Working for a big four company...

[krunchykrome]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Xcobra
Thanks guys! Appreciate the input. I have been told that KPMG is probably not a good choice and just wanted to get others' opinions. I did get an interview with them and were very impressed with my background. But turns out that they had no room for tax people. Now that I look back, I could've gone for the audit internship. Although the class I took last semester, I hated it. But I will still have to do it to get my hours for the CPA.

As for the 150 unit requirement, I am doing so. That's the reason I am taking 5 years to graduate. So what I did is double-concentration: accounting and financial management. Worked perfectly. So I am certain to get the 150 units. I am doing pretty well (could do better). Mainly As and Bs (aside from an F i got freshman year and a few Cs in my sophmore year) so I think I'm doing pretty decent.

How about studying for the CPA? I know once I pass it, many doors will open.

hahaha....my gf took the auditing class and she loved it....but she said the class was hard as hell.

The thing about a CPA is that lots of people do not want to do it. The responsibility you have is huge and in some cases companies will hold you completely liable for mistakes. I have no idea because I am an engineer, but my gf is an accountant and wa sgonna get her cpa. Her last internship was working with 4 CPAs doing CPA work. She did not enjoy it at all.

If you want a career in accounting, you must get your CPA. Otherwise, you're just a glorified bookkeeper. Before I started in public accounting, I interned in the private sector, in the tax dept. Although I enjoyed it and it wasn't public tax, I feel that there is more experience to be gained in audit. Audit will teach how how a company is run, from the bottom to the top.

She knows that, but she is not even sure if she wants to pursue accounting anymore. Personally, I do not blame her. She is outgoing and uplifting type and I really do not think accounting fits her well. She is the type of person who needs a job where you do not sit in an office all day crunching numbers (that's me, but my job does not require that). I want her to atleast try audting though, but she is kind of scared of it.



she actually talked to me about iy yesterday too. She has no idea what she can do with an accounting degree besides accounting. I just told her that the sky is the limit and she needs to really buck down and force her way into a field that she may like.

The important thing is to do something you enjoy. You don't necessarily have to love your job, but waking up in the morning knowing you hate your career must be horrible.

 

[evident]

it's hell, you work +60 hr weeks depending on the client and start with a terrible base salary, like 40-45k

 

[KeithTalent]

Originally posted by: kstu

Originally posted by: KeithTalent
I can't imagine someone making partner in only two years right out of school though. Not sure what those guys are talking about.

That would be a joke. If you were an absolute all-star employee, you might make partner in 10-12 years. That's the absolute minimum.

Yeah, that's much more in line with what I've encountered.

KT

 

[Gibson486]

Originally posted by: evident
it's hell, you work +60 hr weeks depending on the client and start with a terrible base salary, like 40-45k

???? Starting salary at the big 4 is more close to 55k. Hell, my gf was offered closer to 60k and my cousin got 62k (but she works in finance).

 

[Dr. Detroit]

I did 5yrs in a Silicon Valley Big 4 being an auditor before moving on to a local firm.

Tax, yuck to me so I hope you enjoy it.

As long as you are a good worker, punctual, dress well, and not a dumbass you will get the job. A lot of what PwC looks for in people is personality and working together with your peers. Don't be annoying but also don't just sit in your cube not talking to people.

PwC will take you to lots of events, drink, but don;t drink heavily. Lots of intern outings, don;t be that guy and sexually harass any of the other cute interns. Don't hit on the recruiting coordinator.

I think you go to Disneyworld for your last week if you get an offer so don't F it up.


You really should stay with 1 firm for 6yrs, manager + 1. Its the best time to leave after that if you feel public accounting is not right for you.

I think its more difficult to find a job in corporate with a tax background as you are much more limited in your knowledge. With an audit background you have many more opportunities.


Best of luck

 

[krunchykrome]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: evident
it's hell, you work +60 hr weeks depending on the client and start with a terrible base salary, like 40-45k

???? Starting salary at the big 4 is more close to 55k. Hell, my gf was offered closer to 60k and my cousin got 62k (but she works in finance).

Yea, that salary seems very low. Might be reasonable for a smaller firm.

 

[amish]

international tax is fun because it will always be necessary. the biggest problem with it, especially expat tax, which is what i did for three years, is that you don't have much movement laterally after the first few years. for me i had all this great experience from EY working on expat returns but that was all i was able to do. i couldn't prep a 1120/1065/1041 pretty much anything besides a 1040.

krunchy is right about KPMG. they have laughable technology compared to the other big 4 firms.

krunchy, i can't believe that your school let you graduate with an accounting degree without meeting the 150 hour requirement!

 

[Gibson486]

Originally posted by: amish
international tax is fun because it will always be necessary. the biggest problem with it, especially expat tax, which is what i did for three years, is that you don't have much movement laterally after the first few years. for me i had all this great experience from EY working on expat returns but that was all i was able to do. i couldn't prep a 1120/1065/1041 pretty much anything besides a 1040.

krunchy is right about KPMG. they have laughable technology compared to the other big 4 firms.

krunchy, i can't believe that your school let you graduate with an accounting degree without meeting the 150 hour requirement!

most schools give you the option to do it. AT my gf's college, if you decided you wanted to get a cpa, the set up a whole program for it.

 

[krunchykrome]

Originally posted by: amish
international tax is fun because it will always be necessary. the biggest problem with it, especially expat tax, which is what i did for three years, is that you don't have much movement laterally after the first few years. for me i had all this great experience from EY working on expat returns but that was all i was able to do. i couldn't prep a 1120/1065/1041 pretty much anything besides a 1040.

krunchy is right about KPMG. they have laughable technology compared to the other big 4 firms.

krunchy, i can't believe that your school let you graduate with an accounting degree without meeting the 150 hour requirement!

Well we had the option, but I was so eager to get out there and start working to gain experience. At the time, I didn't understand exactly what a "busy season" entailed. I though I could still manage graduate school (at least 2 classes per semester) even during busy season. I only took one class this last busy season; I ended up getting an A, but I don't think I could have handled an additional class. During the rest of the year, I take 2 classes per semester.

If there was one thing I would go back and do, it would be to meet the 150 hour requirement before joining the workforce.

 

[amish]

another bit of advice for the graduates or soon to be grads. plan on taking the CPA exam early. i put it off for a year, then another, ad nauseam. now i need to bust ass and get it done. shaking out the cobwebs 5 years after college isn't easy.

 

[ChaoZ]

Do all the big 4 help pay for the CPA exam? And would they also pay/subsidize review courses?

 

[Michael]

The danger with going into Tax is that if you want to move into industry and move up the ladder, Tax is not the way to CFO. Typically, Audit gives you the most career flexibility.

If you get an opportunity to work at a Big 4 (Big 8 when I started), then do so. They're all good and a lot of your work experience will depend on which clients you get and which team you work on, so take anyone that tells you that xxx is bad and yyy is good with a large grain of salt.

In general, no low level Audit or Tax person travels outside of the metropolitan area you were hired into. There are exceptions, but typically you need to be at least a Senior before you travel.

Michael
(started at KPMG and is a CFO today and has been a CFO of a large public company ...)

 

[krunchykrome]

Originally posted by: ChaoZ
Do all the big 4 help pay for the CPA exam? And would they also pay/subsidize review courses?

yes, plus assistance with review courses/material

 

[Xcobra]

Well, I am thinking of just doing this internship in tax and then ask them if I could start in audit (if they offer me a job), maybe stay there for a couple of years and then if I don't like it, go back to tax. Are they that flexible? This would also get the one year audit experience and 150 units for the CPA exam. Ideas?

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Xcobra
I have one more year in college and I am doing an internship with PricewaterhouseCoopers (in SF) this summer (starts monday actually). I am mainly going to be concerned with international tax returns. Hopefully it is not as bad and don't change my mind about tax. They said that 90% chance they'll offer me a job after graduation. What do you guys think? I was thinking about going for KPMG, but I am not sure exactly about a big four company. I know there is room to grow but what about going regional?

Thanks!

If you do tax, you will be stuck doing tax for the rest of your career. Doing audit opens up more opportunities. Plus everyone I know who did tax either switched to audit or made a career change.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: kstu

Originally posted by: Xcobra
I was thinking about going for KPMG.

McDonald's > KPMG

fixed

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Xcobra
Thanks guys! Appreciate the input. I have been told that KPMG is probably not a good choice and just wanted to get others' opinions. I did get an interview with them and were very impressed with my background. But turns out that they had no room for tax people. Now that I look back, I could've gone for the audit internship. Although the class I took last semester, I hated it. But I will still have to do it to get my hours for the CPA.

As for the 150 unit requirement, I am doing so. That's the reason I am taking 5 years to graduate. So what I did is double-concentration: accounting and financial management. Worked perfectly. So I am certain to get the 150 units. I am doing pretty well (could do better). Mainly As and Bs (aside from an F i got freshman year and a few Cs in my sophmore year) so I think I'm doing pretty decent.

How about studying for the CPA? I know once I pass it, many doors will open.

hahaha....my gf took the auditing class and she loved it....but she said the class was hard as hell.

The thing about a CPA is that lots of people do not want to do it. The responsibility you have is huge and in some cases companies will hold you completely liable for mistakes. I have no idea because I am an engineer, but my gf is an accountant and wa sgonna get her cpa. Her last internship was working with 4 CPAs doing CPA work. She did not enjoy it at all.

If you want a career in accounting, you must get your CPA. Otherwise, you're just a glorified bookkeeper. Before I started in public accounting, I interned in the private sector, in the tax dept. Although I enjoyed it and it wasn't public tax, I feel that there is more experience to be gained in audit. Audit will teach how how a company is run, from the bottom to the top.

Not true. I don't have my CPA license and I was promoted to Manager, Accounting and Finance. My boss who doesn't have a cpa license either was promoted from controller to CFO.

But CPA does help a lot in getting noticed.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Xcobra
Thanks guys! Appreciate the input. I have been told that KPMG is probably not a good choice and just wanted to get others' opinions. I did get an interview with them and were very impressed with my background. But turns out that they had no room for tax people. Now that I look back, I could've gone for the audit internship. Although the class I took last semester, I hated it. But I will still have to do it to get my hours for the CPA.

As for the 150 unit requirement, I am doing so. That's the reason I am taking 5 years to graduate. So what I did is double-concentration: accounting and financial management. Worked perfectly. So I am certain to get the 150 units. I am doing pretty well (could do better). Mainly As and Bs (aside from an F i got freshman year and a few Cs in my sophmore year) so I think I'm doing pretty decent.

How about studying for the CPA? I know once I pass it, many doors will open.

hahaha....my gf took the auditing class and she loved it....but she said the class was hard as hell.

The thing about a CPA is that lots of people do not want to do it. The responsibility you have is huge and in some cases companies will hold you completely liable for mistakes. I have no idea because I am an engineer, but my gf is an accountant and wa sgonna get her cpa. Her last internship was working with 4 CPAs doing CPA work. She did not enjoy it at all.

If you want a career in accounting, you must get your CPA. Otherwise, you're just a glorified bookkeeper. Before I started in public accounting, I interned in the private sector, in the tax dept. Although I enjoyed it and it wasn't public tax, I feel that there is more experience to be gained in audit. Audit will teach how how a company is run, from the bottom to the top.

She knows that, but she is not even sure if she wants to pursue accounting anymore. Personally, I do not blame her. She is outgoing and uplifting type and I really do not think accounting fits her well. She is the type of person who needs a job where you do not sit in an office all day crunching numbers (that's me, but my job does not require that). I want her to atleast try audting though, but she is kind of scared of it.



she actually talked to me about iy yesterday too. She has no idea what she can do with an accounting degree besides accounting. I just told her that the sky is the limit and she needs to really buck down and force her way into a field that she may like.

oh and corporate accounting is day and night to audit. you will literally know nothing going from audit to corporate accounting. I wouldn't stay longer than 2-4 years in public if you're planning on ending up in corporate accounting.

 

[krunchykrome]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Xcobra
Thanks guys! Appreciate the input. I have been told that KPMG is probably not a good choice and just wanted to get others' opinions. I did get an interview with them and were very impressed with my background. But turns out that they had no room for tax people. Now that I look back, I could've gone for the audit internship. Although the class I took last semester, I hated it. But I will still have to do it to get my hours for the CPA.

As for the 150 unit requirement, I am doing so. That's the reason I am taking 5 years to graduate. So what I did is double-concentration: accounting and financial management. Worked perfectly. So I am certain to get the 150 units. I am doing pretty well (could do better). Mainly As and Bs (aside from an F i got freshman year and a few Cs in my sophmore year) so I think I'm doing pretty decent.

How about studying for the CPA? I know once I pass it, many doors will open.

hahaha....my gf took the auditing class and she loved it....but she said the class was hard as hell.

The thing about a CPA is that lots of people do not want to do it. The responsibility you have is huge and in some cases companies will hold you completely liable for mistakes. I have no idea because I am an engineer, but my gf is an accountant and wa sgonna get her cpa. Her last internship was working with 4 CPAs doing CPA work. She did not enjoy it at all.

If you want a career in accounting, you must get your CPA. Otherwise, you're just a glorified bookkeeper. Before I started in public accounting, I interned in the private sector, in the tax dept. Although I enjoyed it and it wasn't public tax, I feel that there is more experience to be gained in audit. Audit will teach how how a company is run, from the bottom to the top.

She knows that, but she is not even sure if she wants to pursue accounting anymore. Personally, I do not blame her. She is outgoing and uplifting type and I really do not think accounting fits her well. She is the type of person who needs a job where you do not sit in an office all day crunching numbers (that's me, but my job does not require that). I want her to atleast try audting though, but she is kind of scared of it.



she actually talked to me about iy yesterday too. She has no idea what she can do with an accounting degree besides accounting. I just told her that the sky is the limit and she needs to really buck down and force her way into a field that she may like.

oh and corporate accounting is day and night to audit. you will literally know nothing going from audit to corporate accounting. I wouldn't stay longer than 2-4 years in public if you're planning on ending up in corporate accounting.

how will he know nothing from going from audit to corporate accounting? Audit lets him/her look and learn a company's operations from a birds-eye view. Corporate accounting is an application of what you've learned in school and what you've observed in the field in public accounting.

 

[kstu]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: kstu

Originally posted by: Xcobra
I was thinking about going for KPMG.

McDonald's > KPMG

fixed

I was just trying to be nice about it.

 

[JDub02]

I just wanted to point out that it's y'all, not ya'll.

 

[Michael]

1st - Anyone that thinks that working in audit doesn't get you ready for corporate accounting loses a great deal of credibility with me. You do not need a CPA or an audit background to do corporate accounting, but it certainly helps.

2nd - Finance management jobs become more and more leadership based and less technical the higher up you go. It is important to have agood personality and be outgoing if you want to progress.

3rd - I'm not sure where the KPMG hate is coming from, but the firm is fine.

I'm talking from the perspective of someone who is a CFO today, was a public company CFO (current company is private but can go public) and who is on the BoD of a public company (including serving on the audit committee).

Any career crunches you hard the first few years and accounting is no different. However, there are great opportunites in the career as well if you stick to it.

Michael

 

[AccruedExpenditure]

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If you don't make partners in 2 years, be prepared to move.

You have no idea what you're talking about

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: krunchykrome

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Xcobra
Thanks guys! Appreciate the input. I have been told that KPMG is probably not a good choice and just wanted to get others' opinions. I did get an interview with them and were very impressed with my background. But turns out that they had no room for tax people. Now that I look back, I could've gone for the audit internship. Although the class I took last semester, I hated it. But I will still have to do it to get my hours for the CPA.

As for the 150 unit requirement, I am doing so. That's the reason I am taking 5 years to graduate. So what I did is double-concentration: accounting and financial management. Worked perfectly. So I am certain to get the 150 units. I am doing pretty well (could do better). Mainly As and Bs (aside from an F i got freshman year and a few Cs in my sophmore year) so I think I'm doing pretty decent.

How about studying for the CPA? I know once I pass it, many doors will open.

hahaha....my gf took the auditing class and she loved it....but she said the class was hard as hell.

The thing about a CPA is that lots of people do not want to do it. The responsibility you have is huge and in some cases companies will hold you completely liable for mistakes. I have no idea because I am an engineer, but my gf is an accountant and wa sgonna get her cpa. Her last internship was working with 4 CPAs doing CPA work. She did not enjoy it at all.

If you want a career in accounting, you must get your CPA. Otherwise, you're just a glorified bookkeeper. Before I started in public accounting, I interned in the private sector, in the tax dept. Although I enjoyed it and it wasn't public tax, I feel that there is more experience to be gained in audit. Audit will teach how how a company is run, from the bottom to the top.

She knows that, but she is not even sure if she wants to pursue accounting anymore. Personally, I do not blame her. She is outgoing and uplifting type and I really do not think accounting fits her well. She is the type of person who needs a job where you do not sit in an office all day crunching numbers (that's me, but my job does not require that). I want her to atleast try audting though, but she is kind of scared of it.



she actually talked to me about iy yesterday too. She has no idea what she can do with an accounting degree besides accounting. I just told her that the sky is the limit and she needs to really buck down and force her way into a field that she may like.

oh and corporate accounting is day and night to audit. you will literally know nothing going from audit to corporate accounting. I wouldn't stay longer than 2-4 years in public if you're planning on ending up in corporate accounting.

how will he know nothing from going from audit to corporate accounting? Audit lets him/her look and learn a company's operations from a birds-eye view. Corporate accounting is an application of what you've learned in school and what you've observed in the field in public accounting.

An auditor does not know how to enter Journal Entries, does not truly understand reversing entries, and does not fully understand the general ledger.

Cmon, ticking and tying and footing does not prepare you for corporate accounting. The advantage of having public background is you know what the auditors want when audit time rolls around.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: AccruedExpenditure

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If you don't make partners in 2 years, be prepared to move.

You have no idea what you're talking about

i think he means if you're not on partner track after 2 years be prepared to move. I think you can tell within 2-4 years if you are cut out to be a partner. Any monkey can do audit but it takes a certain personality to do it for 10-15 years and become a partner.