Why Vista?

Page 3 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: LintMan
My copy of Vista should be arriving today, along with the rest of new new system components. If I wasn't putting together a new system, though, I probably wouldn't be quite so quick to switch.


Pros: 4GB RAM support, increased security features, DX10, improved UI/look

Cons: All that DRM stuff they've added bogs things down and takes control away from the PC owner. I'd rather not be able to play that stuff at all than have it bog down and complicate even the non-DRM stuff.

You can use 4 Gig on Windows XP. XP also has DRM support that bogs it down with media files.

Seriously, 99% of these responses have no basis outside of emotion. Back up your responses people! You cannot honestly think people will believe that Vista has NO PRO'S over XP.

-Kevin

Vista IS *fluff* over *substance*

they could have done the *exact same thing* with XP's search ... and *security* is no advantage with Vista [yet].


FUTURE dx10 gaming . . . is not a +plus+ ... yet

it's a pretty interface loaded with DRM infection :p

i'm giving it some time before i pay to be a beta tester for MS and when the *real forum people* that i *trust* - not MS viral *seeds* giving a knee-jerk thumbsup - on these forum report it is *mature* and relativly *fixed*, i will buy it ...

until then there is NO advantage whatsoever for me to migrate to Vista ... now ...
nada ... zero ... zip

fin

And where is your proof of this. From everything I have heard, Vista is much more refined underneath. Much better memory management and scheduling. New interface yes, but what has changed underneath is supposed to be extreme.

As for NT 8.0. IIRC wasn't, Vista coded from the ground up. Isn't it not built at all off of the NT shell.... I don't know for sure, but for some reason it sticks in my mind.

-Kevin
 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: LintMan
My copy of Vista should be arriving today, along with the rest of new new system components. If I wasn't putting together a new system, though, I probably wouldn't be quite so quick to switch.


Pros: 4GB RAM support, increased security features, DX10, improved UI/look

Cons: All that DRM stuff they've added bogs things down and takes control away from the PC owner. I'd rather not be able to play that stuff at all than have it bog down and complicate even the non-DRM stuff.

You can use 4 Gig on Windows XP. XP also has DRM support that bogs it down with media files.

Seriously, 99% of these responses have no basis outside of emotion. Back up your responses people! You cannot honestly think people will believe that Vista has NO PRO'S over XP.

-Kevin

Vista IS *fluff* over *substance*

they could have done the *exact same thing* with XP's search ... and *security* is no advantage with Vista [yet].


FUTURE dx10 gaming . . . is not a +plus+ ... yet

it's a pretty interface loaded with DRM infection :p

i'm giving it some time before i pay to be a beta tester for MS and when the *real forum people* that i *trust* - not MS viral *seeds* giving a knee-jerk thumbsup - on these forum report it is *mature* and relativly *fixed*, i will buy it ...

until then there is NO advantage whatsoever for me to migrate to Vista ... now ...
nada ... zero ... zip

fin

And where is your proof of this. From everything I have heard, Vista is much more refined underneath. Much better memory management and scheduling. New interface yes, but what has changed underneath is supposed to be extreme.

As for NT 8.0. IIRC wasn't, Vista coded from the ground up. Isn't it not built at all off of the NT shell.... I don't know for sure, but for some reason it sticks in my mind.

-Kevin

WinFS, the revolutionary new file system that was supposed to power Windows to a new level of file and OS level managment, was abandoned a year ago.

It is still an NTFS kernel.
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
i don't need to post *proof* ... you don't post any when you give *your opinion* :p

Vista IS *fluff* over *substance*

Is not your opinion -_-

-Kevin

no?

well, then whose is it?
:confused:

It's no ones opinion. You seriously cannot be asking this question.

They have a (1) new scheduler, (2) native 64bit support, (3) better memory management.....

As far as fluff we have (1) Aero Interface (2) Revised Clock and Start Menu

So just out of the examples I gave you are claiming that 2>3??

They changed way more things in the Kernel and what not than just adding a new interface. Sorry thats not opinion thats fact. Only out of the examples I gave 3>2.

-Kevin
 

Conky

Lifer
May 9, 2001
10,709
0
0
Microsoft is high if they think I am gonna pay them for additional DRM and them having more control over my computer's content.

I see they want to incorporate the X-Box Live system into Vista gaming too. I haven't seen details but something tells me that Microsoft is not going to do this for free and is no doubt hoping to make gamers cough up $50 a year(or maybe only $5 a month :p) for them to provide this "service".

I'm not seeing any pro's for the consumer right now outside of a fancier interface and this is not worth $400. I do see several con's. I've never been a Microsoft basher but this new Vista O/S leaves a lot to be desired from where I'm sitting.
 

JackBurton

Lifer
Jul 18, 2000
15,993
14
81
Originally posted by: tuteja1986
I bought Windows Vista Ultimate 64bit oem for $253.00AUD (195USD) and i don't regert my buy. I do however wish that i had option to install windows vista ultimate 32bit.

You could have, if you bought the retail version of Vista Ultimate. ;)
 
Oct 4, 2004
10,515
6
81
I'll be getting Vista whenever I build a new rig - probably at the start of 2H 2007. It has less to do with functionality (not that Vista doesn't offer some increased functionality) but more with, "I have been using XP since Winter 2001 and I could use a change". Sounds kinda noobish but that's the way it is.

The DRM aspect doesn't bother me at all because I don't plan on watching any Blu-Ray/HD-DVD media on my computer.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
that is your opinion

i gave mine already

3>2 is not my opinion smart ass. -_-

-Kevin

i don't think you get it

you ARE giving your *opinion* ... it is only "fact" in your own mind

and i gave my *opinion* about Vista and stand by it

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods :p

 

CaiNaM

Diamond Member
Oct 26, 2000
3,718
0
0
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
Originally posted by: CaiNaM
i've been around computers since the ti99, and used windows since the first release. this is the very FIRST time I haven't been running the latest version of windows by release... not sure if/when i'll take the plunge. not likely until dx10 games make it mandatory.

another first for me today - i tend to agree with Gstanfor that vista may actually hurt microsoft's OS monopoly (at least current version). it will likely be the slowest widespread adoption for an MS operating system in history - there will be many still running w2k/xp for some time.

the only reprieve for MS is that linux isn't viable as an entertainment platform (this from me who has over a dozen servers running some flavor of 'nix), and outside the coporate world there aren't many pc's which aren't used for gaming.

well, it's nice to see that, for the most part, i still don't agree with you :p

The way I see it, you can always dual boot into you existing copy of XP when you want to game (and we gaming enthusuiasts need to make it abundantly clear to the industry that we don't think abandoning Xp "just because" is an acceptable move, just as we need to impress upon Micro$oft that no DX10 for XP is unacceptable).

"rebooting" simply to game is not what i would consider "user friendly". not only is that cumbersome, but i actually do many tasks in the background while i'm gaming.

Having said that, there is a very significant proportion of home-pc's that do not get used for gaming (the owners tend to be older or have young families with consoles) and mainly use their computer for internet/photography/music/video.

based on what? your wish? from "hello kitty" to "world of warcraft", you'll find some type of game on the majority of pc's.

the latest data i know of from 2001 showed almost 70% of ppl used the pc's to play games. some more recent facts:

1. US computer and video game software sales grew six percent in 2006 to $7.4 billion ? almost tripling industry software sales since 1996.

2. Sixty-nine percent of American heads of households play computer and video games.

3. The average game player is 33 years old and has been playing games for 12 years.

4. The average age of the most frequent game buyer is 40 years old. In 2006, 93 percent of computer game buyers and 83 percent of console game buyers were over the age of 18.


5. Eighty-five percent of all games sold in 2005 were rated "E" for Everyone, "T" for Teen, or "E10+" for Everyone 10+. For more information on ratings, please see www.esrb.org.


6. Eighty-seven percent of game players under the age of 18 report that they get their parents? permission when renting or buying games, and 89 percent say their parents are present when they buy games.

7. Thirty-five percent of American parents say they play computer and video games. Further, 80 percent of gamer parents say they play video games with their kids. Sixty-six percent feel that playing games has brought their families closer together.


8. Thirty-eight percent of all game players are women. In fact, women over the age of 18 represent a significantly greater portion of the game-playing population (30%) than boys age 17 or younger (23%).


9. In 2005, 25 percent of Americans over the age of 50 played video games, an increase from nine percent in 1999.

10. Forty-four percent of game players say they play games online one or more hours per week. In addition, 32 percent of heads of households play games on a wireless device, such as a cell phone or PDA, up from 20 percent in 2002.

Linux, especially flavours such as PCLinuxOS will do everything they require and more, all without costing a cent or ripping up your rights.

i love linux, and am a big advocate of it. it helps support my family. it's more efficient, uses less overhead, and is, in general more secure (especially if you know what you're doing; most however do not).

the truth, however is that (while installation has become much better), most people are curious, but intimidated by it. when they buy their computer at bestbuy, it has windows installed, not linux. linux is a niche, and is nowhere near mainstream. that's why 90% of the world runs windows.
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
that is your opinion

i gave mine already

3>2 is not my opinion smart ass. -_-

-Kevin

i don't think you get it

you ARE giving your *opinion* ... it is only "fact" in your own mind

and i gave my *opinion* about Vista and stand by it

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods :p

I'm not giving my opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LISTEN TO ME.

There are more improvements to the shell and features than there are to the interface.

I don't know how many different ways I can spell it out for you. Ill try one more, READ!!

(Note these are arbitrary numbers)
If there were 4 changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management and 2 made to the interface, or fluff if you will. That means there are more changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management than to the "fluff"

4>3..... IT IS NOT MY OPINION!!!! 4, anyway you cut it, is greater than 3!!

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods

I would hardly call "smart ass" a flame -_-. Here let me correct myself. You are not a smart ass...you are thickheaded and stubborn. Not flaming apoppin, those are facts!

-Kevin
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
that is your opinion

i gave mine already

3>2 is not my opinion smart ass. -_-

-Kevin

i don't think you get it

you ARE giving your *opinion* ... it is only "fact" in your own mind

and i gave my *opinion* about Vista and stand by it

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods :p

I'm not giving my opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LISTEN TO ME.

There are more improvements to the shell and features than there are to the interface.

I don't know how many different ways I can spell it out for you. Ill try one more, READ!!

(Note these are arbitrary numbers)
If there were 4 changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management and 2 made to the interface, or fluff if you will. That means there are more changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management than to the "fluff"

4>3..... IT IS NOT MY OPINION!!!! 4, anyway you cut it, is greater than 3!!

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods

Aw are your feelings hurt? I would hardly call "smart ass" a flame -_-. Here let me correct myself. You are not a smart ass...you are thickheaded and stubborn. Not flaming apoppin, those are facts!

-Kevin
no, not at all

certainly calling someone a *smartass* IS a 'flame' in that it invites *retaliation* and perhaps even *escalation* ... you certainly started it and it is VERY *disrespectful* of me and my opinion.

well then to be completely fair,

... let me point out - in a very friendly manner of course - that you are a Hypocrite of the Highest Order. Not Flaming, GH, those are facts!

-Mark

and again ... thanks for you *opinion* ... AGAIN...

i heard you the first of 4 or 5 times you posted the *same thing* and SHOUTING IT IN CAPS - still - doesn't make it anything BUT your opinion
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Originally posted by: apoppin
that is your opinion

i gave mine already

3>2 is not my opinion smart ass. -_-

-Kevin

i don't think you get it

you ARE giving your *opinion* ... it is only "fact" in your own mind

and i gave my *opinion* about Vista and stand by it

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods :p

I'm not giving my opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LISTEN TO ME.

There are more improvements to the shell and features than there are to the interface.

I don't know how many different ways I can spell it out for you. Ill try one more, READ!!

(Note these are arbitrary numbers)
If there were 4 changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management and 2 made to the interface, or fluff if you will. That means there are more changes made to the OS Shell and Memory Management than to the "fluff"

4>3..... IT IS NOT MY OPINION!!!! 4, anyway you cut it, is greater than 3!!

and please *you who want video to be moderated* stop flaming me as a "smart ass" or i just may PM the mods

Aw are your feelings hurt? I would hardly call "smart ass" a flame -_-. Here let me correct myself. You are not a smart ass...you are thickheaded and stubborn. Not flaming apoppin, those are facts!

-Kevin
no, not at all

certainly calling someone a *smartass* IS a 'flame' in that it invites *retaliation* and perhaps even *escalation* ... you certainly started it and it is VERY *disrespectful* of me and my opinion.

well then to be completely fair,

... let me point out - in a very friendly manner of course - that you are a Hypocrite of the Highest Order. Not Flaming, GH, those are facts!

-Mark

and again ... thanks for you *opinion* ... AGAIN...

i heard you the first of 4 or 5 times you posted the *same thing* and SHOUTING IT IN CAPS - still - doesn't make it anything BUT your opinion

Ok please answer me how 3>2 is my opinion. How is 4>3 my opinion. How is 5 changes to the OS Shell, and 2 to the Interface my opinion???

Do you want me to define the word opinion?? Nothing about this is my opinion. If I said I think Aero is fluff, then that is my opinion.

-Kevin

Edit: I'm not a hypocrite. If you push someone so far one too many times sooner or later they crack! I honestly don't know how I can get through to you. (And who the hell is GH)

Seriously, I am open to your opinions Apoppin. I have tried being nice and reasoning with you in the past. Yet you are so damn narrow minded. You won't accept any answer but your own. Like I said, if you continue to push someone far enough, sooner or later they are going to crack.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
i said Vista is *fluff* more than real *substance*

that IS my opinion

look ... hypocrite ... you START by calling me a *Smart Ass* and then say *i* am pushing you

i see it is OK for you to do it but not for anyone else to do it to you

that is the definition of 'hypocrite'

and you are not open to any opinion but your own - that IS what you accuse me of

nothing about you is *nice* unless you are being agreed with
 

Gamingphreek

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
11,679
0
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
i said Vista is *fluff* more than *real substance*

that IS my opinion

look ... hypocrite ... you START by calling me a *Smart Ass* and then say *i* am pushing you

i see it is OK for you to do it but not for anyone else to do it to you

that is the definition of 'hypocrite'

and you are not open to any opinion but your own - that IS what you accuse me of

Opinion is something that you believe.

It has been proven that there are more changes to the OS Shell and subsystem in Vista than to the Interface. Therefore it proves that the "*real substance*" (ie: ANYTHING BUT FLUFF) has had more changes than the "fluff".

Apoppin, I am open to opinions. But what you are arguing isn't an opinion| You are arguing cold hard facts. You are arguing that which I just stated above here. I can't make it any more plain for you- I'm sorry.

Ok for me to do what? I called you a smart ass. Here sorry I called you a smart ass, I was worked up because you are and continue to be thickheaded, and narrow-minded. Thickheaded and narrow-minded are not flames....if you take it that way I apologize, but there is no other way to describe your actions.

-Kevin

Edit: I disagree with plenty of people. Go look at my posts in P&N. I never lose it there at all. Despite differing political views, they can counter my suggestion with reasonable counter-arguments. You cannot make a counter argument, and refuse to accept that you can be wrong sometimes.

You want proof, look at the last 5 posts I have made. I admitted I was wrong about the 4 Gig allocation of memory in XP 32bit in 3 different threads and apologized.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
again *proven* in your mind and in the other sheep that buy into the MS bull

clearly ANYONE that disagrees with you doesn't belong in *your* thread.

if you M.O. is continued, i expect you to go whining to the Mods that your Thread is *ruined* and *please lock it* because people don't Agree with you and are ALSO posting their opinion that is different from yours

YOU said "IF i say Aero is Fluff", that IS my opinion"

i just *expanded* it to include Vista ... Vista is Fluff ... my opinion
Vista is no real "leap" over XP
there is NO advantage for ME to buy it ... now
there are no dx10 games

ALL *my opinion*

i don't think you have ANY actual *experience* with Vista - beside reading MS HYPE.

i played with it and UNinstalled it ... it is FLUFF
[still my opinion ... *my experience*]

and no real *substance* ... no huge improvement over XP or 2K
[as we were LEAD to believe by the hype]

Before you go running to the mods ... don't bother ... i will DROP OUT of this thread and let you go on promoting your fantasy as FACT

but please recognize that you are just as hard headed and narrow minded as *anyone* here posting regularly in video


aloha,

Mark
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Dude I still use Windows 2000 and it plays every game and runs every program I've tried. It's just simple and I'm used to it so i see no reason to upgrade until Mr. Gates forces the issue by making DX10 a Vista only option, then I'll upgrade so long as I can make it look like 2000 and the learning curve is'nt steep like Linux.
 

ronnn

Diamond Member
May 22, 2003
3,918
0
71
I think he quit running to the mods? Anyways I will buy vista when I have to. This is mainly based on the outrageous price of ultimate. Besides I am not sure that I can find drivers for my huge amount of legacy equipment. At this time, I feel that microsoft has not really changed much, but wants to charge mucho. Possibly dx10 games will change this, but would still be suspicious that dx10 would run on xp with less effort than it took to make this silly new os. This could be the beginning of the end of the great monopoly.
 

Wreckage

Banned
Jul 1, 2005
5,529
0
0
I've got a free upgrade coming with my copy of MCE. I will upgrade when I feel like it. Probably when I get a DX10 card and a Quad Core CPU.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
i said Vista is *fluff* more than real *substance*

LOL Like XP wasnt. After an hour and a half maybe you could get it to look like 2000 and use the same ram (I use 54MB on Boot) then you still could'nt get those silly assed yellow balloons to stop from popping as in "Click here to begin" when mousing over the start button.

All you complaining about fluff and using teletubbies XP will be Vista users before summer guaranteed.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
1
0
alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Zebo
i said Vista is *fluff* more than real *substance*

LOL Like XP wasnt. After an hour and a half maybe you could get it to look like 2000 and use the same ram (I use 54MB on Boot) then you still could'nt get those silly assed yellow balloons to stop from popping as in "Click here to begin" when mousing over the start button.

All you complaining about fluff and using teletubbies XP will be Vista users before summer guaranteed.

i just realized this wasn't GP's thread. :eek:
:Q

:D

i didn't also say XP wasn't *fluff* over 2K ... i also run Win2K and i have a UNactivated Retail copy of XP that i never use [although i troubleshoot all my friends' XP rigs] ...
it will be useful when i finally *upgrade* to Vista

just like you will
:Q

when your DX9c games start to look *stale* in your eyes. :p

i was expecting *much more* from Vista as i had been following MS hype since they first started talking about it