wooot.... osx86 is awesome!

[Rogue]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Rogue

Originally posted by: Gnrslash4life
In the real world

Mac - Better security
Windows - Better software support


end of arguement.

That's funny. Let me revise that for you:

In the real world

Mac - no one cares enough to hack it, so it's really security through obscurity. Give it time and let it become more popular and it will prove to be less secure than Windows for most users. I guarandamntee that statement.

Windows - has about a two year head start on truly securing the OS. Vista will improve upon it further. Securing an OS is like trying to eliminate every single possible way that a car's engine could fail, including user errors. It's very, very difficult.

Security thru obscurity my ass,
OSX is built upon BSD derivative, which has the best security record thus far. Ms has been trying to ghetto patch their product for the past two years because they haven't designed XP as at true multiuser system. If you run all your daemons in the root/admin user space, as soon as someone overflows the stack, you're done. That's why the RPC worm killed off 95% of machines out there...it was a design flaw more than anything else.

If you actually knew something about computer security, you could make some valid arguments against OSX...

You're truly comedic man, seriously. First off, OSX is security through obscurity, pure and simple. Am I saying there's NO security in OSX? No. What I am saying is that there simply is not a large enough base of users to make it profitable or beneficial enough to exploit. I'd venture a guess as well that the average Windows user is more "security inclined" at this point than the average Mac user. Windows users understand the value of a virus scanner, anti-spyware app, firewall, etc. Mac users tend to have a more utopian view of computing and assume, like you do, that OSX is secure out of the box. That's a typical fallacy of OSX users.

Case in point, look at Firefox. Initially everyone lauded Firefox as a secure browser and people flocked to it as some sort of solution to their security woes while surfing. Sure enough, a few weeks later, people started attacking and exploiting Firefox and finding flaws in it.

I fear it's you that doesn't know squat about computer security. Calling me out on the topic will only make you look like an ass. Here are some articles for reading:

http://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2005/Sep/1014965.html
http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/14914
http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=12660
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/19/symantec_threat_report/

Let us also consider that a secure OS does little in the way of protecting insecure applications as well. Far too many people believe that a secure OS means a secure system, that couldn't be farther from the truth. Acrobat, Photoshop, Office, etc. all have security flaws in them that can be exploited no matter how secure your system is. Do I need to continue? Or have you learned your lesson yet?

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Rogue

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Rogue

Originally posted by: Gnrslash4life
In the real world

Mac - Better security
Windows - Better software support


end of arguement.

That's funny. Let me revise that for you:

In the real world

Mac - no one cares enough to hack it, so it's really security through obscurity. Give it time and let it become more popular and it will prove to be less secure than Windows for most users. I guarandamntee that statement.

Windows - has about a two year head start on truly securing the OS. Vista will improve upon it further. Securing an OS is like trying to eliminate every single possible way that a car's engine could fail, including user errors. It's very, very difficult.

Security thru obscurity my ass,
OSX is built upon BSD derivative, which has the best security record thus far. Ms has been trying to ghetto patch their product for the past two years because they haven't designed XP as at true multiuser system. If you run all your daemons in the root/admin user space, as soon as someone overflows the stack, you're done. That's why the RPC worm killed off 95% of machines out there...it was a design flaw more than anything else.

If you actually knew something about computer security, you could make some valid arguments against OSX...

You're truly comedic man, seriously. First off, OSX is security through obscurity, pure and simple. Am I saying there's NO security in OSX? No. What I am saying is that there simply is not a large enough base of users to make it profitable or beneficial enough to exploit. I'd venture a guess as well that the average Windows user is more "security inclined" at this point than the average Mac user. Windows users understand the value of a virus scanner, anti-spyware app, firewall, etc. Mac users tend to have a more utopian view of computing and assume, like you do, that OSX is secure out of the box. That's a typical fallacy of OSX users.

Case in point, look at Firefox. Initially everyone lauded Firefox as a secure browser and people flocked to it as some sort of solution to their security woes while surfing. Sure enough, a few weeks later, people started attacking and exploiting Firefox and finding flaws in it.

I fear it's you that doesn't know squat about computer security. Calling me out on the topic will only make you look like an ass. Here are some articles for reading:

http://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2005/Sep/1014965.html
http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/14914
http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=12660
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/19/symantec_threat_report/

Let us also consider that a secure OS does little in the way of protecting insecure applications as well. Far too many people believe that a secure OS means a secure system, that couldn't be farther from the truth. Acrobat, Photoshop, Office, etc. all have security flaws in them that can be exploited no matter how secure your system is. Do I need to continue? Or have you learned your lesson yet?

Oh I'm sure the limited user base has some effect on the amount of exploits out there, but saying that overall windows is more secure is just foolish. All things held equal, having true user based fs will end up being more secure than Admin / limited user set up. WinFs oughta fix a lot of this stuff if it ever ships out though.

I can come up with the same list of critical windows updates that hardly prove anything, that's not really the point of the discussion.

 

[yourdeardaniel]

i wanna try OSX only for the GUI
windows looks ugly : (

 

[jalaram]

Originally posted by: yourdeardaniel
i wanna try OSX only for the GUI
windows looks ugly : (

They have skins out there that let get close to OSX on a Windows system.+

Here's one that does a lot of the interface in one simple install.

 

[Rogue]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Rogue

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: Rogue

Originally posted by: Gnrslash4life
In the real world

Mac - Better security
Windows - Better software support


end of arguement.

That's funny. Let me revise that for you:

In the real world

Mac - no one cares enough to hack it, so it's really security through obscurity. Give it time and let it become more popular and it will prove to be less secure than Windows for most users. I guarandamntee that statement.

Windows - has about a two year head start on truly securing the OS. Vista will improve upon it further. Securing an OS is like trying to eliminate every single possible way that a car's engine could fail, including user errors. It's very, very difficult.

Security thru obscurity my ass,
OSX is built upon BSD derivative, which has the best security record thus far. Ms has been trying to ghetto patch their product for the past two years because they haven't designed XP as at true multiuser system. If you run all your daemons in the root/admin user space, as soon as someone overflows the stack, you're done. That's why the RPC worm killed off 95% of machines out there...it was a design flaw more than anything else.

If you actually knew something about computer security, you could make some valid arguments against OSX...

You're truly comedic man, seriously. First off, OSX is security through obscurity, pure and simple. Am I saying there's NO security in OSX? No. What I am saying is that there simply is not a large enough base of users to make it profitable or beneficial enough to exploit. I'd venture a guess as well that the average Windows user is more "security inclined" at this point than the average Mac user. Windows users understand the value of a virus scanner, anti-spyware app, firewall, etc. Mac users tend to have a more utopian view of computing and assume, like you do, that OSX is secure out of the box. That's a typical fallacy of OSX users.

Case in point, look at Firefox. Initially everyone lauded Firefox as a secure browser and people flocked to it as some sort of solution to their security woes while surfing. Sure enough, a few weeks later, people started attacking and exploiting Firefox and finding flaws in it.

I fear it's you that doesn't know squat about computer security. Calling me out on the topic will only make you look like an ass. Here are some articles for reading:

http://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2005/Sep/1014965.html
http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/14914
http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=12660
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/19/symantec_threat_report/

Let us also consider that a secure OS does little in the way of protecting insecure applications as well. Far too many people believe that a secure OS means a secure system, that couldn't be farther from the truth. Acrobat, Photoshop, Office, etc. all have security flaws in them that can be exploited no matter how secure your system is. Do I need to continue? Or have you learned your lesson yet?

Oh I'm sure the limited user base has some effect on the amount of exploits out there, but saying that overall windows is more secure is just foolish. All things held equal, having true user based fs will end up being more secure than Admin / limited user set up. WinFs oughta fix a lot of this stuff if it ever ships out though.

I can come up with the same list of critical windows updates that hardly prove anything, that's not really the point of the discussion.

At NO point did I ever say Windows is "more secure" so I think you should read again. Making such a blanket statement absolutely stinks of fanboy. I do however believe that the "average" Windows user is now more security conscious than the "average" Mac user though. Also, it is the point of discussion. You indicated that OSX is more secure than Windows and better because of it. I am simply pointing out that a security flaw is a security flaw and both systems have them. Your statements might lead the casual user to believe that they are somehow more secure by using OSX and truth be told, they are, just not in the right context. If OSX becomes more mainstream with the move to Intel hardware (cheaper prices, etc.), expect to see more exploits. Short of you looking at the code base and analyzing it line by line, I'd venture a guess that you can't prove that OSX is more secure versus any other OS out there. Being built on another platform only means that there are more holes and exploits added into the original code base.

 

[dugweb]

Originally posted by: halik

Originally posted by: dugweb

Originally posted by: AgaBoogaBoo

Originally posted by: dugweb
A new 200gig hard drive is on the way and I would love to throw OSx86 on there, but Im on an AMD

Are you clearly stating that Intel > AMD?!?!?!

<---- pulls up a lawn chair and popcorn for another flame war

haha! hardly, ive just been wanting a mac for a while, and I would rather just buy the OS to accomplish this, rather than to buy an entire new setup

AMD pwns

it runs on amd too

:Q really?! any place i can go to test my hardware to see if it'll work? (ive got an Nvidia Gforce 6800 PCI express card, AMD 2800 cpu, my mobo is the MSI KM4AM-V

 

[yourdeardaniel]

Originally posted by: jalaram

They have skins out there that let get close to OSX on a Windows system.+

Here's one that does a lot of the interface in one simple install.

thx for link

 

[Zolty]

I want my 10 minutes back, that is all

 

[chcarnage]

Originally posted by: Rogue
I fear it's you that doesn't know squat about computer security. Calling me out on the topic will only make you look like an ass. Here are some articles for reading:

http://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2005/Sep/1014965.html
http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/14914
http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=12660
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/19/symantec_threat_report/

Apple often (always?) publishes holes after there's a fix. I'm not sure how Microsoft handles this? The difference is that OS X holes until now didn't get exploitet. And the market share argument comfortably can be falsified with a hint to the Apache:IIS situation.

The CryptoCard is designed for Macs in open environments to prevent wardriving and intrusions... Hardly an OS-specific treat because all clients have to use the same protocol?

Do you ask the candlemaker if it's dark in your home? I can't speak for the PC side of things, but Symantec has a bad reputation for Mac false alerts.

But since you linked a TheReg article, here's a critical article about Windows Vista (NOT security related though):

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/24/microsoft_masochism/

I'd say that only the first two links can back up your argumentation.

 

[ElFenix]

did we ever find out what hardware this is?

 

[remagavon]

I hope those of your running this daily will purchase an x86 mac when they're released to further R&D of OSX.

 

[Saint Nick]

Originally posted by: halik
Well seeing as i paid for OSX license when getting an ibook while ago,
i dont feel too bad running 10.4 on my P4 machine...

I have to say, though, OSX is killer on this harware. I mean it's running circles over the ibook I had - no slowdowns what so ever and all of my hardware is supported. Plus the goofy little things that apple makes (expose, dashboard etc.) really help the usability.

pics

where can i get this and how, please tell me.