart R, Agid R. Further studies on the cholesterol-lowering effect of apple in humans. Biochemical mechanisms involved. Nutr Res 1983;3:325-8.
* Solovchenko A, Schmitz-Eiberger M. Significance of skin flavonoids for UV-B-protection in apple fruits. J Exp Bot. Aug;54(389):1977-84. Epub 2003 Jun 18.
* Van Der Sluis AA, Dekker M, Skrede G. Activity and concentration of polyphenolic antioxidants in apple juice. 1. Effect of existing production methods. J Agric Food Chem 2002 Dec 4;50(25):7211-9.
* Wood, Rebecca. The Whole Foods Encyclopedia. New York, NY: Prentice-Hall Press; 1988.

These nutrients aren't theoretical. They just don't have names. In the following case, it's called ECGC. Is that in centrum? No.

If you want an example of a nonstandard nutrient that has mountains of research behind it, I've already linked you to green tea:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_benefits_of_tea
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=146
http://chinesefood.about.com/library/weekly/aa011400a.htm


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytonutrients
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flavonoids