Wireless 802.11b vs Wireless 802.11g

Bonesdad

Platinum Member
Nov 18, 2002
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She is sharing a house with 2 other girls (who share one HP Pavilion PC). Wiring the house with Cat5 not an option (its a rental). They just got set up with cable internet (Bresnan) and want to share the connection. None of these girls are gamers...not sure about boyfriends, but who give a damn about them?

What I'd like to do is get a wireless router to put next to my daughter's PC (she also has the cable modem at her desk) and wire her to it with a cable (save $$ on the wireless NIC). Then get a wireless NIC for the sister's HP Pavilion. Sound OK?

My main question is: Should I get a 802.11b or 802.11g router/NIC? There is a printer with each computer, so they won't share printers/files very much (I want them to have the freedom to do so, but I doubt they will need to very often).

I can save a lot of $$ going with 802.11b, but not if it dogs their broadband connection. I am a complete n00b when it comes to wireless...it's my first setup. Will my daughter or her roomates notice a slow connection using .11b vs .11g?


I think those are all my questions at this point...thanks!
 

mehmetmunur

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Jul 28, 2004
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There are a few variables to consider. How far are they willing to travel from the source, and how fast is the broadband internet connection that you will be getting for them. I have road runner, and where I live it seems to be around 2.5-3 Mbits/second. This is one of the faster cable connections that I have heard of. Most of the time, your internet provider will cap you at a certain speed, which is what Time Warner has told me. Actually using a utility to measure how fast my internet is from time warner, I just reached 2930 Kbits/s and approx 357 KBs/s.

Therefore, if you were to live in the same area that I lived in, and had cable internet, you would NOT feel the difference between 802.11b and 802.11g while you are accessing the internet, given you are in the optimum transmit range of the router, while surfing online.

On the other hand, 2 computers connecting through a network and sharing files would be affected by the choice between 802.11b or g, due to to difference in speed.

Here is some technical information:

802.11b
802.11b has a range of about 50 metres with the low-gain omnidirectional antennas typically used in 802.11b devices. 802.11b has a maximum throughput of 11 Mbit/s, however a significant percentage of this bandwidth is used for communications overhead; in practice the maximum throughput is about 5.5 Mbit/s. Metal, water, and thick walls absorb 802.11b signals and decrease the range drastically. 802.11 runs in the 2.4 GHz spectrum and uses Carrier Sense Multiple Access with Collision Avoidance (CSMA/CA) as its media access method.

With high-gain external antennas, the protocol can also be used in fixed point-to-point arrangements, typically at ranges up to 8 kilometres (although some report success at ranges up to 80-120 km where line of sight can be established). This is usually done to replace costly leased lines, or in place of very cumbersome microwave communications gear. Current cards can operate at 11 Mbit/s, but will scale back to 5.5, then 2, then 1, if signal strength becomes an issue. 802.11b divides spectrum in 14 overlapping, staggered channels of 22 megahertz (MHz) each. Different channels or ranges are legal in different countries. Three or four channels may be used simultaneously in the same area with little or no overlap (in the U.S. spectrum, these channels are 1, 6, and 11).

Extensions have been made to the 802.11b protocol (eg, channel bonding and burst transmission techniques) in order to increase speed to 22, 33, and 44 Mbit/s, but the extensions are proprietary and have not been endorsed by the IEEE. Many companies call enhanced versions "802.11b+".

802.11g
In June 2003, a third standard for encoding was ratified: 802.11g. This flavor works in the 2.4 GHz band (like 802.11b) but operates at 54 Mbit/s raw, or about 24.7 Mbit/s net, throughput like 802.11a. It is fully backwards compatible with b, and details of making b and g work together well occupied much of the lingering technical process. However, the presence of an 802.11b participant reduces an 802.11g network to 802.11b speeds.

The 802.11g standard swept the consumer world of early adopters starting in January 2003, well before ratification. The corporate users held back and Cisco and other big equipment makers waited until ratification. By summer 2003, announcements were flourishing. Most of the dual-band 802.11a/b products became dual-band/tri-mode, supporting a, b, and g in a single card or access point.

A new feature called Super G is now integrated in certain access points. These can boost network speeds up to 108 Mbit/s by using channel bonding. This feature may interfere with other networks and may not support all b and g client cards. In addition, packet bursting techniques are also available in some chipsets and products which will also considerably increase speeds. Again, they may not be compatible with some equipment.

source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.11b
 

Bonesdad

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Nov 18, 2002
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Yep, read both of those sources...neither seems to answer the basic question I have, which is posed above. I understand what is written in the links, but the basic question is: will the difference be noticeable, i.e. will they hate the connection.


Physically, the two computers will be on the same floor, in rooms across a hall from each other. new construction house, no brick or steel or anything. I realize I will have to wait to see if the connection is good, but if it IS good, will there be a noticeable difference between g and b given the uses I have told above? I don't know the answer to the question about how fast the broadband connection is, but I will assume it is slower than the rated speed of either g or b.


EDIT: The download speed with Bresnan is 3Mbit/sec...so they shouldn't notice a diff between b and g, is my understanding...all things being perfect.
 

Swimmer12

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Jul 15, 2004
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here is my view... I have a 4 mb connection that I share on a 802.11b Dlink system.. DI-614+... It has the ability to run in turbo mode 22mbs... However, I have 2 desktops with the turbo cards in them and then one laptop with the Intel 2200B/G card in it... My laptop runs at 11mbs while my desktops run at 22mbs.. I have no problems with running out of bandwidth... Even when the rest of my family is surfing... I can listen to streaming music and still be fine.. However when I connect my 54g router up I do see a slight improvement in speed tests... like maybe 500K... But I am the only one on the 54 g standard... I have WPA on so that the other computer can not connect. If I were you I would see if you can get a recertified DI-614+ I have had no problems with it and this is the system that I started with.. Love it... Hope this is more of what you were looking for...
 

JackMDS

Elite Member
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Oct 25, 1999
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It is relatively easy to give info.

Making the conclusion for other one is almost impossible when you are not there.:shocked:

In my envioroment and my Internet connection there is No difference between 802.11b and 802.11g while surfing the Internet. In your envioroment if there is ?Noise? and obstructions it might result in attenuating the 802.11b or it might the same as mine. You never know unless you try.;:confused:

This phrase: ?i.e. will they hate the connection? is what it called nonsense phrase it might mean every thing to you, but it means nothing for every one else.:shocked:

Given the price differential between 802.11b and 802.11g there is no point to ?torment? your self get 802.11g. :thumbsup:

:sun:
 

Bonesdad

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Nov 18, 2002
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OK, thank, I know I'm being pretty subjective...but as I said, I'm a wireless n00b...

I note that Omax is offering the Dlink 54G for $29.98 after rebate...DL524 is model # ...anyone have experience with this unit? That offer expires tonight...

Tomorrow they start a deal where i can get the DL624 for $40 after rebate. ALso $40 for the NIC. Anyone use this unit?
 

Swimmer12

Member
Jul 15, 2004
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I have the 524... If you can get it cheap that is good... That is what I use for my 54g setup...
 

MtnMan

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Jul 27, 2004
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If your primary concern is in reference to their connect to the internet, no they won't notice the difference. Even 11b is many times faster than DSL or cable. Printing across 'b' vs. 'g' won't be that noticable either. The slow part here is the printer, not the network.

You might want to consider 'g' just to future proof things a bit.
 

JackMDS

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Oct 25, 1999
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Originally posted by: MtnMan
If your primary concern is in reference to their connect to the internet, no they won't notice the difference. Even 11b is many times faster than DSL or cable. Printing across 'b' vs. 'g' won't be that noticable either. The slow part here is the printer, not the network.

You might want to consider 'g' just to future proof things a bit.
My experience shows that when Wireless start to go bellow 2Mb/sec. it is not very dependable regardless of the activity. I.e. even if the DSL is only about 1Mb/sec. you need a solid 2Mb/sec. Wireless to have a smooth Internet interaction.

Many 802.11b work just a little above 2Mb/Sec. for one person with a Laptop it would be OK. However if two people use it at the same time you might get a "Quirky" (not stable) interaction.

:sun:
 

oldman420

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May 22, 2004
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you will notice a difference in large file transfers but other then that b an g are about the same 11mbs is a lot more than their broadband speed so the wont even notice the diff
 

JackMDS

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Originally posted by: oldman420
you will notice a difference in large file transfers but other then that b an g are about the same 11mbs is a lot more than their broadband speed so the wont even notice the diff
There is No functional 11Mb/sec.

11Mb/sec. is the Chipset is running 11Mb/sec. Functional Bandwidth of Entry Level 802.11b is 6-8Mb/sec. when it is in the same room.

2.4Ghz is the Microwave frequency the signal like to Giggle water molecules so every substance with water molecules in it swallow part of the signal, the penetration power of such a frequency is not great either, as a result the average 802.11b once out of the Wireless Router room decline fast. In most cases, using Entry Level sub 50mW transmitters, if it is not in the same room the yield is only 2-4Mb.sec. more then two people using it at the same time will bring it to its knees.

:sun:
 

MtnMan

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Jul 27, 2004
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I have a wireless b/g router. As I use my laptop in different parts of the house my speed varies from 1Mb :| to 56Mb :) Even at 1Mb I don't really notice any difference (my broadband is 3Mb cable) for general surfing or printing something to my printserver.

I do notice it when I attempt to use Remote Console or copy a large file.
 

VirtualLarry

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Aug 25, 2001
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Originally posted by: JackMDS
2.4Ghz is the Microwave frequency the signal like to Giggle water molecules so every substance with water molecules in it swallow part of the signal, the penetration power of such a frequency is not great either, as a result the average 802.11b once out of the Wireless Router room decline fast. In most cases, using Entry Level sub 50mW transmitters, if it is not in the same room the yield is only 2-4Mb.sec. more then two people using it at the same time will bring it to its knees.

That's interesting, and slightly concerns me. Will using these 802.11 wireless devices, either in the same room or close proximity to your person, cause any sort of long-term health effects? (Like a low-power microwave oven in the room, all the time?)

Secondary to that, will a microwave oven in the same room cause interference with an 802.11 wireless LAN?
I suppose once I get this new wireless rig up and running, I'll be able to test that possibility empirically.
 

LoudTIGER

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Jul 29, 2003
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if they caused appreciable health risks, the routers would come in metal boxes requiring you to close the lid before you turned them on
either b or g should be fine for your application.. they won't notice the difference. (unless they routinely copy large files to each other)
 

flexy

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
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there is no reason to save a few (not a lot) bucks forcing yourself to a plain 'b' setup. I had the same thoughts two weeks ago...but i got a linksys wireless G router, lappy has G card built in. Its backwards compatible to 'b', so you get both worlds :) There is no difference when each computer goes online, but there is a difference in a scenario when computer a wants to connect to computer b, transferrring files from one to another..because its just faster. Dont know...just felt better going with G instead the B :)