Wisc. Gov vetoes abortion bill

[RightIsWrong]

IF it is proven beyond a doubt that a fetus can feel pain, then this might have some place in the Dr/Patient exchange. Until that time comes, I have to agree with the Govenor on this.

Source

Wisconsin governor vetoes abortion bill

Saturday, January 7, 2006; Posted: 10:42 a.m. EST (15:42 GMT)

MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Doyle, a Democrat, said there is no evidence conclusively proving when a fetus can feel pain. The Republican-controlled Legislature should not be allowed to decide scientific fact, he said.

"It would be reckless to inject a requirement that doctors communicate unproven science to their patients during an already difficult and sometimes traumatic time," Doyle wrote in his veto message. "This bill intrudes on the doctor-patient relationship ... and contravenes the requirement that doctors provide objective and accurate information to their patients."

When a fetus can feel pain is a matter of debate in the medical community. The bill's supporters say some research supports the theory that a fetus can feel pain at the 20th week of pregnancy. Opponents say none of those claims have been proven.

Bob Delaporte, a spokesman for Republican Assembly Speaker John Gard, accused Doyle of "ignoring the science on this one."

Three other states -- Arkansas, Georgia and Minnesota -- have similar notification requirements, and federal legislation is pending.

Women seeking abortions in Wisconsin already must be given information on alternatives to ending their pregnancies. They also must wait 24 hours after a counseling session to have the procedure performed.

Edit: linkage

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

So you are stating that anything that "COULD" be true should be conveyed as fact? And your disdain for "the abortion industry" shows your hypocrisy towards your constant drivle in other threads that free markets should rule and dictate what is allowed.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

Yes, because they are not providing a service that people seek out.

 

[Vadatajs]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!

Abortion INDUSTRY

 

[Tab]

As far as I know, only people feel pain. A fetus isn't a person.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

So you are stating that anything that "COULD" be true should be conveyed as fact? And your disdain for "the abortion industry" shows your hypocrisy towards your constant drivle in other threads that free markets should rule and dictate what is allowed.

The only one claiming anything about facts is the governor.

A free market assumes that one can live to see it, rather than succumb to a license to kill.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

So you are stating that anything that "COULD" be true should be conveyed as fact? And your disdain for "the abortion industry" shows your hypocrisy towards your constant drivle in other threads that free markets should rule and dictate what is allowed.

The only one claiming anything about facts is the governor.

A free market assumes that one can live to see it, rather than succumb to a license to kill.

A free market has nothing to do with life.

 

[Stunt]

In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: Stunt
In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

The being's present nature is parasitic, not the being itself. 🙂

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: Stunt
In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

Absolutely. In a free market you can take the measure to ensure no parasitic being exists.

 

[Stunt]

Don't get me wrong there is a rights issue when it comes to abortion.
Abortion is an immoral act, but when it comes down to it, I support the rights of women over the rights of a pre-human being.

Those who think abortion is no different than clicking edit->undo are idiots. But abortion has been the primary factor in reduced crime over the years and has allowed people control over their own lives.

The state needs to get out of our bedrooms and personal lives.

 

[Stunt]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: Stunt
In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

Absolutely. In a free market you can take the measure to ensure no parasitic being exists.

So you support active sex education in schools and access to birth control?
me too! :thumbsup:

 

[GroundedSailor]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Edit: linkage

Key word: could.

But we dont want to stand in the way of the abortion industry and big business.

Pigs COULD fly too, but lets not stand in the way of facts.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: Stunt
In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

Yup.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: Stunt

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: Stunt
In a free market, women have the right to decide whether they want a parasitic being living off them.

Absolutely. In a free market you can take the measure to ensure no parasitic being exists.

So you support active sex education in schools and access to birth control?
me too! :thumbsup:

I dont have any problem with people going to a store and buying birth control.

 

[ZeGermans]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong
IF it is proven beyond a doubt that a fetus can feel pain, then this might have some place in the Dr/Patient exchange. Until that time comes, I have to agree with the Govenor on this.

Source

Wisconsin governor vetoes abortion bill

Saturday, January 7, 2006; Posted: 10:42 a.m. EST (15:42 GMT)

MADISON, Wisconsin (AP) -- -- Gov. Jim Doyle on Friday vetoed a bill that would have forced doctors to tell women seeking abortions after their fifth month of pregnancy that their fetuses could suffer pain.

Doyle, a Democrat, said there is no evidence conclusively proving when a fetus can feel pain. The Republican-controlled Legislature should not be allowed to decide scientific fact, he said.

"It would be reckless to inject a requirement that doctors communicate unproven science to their patients during an already difficult and sometimes traumatic time," Doyle wrote in his veto message. "This bill intrudes on the doctor-patient relationship ... and contravenes the requirement that doctors provide objective and accurate information to their patients."

When a fetus can feel pain is a matter of debate in the medical community. The bill's supporters say some research supports the theory that a fetus can feel pain at the 20th week of pregnancy. Opponents say none of those claims have been proven.

Bob Delaporte, a spokesman for Republican Assembly Speaker John Gard, accused Doyle of "ignoring the science on this one."

Three other states -- Arkansas, Georgia and Minnesota -- have similar notification requirements, and federal legislation is pending.

Women seeking abortions in Wisconsin already must be given information on alternatives to ending their pregnancies. They also must wait 24 hours after a counseling session to have the procedure performed.

Edit: linkage

Before I read the article and just saw the opening comments, I figured this bill was forcing doctors NOT to tell the patient, and was vetoed because the science it's based on was shaky. Once I read the entire article, I saw the decision was the exact opposite, but still based on the same concept. Either way, I completely agree with the decision. That's like forcing voting booth workers to tell every person that if they vote for a democrat, they COULD all die in a terrorist attack.

 

[BlancoNino]

I dont have any problem with people going to a store and buying birth control.

Damn right. I can't believe how easy teenage girls are getting birth control at family planning centers...for FREE! Is that our tax dollars HARD AT WORK!? Believing in birth control and supporting government funded family planning centers are two completely different things.

 

[Meuge]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

I dont have any problem with people going to a store and buying birth control.

Damn right. I can't believe how easy teenage girls are getting birth control at family planning centers...for FREE! Is that our tax dollars HARD AT WORK!? Believing in birth control and supporting government funded family planning centers are two completely different things.

Sorry, but I'd rather my tax money went to buy their birth control, then for their accidental kid's welfare, medicaid, and prison.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: Meuge

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

I dont have any problem with people going to a store and buying birth control.

Damn right. I can't believe how easy teenage girls are getting birth control at family planning centers...for FREE! Is that our tax dollars HARD AT WORK!? Believing in birth control and supporting government funded family planning centers are two completely different things.

Sorry, but I'd rather my tax money went to buy their birth control, then for their accidental kid's welfare, medicaid, and prison.

Me too. Sometimes, when we pay for things collectively, it (A) Brings the cost down to virtually nil, and (B) Pulls us all upwards as a society. If free and easy access to family planning centers prevents millions of unwanted babies from growing up to be criminals, well then that's a pretty easy decision.

But back to this Republican-sponsored bill, it sure smacks of the same sort of ID crap we're seeing in the schools. You know, the little stickers mandated to be on every science book that says "Evolution is only a theory . . ."

Yeah, you know come to think of it, Republicans should just stay away from science completely. They seem a little too fond of making unprovable crap up and then trying to force the rest of us to nod along.

 

[Meuge]

If 10 million teenage girls are getting $50 worth of pills/month, it's costing each of us $20/month on average. You know, with the number of people shot and killed for $20 in the subways in NY, I think I'll give up one plate of all-you-can-eat sushi to get them these pills.

 

[DealMonkey]

Now, if big pharma can just make a pill that prevents Republicans from hating gay people, I'd gladly pay for their meds too. 😛

 

[Stunt]

Originally posted by: Meuge
Sorry, but I'd rather my tax money went to buy their birth control, then for their accidental kid's welfare, medicaid, and prison.

The biggest decline in crime rates occured ~20 years after abortion was legalized.

 

[Meuge]

Originally posted by: Stunt

Originally posted by: Meuge
Sorry, but I'd rather my tax money went to buy their birth control, then for their accidental kid's welfare, medicaid, and prison.

The biggest decline in crime rates occured ~20 years after abortion was legalized.

There is a book about that... but I don't know how much stock I put into it. It makes sense emprirically, but the fact is that the number of births didn't drop significantly after abortion was legalized, only the number of women dying from massive UTIs and peritonitis... I wonder why (not).

 

[Corn]

Originally posted by: Stunt

Originally posted by: Meuge
Sorry, but I'd rather my tax money went to buy their birth control, then for their accidental kid's welfare, medicaid, and prison.

The biggest decline in crime rates occured ~20 years after abortion was legalized.

I would bet that if we killed off all the poor that crime would also decrease. This doesn't seem to be a justifiable reason for murder though....speaking of which....

The law of the land allows for abortion. The law also allows me to have the opinion that anyone who has had, as well as performed, an abortion is a cold blooded murderer.