Wifi-friendly linux

[btsdev]

Hey guys,

I've been searching left and right online for a wireless PCI card that WILL work for linux (debian/ubuntu, if it matters) without hassle but I keep hearing "this card, only this revision, but you might not be able to tell the revision, blah blah" -- so I was wondering if anyone who has ventured into this realm can help me -- based upon your experiences.

I'm looking for cards that use either madwifi or prism54. I've heard prism54 isn't doing as well recently; is this true? Anyhow, I'm not afraid of doing some configuring -- I'm not expecting everything to work out-of-the-box all utopian-like. All I care about is having a card that WILL work so that I can get it working in the 3 weeks before I go back to school for my family.

If it matters, I am looking to purchase from newegg either tonight or tomorrow -- so hopefully if you guys can recommend a card, it's being sold as of recently and on major sites like newegg.com.

Well thanks in advance if you have any at all that you can impart to my cause.

-Brian

 

[nweaver]

I have had good luck with Atheros based cards. Cisco's PCI card is based on the Atheros chipset, and is Cisco CCX V3 certified.

 

[The Linuxator]

Atheros aironet 4500 should be fine as it shows up in my Fedora Core 4 wireless cards list. Don't know about Ubuntu though.

 

[xanis]

Yeah Atheros is probably a good bet. I learned the hard way that Linux doesn't like Texas Instruments chipsets.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Atheros is ass, they require a binary only HAL IIRC. Get something RALink based, they're free. I have 2 of these, and they work great in OpenBSD and Windows. No unfree driver, no bull, pure Taiwanese goodness.

 

[The Linuxator]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Atheros is ass, they require a binary only HAL IIRC. Get something RALink based, they're free. I have 2 of these, and they work great in OpenBSD and Windows. No unfree driver, no bull, pure Taiwanese goodness.

:laugh:

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: The Linuxator

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
Atheros is ass, they require a binary only HAL IIRC. Get something RALink based, they're free. I have 2 of these, and they work great in OpenBSD and Windows. No unfree driver, no bull, pure Taiwanese goodness.

:laugh:

It's true to a point. US companies are sticking to the old paradigm of keeping everything a secret, but taiwanese companies (RALinka nd Realtek I think) are opening up their hardware. Instead of releasing GPLed drivers without the proper documentation or just keeping quiet, they're relasing docs to developers in the hopes of gaining market share against the big boys (atheros, TI, broadcom, intel, etc.). It's working, the cards are great (I run RALink adapters in Windows, OpenBSD, and Mac OS X), and we owe them support. :beer:

 

[cmetz]

btsdev, prism54 used to be the best choice (what I have for Cardbus), but they have silently moved to a "softMAC" chip rev for lower costs that is not supported under Linux and pretty much like a 802.11g WinModem - ick. Atheros is okay, the HAL thing sucks, but the OpenBSD folks have a cloned HAL and so a truly free driver is possible. Broadcom *sucks*, stay away, no Linux support unless you count a $20 NDIS loader thingy. Which pretty much leaves RALink. I have a RAL PCI card that I haven't yet had a chance to try under Linux, but it's well supported under BSD. From what I read, the Linux driver is a little rocky to get going, and there are in fact several different Linux drivers with different features, but that will in time get sorted out.

If you run Linux or BSD, or just would like to have the freedom to choose to do so in the future, buy something like the RALink that will work under Linux/BSD. Don't buy Windows-only hardware and then complain that Linux doesn't support it.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: cmetz
btsdev, prism54 used to be the best choice (what I have for Cardbus), but they have silently moved to a "softMAC" chip rev for lower costs that is not supported under Linux and pretty much like a 802.11g WinModem - ick. Atheros is okay, the HAL thing sucks, but the OpenBSD folks have a cloned HAL and so a truly free driver is possible. Broadcom *sucks*, stay away, no Linux support unless you count a $20 NDIS loader thingy. Which pretty much leaves RALink. I have a RAL PCI card that I haven't yet had a chance to try under Linux, but it's well supported under BSD. From what I read, the Linux driver is a little rocky to get going, and there are in fact several different Linux drivers with different features, but that will in time get sorted out.

If you run Linux or BSD, or just would like to have the freedom to choose to do so in the future, buy something like the RALink that will work under Linux/BSD. Don't buy Windows-only hardware and then complain that Linux doesn't support it.

The madwifi guys (the ones doing the un-free atheros driver) are quite antagonistic towards the free HAL OpenBSD provides. I don't see them helping to get it up to speed or using it in the near future, but maybe someone will step up.

 

[deathwalker]

I found it easier not to mess with a wireless pci card...i used a standard well accepted NIC and connected it to a wireless bridge...thus making linux ignorent of the fact that a wireless device was attached.

 

[cmetz]

n0cmonkey, that's because they needed Atheros's help to get the driver built in the first place, and the binary HAL was the price they paid to get there. And now they're worried that the reverse engineered HAL will both piss off Atheros and make all manufacturers in the future unwilling to even go the binary HAL route seeing how easy it was from there to get a fully reverse engineered driver.

But in the meanwhile, it's only a matter of time before somebody figures out how to wire the free HAL into a madwifi derived driver.

And if you go with some other manufacturers you don't have to think about all this...

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: cmetz
n0cmonkey, that's because they needed Atheros's help to get the driver built in the first place, and the binary HAL was the price they paid to get there. And now they're worried that the reverse engineered HAL will both piss off Atheros and make all manufacturers in the future unwilling to even go the binary HAL route seeing how easy it was from there to get a fully reverse engineered driver.

But in the meanwhile, it's only a matter of time before somebody figures out how to wire the free HAL into a madwifi derived driver.

And if you go with some other manufacturers you don't have to think about all this...

As long as Taiwan isn't incorporated into the USA, we'll be ok.

EDIT: I understood why the madwifi people don't care about free software, I just think it's a shame.

 

[cmetz]

n0cmonkey, "I understood why the madwifi people don't care about free software, I just think it's a shame." is a very very incorrect statement! Sam Leffler is one of the UCB CSRG BSD guys, co-author of the Devil Book, and a contributor to FreeBSD. He has huge free software credibility. To say he "doesn't care about free software" is disparaging him very incorrectly.

He's also a pragmatist. And the choice he had was between a partially free driver and none at all. So I do not think he made an unreasonable choice.

Some folks like Theo hold out for 100% free. Good for them - we need some of them to remind the community about where the goals are. But there's also a lot of people who just want stuff to work, and good for them, too. We should not let either ideology OR pragmatism dominate.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: cmetz
n0cmonkey, "I understood why the madwifi people don't care about free software, I just think it's a shame." is a very very incorrect statement! Sam Leffler is one of the UCB CSRG BSD guys, co-author of the Devil Book, and a contributor to FreeBSD. He has huge free software credibility. To say he "doesn't care about free software" is disparaging him very incorrectly.

He's also a pragmatist. And the choice he had was between a partially free driver and none at all. So I do not think he made an unreasonable choice.

Some folks like Theo hold out for 100% free. Good for them - we need some of them to remind the community about where the goals are. But there's also a lot of people who just want stuff to work, and good for them, too. We should not let either ideology OR pragmatism dominate.

FreeBSD isn't too keen on Free software these days either.

To each their own. He's got a choice now, and continues to choose non-free. He's scared of the vendor instead of convincing the community that vendors should be scared of us. We could hold the power, but "pragmatists" that prefer non-free to free scare us back into our holes. I don't want non-free stuff in my favorite Free OS. That's just a bit messed up.

 

[cmetz]

n0cmonkey, how much kernel code have you contributed to a free OS?

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: cmetz
n0cmonkey, how much kernel code have you contributed to a free OS?

That has what to do with creating non-free drivers when a perfectly acceptable free base is available? What does that have to do with supporting the companies that don't want to play nice when there are nicer ones stepping up?

EDIT: I guess this is just one of those philosophical differences. I can be an idealist, when it suits me. I just wish they'd switch to the free HAL, help'em out, get it up to speed. I'll continue buying RALink stuff till then.

 

[Rainsford]

I've had really good luck with the Intel "Centrino" wireless stuff. Of course that's not exactly an add-on, but some companies like Dell do sell them aftermarket to replace an existing internal wireless card. Good overall support with those, I'm impressed.