Why the M45 and Q45 are big failures?

[AMDJunkie]

I can see the parellels between Nintendo's and Infiniti's marketing programs... other than they're both Japanese of course.

 

[geno]

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

Explain Audi's success then. Plainest cars ever.

 

[PoPPeR]

Originally posted by: geno

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

Explain Audi's success then. Plainest cars ever.

i like audi's... they don't look plain to me. Classy, stylish, simple

 

[psteng19]

Originally posted by: gregshin
I actually saw my First M45 yesterday....i lliked it actually....it looks awesome when the car is in motion

Originally posted by: JellomancerI like the M45. Looks like a big 240sx. I can see why people wouldn't like it though.. it is a bit bland.

LOL, both statements from 240sx owners.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: PoPPeR

Originally posted by: geno

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

Explain Audi's success then. Plainest cars ever.

i like audi's... they don't look plain to me. Classy, stylish, simple

Exactly. Form takes top priority, rather than styling cues and other factors that create easily dated cars. The M45 is similarly tasteful, but people buy those ugly Lexuses and Celicas by the droves.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Same Roofline and basic form as M45

 

[Ryan]

I think it all has to do with Marketing. There are just simply not enough people who know that Infiniti offers the Q45 and M45. When compaired to a 45k Lincoln or Caddy, the M45 simply blows the socks off the other two standard features and amount of luxury, not to mention Infinitis are more reliable. I have seen their ads targeting people in their 30's, but if they really want to hit the jackpot, they need to move their advertising to an older audience. But, I also think they might hesitate to do that, though, because I think that infiniti wants to steer clear of the "yuppie" image.

I actually like the M45s design, along with the Qs

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

I totally disagree. The Q45 is MUCH more interesting stylistically than the uber-bland LS400 and LS430. IMO the Infiniti marque has never really taken hold in the US, partially because they lack a bit of the amazing attention to detail and perfect finish of Lexus, and so their sales have suffered. I imagine the G35 will sell well, in any event.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

I think its marketing. Only now Infiniti is getting better at marketing their cars, actually no their not. I haven't seen any tv ads for any Infiniti cars!!

The original Q45 was an awesome car, and in my book, rates higher than the Lexus LS400 (also new at the time). Unfortuantely the monkeys at Infiniti marketting decided to make a ad about trees and wind without focusing on the car itself.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN
I think its marketing. Only now Infiniti is getting better at marketing their cars, actually no their not. I haven't seen any tv ads for any Infiniti cars!!

The original Q45 was an awesome car, and in my book, rates higher than the Lexus LS400 (also new at the time). Unfortuantely the monkeys at Infiniti marketting decided to make a ad about trees and wind without focusing on the car itself.

Heh I've only seen ONE Q45 IN MY LIFE that I can remember, and ONE M45... both in Austin, none in Houston.

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN I think its marketing. Only now Infiniti is getting better at marketing their cars, actually no their not. I haven't seen any tv ads for any Infiniti cars!! The original Q45 was an awesome car, and in my book, rates higher than the Lexus LS400 (also new at the time). Unfortuantely the monkeys at Infiniti marketting decided to make a ad about trees and wind without focusing on the car itself.

Heh I've only seen ONE Q45 IN MY LIFE that I can remember, and ONE M45... both in Austin, none in Houston.

I think I've seen 3 Q45s here in dumpy old Panama City

 

[Ryan]

TTT

 

[Ryan]

bumpage

 

[bolido2000]

It's definitely a marketing problem. Moreover, older folks tend to like Cadillac and Lincoln better probably because they were the equivalent of Bimmers and Porsche in terms of desirability when they were young.

 

[LittleWolf]

Originally posted by: woodie1[/i]
The M45 is a slug IMHO.
Have you drivent it?
It is a really great car. Plus you get used to the look.
It is sportier than the q45, and cheaper.

Sure it is *slightly* sportier than a Q45. But then it is running on such an old Nissan Cedric chassis. Totally unbalanced car... more like a American Mercury Marauder with better lux trim. Does it even come close to other genuine sporty cars in class aka BMW 5, Audi 6 etc. Nope not even close. So there you have the answer...:frown:

I think I would take it over a lexus anyday, considering price, performance and looks.
I think Lexus LS430 should come out as more of a boring car.

Actually the Lexus closest in comparision to the 45 is the GS series and while they are dated, they still kick some serious butt especially the V8 versions. The LS is more a wafter.. not a sporty sedan.

 

[LittleWolf]

Originally posted by: PoPPeR

Originally posted by: geno

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

Explain Audi's success then. Plainest cars ever.

i like audi's... they don't look plain to me. Classy, stylish, simple

Quite right. Unlike other manuf. Audi believes in classic minimalist cues. But they look fresh forever unlike the Jap. or korean manufs. who change designs almost every year...:disgust: and look dated so soon.

 

[GTaudiophile]

For the longest time, Audi was the only luxury company to offer something like Quattro. As more companies like Mercedes adopt their own AWD system (4Matic), that will become less and less a selling point for Audi. So, time will tell how they fair.

Infiniti just doesn't conjure up much, positive or negative. It's an issue of branding. When people think performance, they think BMW. When people think of quality, they think Lexus. When people think of rock-solid feel and luxury heritage, they think of Mercedes. Infiniti just hasn't really found a niche yet. The G35/FM platform may be well and good, but it will be a flash in the pan. 3-series sales were up 12% for Janiary 03. BMW sales (including MINI) were up 24% for January 03.

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: Jellomancer
Same Roofline and basic form as M45

LMAO... they stole the design from the Chevy Cavalier!!

 

[KokomoGST]

I have to agree that it's mostly marketing... they need to bump up the image of Infiniti overall as a Toyota has had tremendous success in marketing Lexus as an uberbrand. Lots of people think their RX300s, SC430s, and ES300s are high class luxury cars... when in actuality, they're just nicely trimmed Toyotas

The Q45 is definitely superior in terms of driving experience to the LS430... most of the media gave the Q a thumbs up on that aspect. But since when did Infiniti ever have a clearly definable image that the sheep of America could identify? They see a Lexus with a "Coach" leather interior and they go..."OOOooooo, Ahhhhhh"

I know more than a few friends of mine that got kinda upset when I told them that they're just Toyotas... I even showed them pics of the cars from Japan... same exact car with a big nice unabashed Toyota branding on there. Mebbe Infiniti should consolidate back within Nissan and sell there? Take that classy performance image and milk it. Mazda's doing that successfully for younger buyers... I think the G35 would definitely benefit from such a move.

 

[mAdD INDIAN]

Originally posted by: KokomoGST
I have to agree that it's mostly marketing... they need to bump up the image of Infiniti overall as a Toyota has had tremendous success in marketing Lexus as an uberbrand. Lots of people think their RX300s, SC430s, and ES300s are high class luxury cars... when in actuality, they're just nicely trimmed Toyotas

The Q45 is definitely superior in terms of driving experience to the LS430... most of the media gave the Q a thumbs up on that aspect. But since when did Infiniti ever have a clearly definable image that the sheep of America could identify? They see a Lexus with a "Coach" leather interior and they go..."OOOooooo, Ahhhhhh"

I know more than a few friends of mine that got kinda upset when I told them that they're just Toyotas... I even showed them pics of the cars from Japan... same exact car with a big nice unabashed Toyota branding on there. Mebbe Infiniti should consolidate back within Nissan and sell there? Take that classy performance image and milk it. Mazda's doing that successfully for younger buyers... I think the G35 would definitely benefit from such a move.

Well Infiniti cars are sold in Japan as Nissans. The Q45 is the Nissan Cima, the M45 is the Gloria, etc...

What they should bring over is the Nissan President! Now that's luxury!

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: MadRat

Originally posted by: Jellomancer
Same Roofline and basic form as M45

LMAO... they stole the design from the Chevy Cavalier!!

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: Mani
THe M45 is an ugly car marketed to a middle-to-older aged crowd, and really only has performance to set it apart from its competition - that alone isn't enough. They tried to advertise it as some sort of modern musclecar, but that just doesn't work for a Japanese Luxury automobile.

The Q45 doesn't really have much charisma either, and for the price people would rather own a Lexus, BMW, or Mercedes because you get the name recognition and whatever else the name promises (reliability and service for Lexus, performance and ultimate driving experience for BMW, prestige and luxury for Merc). The Q also markets to older buyers, who just aren't as concerned with the performance, which is the key advantage it offers over its competition.

It really just comes down to the fact that Infiniti has done a very poor job of making a name for themselves. People immediately have images conjured up in their minds when they hear Lexus or BMW, but Infiniti just doesn't ring with many people. I'd say the company needs to fire a good portion of its marketing staff.

Lexus, BMW, and Mercedes are all more expensive than Infiniti's are [class to class]. Infiniti's have a higher MSRP, but are almost always discounted because they don't move off the lots very well. Mercedes has prestige but I dont' think it is luxurious. Luxury to me means a car that is smooth and very comfortable. Mercedes have sporty seats, and a stiffer, harder leather than cars like Lexus. Lexus LS400, Cadillac, and Lincoln make real comfortable cars. Cadillac and Lincoln use cheap parts, whereas Lexus uses birdseye wood, Mark Levinson Sound, circulating A/C vents, drink coolers, etc... which is far more luxurious than any Mercedes. Infiniti is known for its service though. It has top notch service (my extended family owns 3 Infinitis). My family owns Lexus and Mercedes. Mercedes has gone downhill. IT is now a car for the masses and its service is absolutely horrible. They treat you as if you drive a civic. Lexus is THE BEST overall, hands down (i haven't tried BMW, but I feel they are overpriced compared to Lexus, also I have several friends with the M3 who have had quite a few technical problems.). Lexus is highly reliable, very comfortable, luxurious, and the service is outstanding. They will come and pick up your car from your home or office, and drop off another lexus as a loaner. service it, wash it, and then bring it back as soon as its ready and pick up their loaner and leave. All included. That includes for oil changes and other routine maintenance.

I think Infiniti's are damn ugly. Their only saving grace is their very good service which means a lot these days. Quite frankly, I'd rather pay 5k more and get the Lexus.

 

[brxndxn]

My friend just bought a used 2000 Q45. It is by far the nicest luxury car I have ever been in.. And I've been in Mercedes, BMW's, and Lexus's (Lexii? ).

It's fast, it has a navigation screen, and it has all sorts of neat gizmos that I would never think of. Like, the console opens both to the passenger and the driver.. and then there's another compartment under the console. It also can switch from luxury to sport suspension with the touch of a button. It's also a very fast car and it handles well. I would buy one if I had the money.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: LittleWolf

Originally posted by: PoPPeR

Originally posted by: geno

Originally posted by: Crab cake
Bland styling. It's as simple as that. People don't come into the showrooms to look under the hood. Not people in this demographic anyway.

Explain Audi's success then. Plainest cars ever.

i like audi's... they don't look plain to me. Classy, stylish, simple

Quite right. Unlike other manuf. Audi believes in classic minimalist cues. But they look fresh forever unlike the Jap. or korean manufs. who change designs almost every year...:disgust: and look dated so soon.

Look at any old Audi and compare it to similar year Lexus and tell me with a straight face that the Audi still looks "fresh."

Here, lemme help you out:

1996 Audi's
1996 Lexus'

IMO, the current A6 is the only Audi I've seen that has done an excellent job of aging well. Its been around since 1998 and still looks reasonably current.

 

[LittleWolf]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
For the longest time, Audi was the only luxury company to offer something like Quattro. As more companies like Mercedes adopt their own AWD system (4Matic), that will become less and less a selling point for Audi. So, time will tell how they fair.

Mercedes (and so is BMW, Jag and soon Lexus) is trying to steal Audi's thunder. But seriously, the Mercedes or for that matter BMW's or Jag's AWD doesn't even come close to Audi's Quattro. The Mercedes and BMW systems are still essentially RWD with basic AWD retrofit. They do not come even close to the way Audi's Quatrro (is designed from ground up) handles and manages power/traction. They still have quite some ways to go.

But at the same time it is also a warning sign for Audi to move to the next level.