Why we should not consider lowering the drinking age from 21 to 18. *Thanks everyone. Please let this thread drop*

[HombrePequeno]

I'm pretty sure it's legal for your parents to give you alcohol. At least that's what my step-dad says and he's a cop.

 

[j0lly]

<< but j0lly, say there was a household with 2 children, say age 15 and 10.

suppose the husband and wife / parents were intelligent folks, and had respectable careers such as the husband was a nurse and the wife was a volunteer firefighter who also spent time volunteering at a soup kitchen

suppose both have college degrees, yet really enjoy what they are doing because the like serving society.

suppose one day, the 15 year old asks the parents what the *big deal* about drinking is since he heard only bad things come from it, so the mom takes the bourbon out of the cabinet and lets the 15 year old try some. the 15 year old hates the taste, and vows to never drink again.

the 10 year old sees whats going on, learned in school that *underage drinking is illegal* and calls the police to say the parents were commiting a crime since that's what she learned to do in her public school, *call the police if you see something illegal*. Police come, ask the 15 year old what happens, he tells the truth, and the parents go go jail and kids get sent to a state controleld home. seem fair? >>



A very hypothetical scenario. If you show me a definate case I would say that the parent is probably at fault for pouring Jr. a drink. We are taught that harming innocent people is wrong and we (most of us) follow this cardinal rule without first having to injure somebody in order to learn that it is wrong. People who have been drinking for a while concur that alcohol is an acquired taste. Given this, the 15 yr. old will no like the taste.

 

[Joemonkey]

harming innocent people? that's insane... how is a parent satisfying a child's curiosity of alcohol harmful?

if you were a parent, wouldn't you rather be the one to introduce alcohol, dangers and all, to your child? or would you rather it be his "friend" who he's spending the night with while his parents are away, and they get into the liqour cabinet?


[edit]please don't take the "insane" comment to heart... was a gut reaction, will try to keep this conversation civil.... carry on[/edit]

 

[HardcoreRobot]

<< The drinking age was lowered to eighteen, and it didn't work then. What makes people think it would work now? The only people who want the drinking age lowered are teenagers.
5. In conclusion, I can't see any reason to lower the drinking age to eighteen. it has been done, and failed. Why should we let it fail again?
>>


How did they fail?



<< 1. The law DOES work . >>


Ask any single college student in the country if the laws work. This is pure nonsense.



<< 4. You are not the only one to take into consideration when you have a beer >>


Aboslutely, positively, WRONG. There is just no other way to put it. Granted, mixing alcohol with driving or other such activities warrants consideration - but that is applies to everyone and not just underage drinkers.



<< 1. It is the number one killer of our young people. Alcohol is involved in at least one-half of all the car crashes, suicides, drownings, falls, and homicides involving youth. It is involved in 100% of the alcohol poisoning deaths among young people. Alcohol is also involved in at least one-half of all the crime, violence, injuries, trauma, unplanned sex, rapes, absenteeism, poor school performance and lost potential among those under the age of 21. >>


These are interesting statistics. But I thought you said alcohol laws were WORKING???

 

[Dragnov]

If you are old enough to smoke and present a significant danger immediately to someone elses health, I don't see much problem with alcohol. Especially since the only danger factor with alocohol is if they get drunk. Drinking sparingly, under control doesn't hurt anyone and does far less damage than smoking. Alcohol doesn't have any addictive materials like cigarettes (nictonie) as there are only those that get addicted to it personally. And if you are old enough to take someones life in the military, I think little of alcohol consumption.

By lowering the age limit, it could be less of a "fad" thing. People that want to drink can always get their hands on alcohol someway or another. Some are quick to learn that its not all cracked up as its been told, and stop drinking all together. So the sooner they learn, the better isn't it?

The problem with alcohol isn't alcohol itself. It just that idiotic people drink for the sole purpose of getting DRUNK. Alochol is used in plenty of dishes, and the occasional wine is healthy (so I hear I on the news... I wouldn't know, never researched.)

Theres a few arguments for you. And before some idiot making presumptions wants to bash me for being stupid or something, I'm 19 and I don't drink alochol (never tried it in fact). I've taken a sip of wine/beer when I was younger (at a wedding) and I ate my fair share of food that probably contained alcohol (Italian dishes). These are just stuff that I observed and heard of.

 

[MrDingleDangle]

haha it doesnt really matter what the law is...everyone in my highschool was drinking by sophmore year, some held off till junior year...never a problem getting beer in NY cause every gas station, 7-11 anything sold beer...and enough people had crappy ID's that htye used...

now getting hard liquor, that was hard...i almost never had hard stuff till college...in NY beer and liquor arent in the same places and liquor stores are more hardcore about carding...older people would by it for us on occasion though

so i dont think it really even matters...cops never cared...if they came to a party u had to get rid of all the stuff but taht was it

The other countries do it is the worst arguement ever...especially now...well afghanistan housed terrorists...so we should to!

 

[j0lly]

<< The drinking age was lowered to eighteen, and it didn't work then. What makes people think it would work now? The only people who want the drinking age lowered are teenagers.
5. In conclusion, I can't see any reason to lower the drinking age to eighteen. it has been done, and failed. Why should we let it fail again?
>>




<< How did they fail? >>




"In the United States, after the drinking age was lowered to 18 in about half of the states in the 1970's, teenage road deaths increased markedly. That resulted in all states returning the legal drinking age to 21 by 1982.

The US Department of Transportation reported that following the raising of the drinking age the proportion of teenage drivers in fatal crashes who were intoxicated dropped by 36 per cent.

Link

I should probably cite a source here.


<< 1. The law DOES work . >>




<< Ask any single college student in the country if the laws work. This is pure nonsense. >>



Simply because something a law is not 100% effective does not mean we should abolish it. As long as there are rules, they will be broken. The point being that, with the law in place it makes it difficult for an underaged individual to obtain alcohol.


<< 4. You are not the only one to take into consideration when you have a beer >>




<< Aboslutely, positively, WRONG. There is just no other way to put it. Granted, mixing alcohol with driving or other such activities warrants consideration - but that is applies to everyone and not just underage drinkers. >>



Agreed. But doesn't the scenario of a driver who are relatively new behind the wheel AND under the influence a bit more frightening than someone who is a careless driver?


<< 1. It is the number one killer of our young people. Alcohol is involved in at least one-half of all the car crashes, suicides, drownings, falls, and homicides involving youth. It is involved in 100% of the alcohol poisoning deaths among young people. Alcohol is also involved in at least one-half of all the crime, violence, injuries, trauma, unplanned sex, rapes, absenteeism, poor school performance and lost potential among those under the age of 21. >>




<< These are interesting statistics. But I thought you said alcohol laws were WORKING??? >>



I should change change this statemement, not very effective.

Thanks for looking over my arguments.

<< By lowering the age limit, it could be less of a "fad" thing. People that want to drink can always get their hands on alcohol someway or another. Some are quick to learn that its not all cracked up as its been told, and stop drinking all together. So the sooner they learn, the better isn't it? >>

Rules are always broken. See Akumabao's post.

<<The problem with alcohol isn't alcohol itself. It just that idiotic people drink for the sole purpose of getting DRUNK. Alochol is used in plenty of dishes, and the occasional wine is healthy (so I hear I on the news... I wouldn't know, never researched.) >>

Hence the age limit. It is usually people who do not have easy access to alcohol that want to get DRUNK. The occassional wine is healthy but again, how many young people do you know who drink the occassional wine simply to stay healthy?

 

[HardcoreRobot]

<< Agreed. But doesn't the scenario of a driver who are relatively new behind the wheel AND under the influence a bit more frightening than someone who is a careless driver? >>


Most definitely. Even though I advocate the abolishment of drinking (and smoking, and drug) laws, I think our driving laws are what need to be more restrictive. As you have pointed out, driving requires much responsibilty. A person of any age can drink and endanger NO ONE. On the other hand, any time anyone gets behind the wheel - intoxicated or otherwise, he or she has the lives of many many in their hands.



<< Simply because something a law is not 100% effective does not mean we should abolish it. As long as there are rules, they will be broken. The point being that, with the law in place it makes it difficult for an underaged individual to obtain alcohol. >>


I would venture to say the law is nowhere near 100% effective. I might go so far to say it is 0% effective, and only succeeds in hampering the acquiring of alcohol. In high school, it was a bit difficult to get alcohol, but with a little effort I could get anything. In college, the laws are basically nonexistent. EVERYONE knows someone (or knows someone that knows someone etc.) that is of legal age. And if that is a little to complicated, fake ids negate any influence of the laws whatsoever.

I am not certain, but if I recall correctly, the states raised the drinking age back to 21 because the federal government threatened to cut funding. Now whether this is related to the statistics you mentioned is beyond me. I should hope that there is some sort of logic behind lawmaking, but as history has shown (and continues to), laws are not always made for the right reasons.



<< 1. It is the number one killer of our young people. Alcohol is involved in at least one-half of all the car crashes, suicides, drownings, falls, and homicides involving youth. It is involved in 100% of the alcohol poisoning deaths among young people. Alcohol is also involved in at least one-half of all the crime, violence, injuries, trauma, unplanned sex, rapes, absenteeism, poor school performance and lost potential among those under the age of 21. >>


Think about this. Arent the same kind of kids that would contemplate suicide/homicide/criminal activity the same ones that would abuse alcohol? There is a connection, but the fallacy here is the assumption that just because they are related, alcohol is the cause.



<< H. Lowering the drinking age will cause low scores in school
I. Alcohol is a drug , drugs lead to potential drug abuse in a person The younger a person begisn using alcohol, the greater change of developing alcohol dependence or abuse some time in their life. >>


Really, this is sensationalized bs. Ive been drinking/doing drugs since I was a sophomore in high school. I graduated in the top 5% of my class. Drinking had no effect at all on my scholastic performance. Does this mean that drinking is harmless? Of course not, but it is a testament to the fact that if substances are used responsibly and maturely they will NOT turn you into a junkie, make you become an alcoholic, cause you to fail out of school, etc.

 

[skace]

Everyone who has responded has said things such as: kids are too irresponsible at 18, they can't handle drinking, new to driving, etc, etc. These are all silly arguments. How can someone be responsible enough to FIGHT IN A WAR but not responsible enough to drink. That doesn't even make sense. And new to driving doesn't make sense either. When you are under the influence, you are under the influence, no matter the age. Only a dumb adult would think that since they have been driving longer they can handle drinking and driving. NO ONE can handle drinking and driving so why group them together?

An 18 year old drinking age is great because kids that actually follow the law get the chance to be introduced to it before college (since it is a major reason many college kids ruin their lives) in a controlled enviroment. Ask any kid that waited until college to start drinking / socializing. Their biggest regret is usually not drinking earlier and not knowing their own tolerance level by college. Girls who don't know their tolerance level are especially in danger in college due to all the people who would take advantage of them drunk in a heartbeat. But personally, I don't think this solves the entire problem because there is still the shock of gaining this privelage at 18. Which means kids will still want to abuse it before 18 and once they hit 18 they will go overboard which causes the statistical changes.

The only true solution to alcohol is to introduce it at an early age. Remove the law and practice safe and responsible drinking. Their will ALWAYS be people to abuse the privelage but you lessen the urge to do so without an actual law. We don't outlaw sex, we teach kids how to be responsible about it. How come we outlaw drinking and then we are suprised when there are so many accidents.

 

[Looney]

Canada has a 19 age limit on drinking, and it works just fine up here.

 

[jjones]

<< Just do it like in Europe where you grow up around alcohol, so it's not a big deal to drink and therefore, most people drink responsibly. >>


i'm in agreement with this. the drinking age used to be 18, then changed to 19 to keep it out of the high schools. i have no idea why it changed to 21. i don't think there should be any age restriction. it's just another excuse used to avoid parenting or compensate for those who are not responsible parents.