Why the left hates Trump so intensely

[Jhhnn]

Pretty sure they believed in Obama 8 years ago.
Not so much battered spouse as a drowning victim desperately clinging to and clawing to grab hold of any flotsam within reach.
Status quo is failing them and no longer on their radar.

Obama was new and radical. Trump was new and radical. Whoever wins 2020 needs to be new and radical.
It's time for no holds bar economic revolution. Only then can America stop drowning. Only then can they believe in a new normal.

Please. The last time Repubs ran things they put working America in the hospital with deregulated finance, investor class tax cuts, enormous military expenditures & the collapse of the Ownership Society.

And they'll do it again, too. They can't help themselves. Their basic ideology is wedded completely to the increasingly broad swings of free market financialized boom-bust Capitalism.

 

[Jaskalas]

There's no need to pretend that there's some great new popular support for conservatism...

Please. The last time Repubs ran things they...

How the !@#$ did you read "support for conservatism" in my explicit (or so I thought) call for something new and radical to break the status quo? And given the content of my posts since the election, I imagine you're aware of the context. I'll try to be clearer. 2020 and beyond is the time to capture these desperate voters by heralding a New Deal 2.0 agenda. Sanders had the right idea, people are hungry for such change. Offer it to them.

There's a lesson you can learn from the elections of Obama and Trump. Tap into that voter energy.
They aren't battered spouses, they're drowning workers. Save them.

 

[nickqt]

How the !@#$ did you read "support for conservatism" in my explicit (or so I thought) call for something new and radical to break the status quo? And given the content of my posts since the election, I imagine you're aware of the context. I'll try to be clearer. 2020 and beyond is the time to capture these desperate voters by heralding a New Deal 2.0 agenda. Sanders had the right idea, people are hungry for such change. Offer it to them.

There's a lesson you can learn from the elections of Obama and Trump. Tap into that voter energy.
They aren't battered spouses, they're drowning workers. Save them.

The only way to save people who have jobs that are going to either be offshored or automated - permanently - is socialism. That's Sanders actual message, and Trump's faux message.

There aren't 7 billion jobs on the planet for every single person, even minus the hundreds of millions who are children, literally disabled or elderly and cannot work.

I think you might agree that the current economic system we have is anachronistic, has been failing the middle class for decades, and is about to collapse. If so, we already have several options...UBI, Negative Income Tax, shorter work weeks, etc. These are all essentially welfare, but welfare is still demonized. So, how to get past the demonization to actually have a conversation with everyone who needs to have the conversation?

Protip: every time any type of welfare/socialism is immediately shot down as "stealing" so that the conversation can't be held, is right-wing political correctness in action.

 

[ivwshane]

Pretty sure they believed in Obama 8 years ago.
Not so much battered spouse as a drowning victim desperately clinging to and clawing to grab hold of any flotsam within reach.
Status quo is failing them and no longer on their radar.

Obama was new and radical. Trump was new and radical. Whoever wins 2020 needs to be new and radical.
It's time for no holds bar economic revolution. Only then can America stop drowning. Only then can they believe in a new normal.

Obama may have been new but he certainly wasn't radical, unless by radical you mean breaking away from the uninterrupted tradition of electing white presidents.

Obama was a pragmatist with great oratory appeal whose ideas and policies were almost exactly the same as hillarys.

 

[theeedude]

Trump is unfit for office, even more so than other Republicans. It's not about hate or not hate. The Republican party belongs on the ash heap of history. Hopefully Trump will take them there.

 

[agent00f]

How the !@#$ did you read "support for conservatism" in my explicit (or so I thought) call for something new and radical to break the status quo? And given the content of my posts since the election, I imagine you're aware of the context. I'll try to be clearer. 2020 and beyond is the time to capture these desperate voters by heralding a New Deal 2.0 agenda. Sanders had the right idea, people are hungry for such change. Offer it to them.

There's a lesson you can learn from the elections of Obama and Trump. Tap into that voter energy.
They aren't battered spouses, they're drowning workers. Save them.

Your argument was that some surge of popular support is responsible for trump. This necessarily means punching the R button, given that's how candidates are elected. I'm just pointing out the simple fact that Trump did no better in terms of people punching buttons (ie. = popular support), than Romney.

Your other point here is election/campaign strategy. nickqt touched on underlying fundamentals here, but the gist of any long term solution is growth/innovation (ie something actually new), and you're aware of their stance on edumacating to get there.

Of course Trumpsters aren't as dumb as they're often made out to be. Their own solution is to keep on top of the social/ethnic totem, ie. take/keep as much of the zero sum pie as possible. People like that don't vote for advoates of western liberalism, and at least Sander doesn't lie well enough to convince them different.

 

[disappoint]

I'd say a dumbshit ideology...

Yeah, you would.

 

[agent00f]

Yeah, you would.

It certainly explains the prowess of the conservative brain trust here.

 

[MongGrel]

So what's the source of this tantrum rant?

diasppoint seems to operate on the mistaken fallacy that he/she is morally superior in some form and speaks to others like they are children, while spewing insults at anyone pointing that fact out.

There are obvious reasons Trump is looking more and more manipulative in less than a week in office, and looking more like a Russian plant almost to a tee, while smirking all the way.

http://reason.com/blog/2017/01/23/alternative-facts-cannot-hide-trumps-pet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh03ZUcEG8c#t=2705.914395

http://reason.com/blog/2017/01/23/trumps-killing-of-tpp-will-make-america

 

[xthetenth]

diasppoint seems to operate on the mistaken fallacy that he/she is morally superior in some form and speaks to others like they are children, while spewing insults at anyone pointing that fact out.

Believing whatever it takes to let you feel morally superior and smug out about it without having to actually change any part of your life is a central tenet of modern conservativism, so I can hardly fault him.

I'm continually amazed by how good they are at ignoring everything that they don't have a response to. They just utterly ignored the entire context of the bill that I mentioned because as long as they've got a particular reading of an overly broad law that blatantly isn't how it'd be used given the context it's being proposed in, they can hide from the results of their beliefs and who they support.

It's actually amazing how I've never seen a conservative do a comprehensive takedown of a long post point by point the way I routinely see leftists and even liberals do.

 

[FrankRamiro]

Wait, you think the largest protest march in history was a riot?

These were a bunch of Hollywood rich crack heads and others are complaining cause they are being payed to do so by the F***** democratic liberals/libertarians lunatics, most of these people are rich while millions are on poverty with no food or shelter.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

These were a bunch of Hollywood rich crack heads and others are complaining cause they are being payed to do so by the F***** democratic liberals/libertarians lunatics, most of these people are rich while millions are on poverty with no food or shelter.

wow, so globally, all the protests were done by hollywood rich crack heads and being paid to do it. Awesome news. I am absolutely certain you have some citations to back this, otherwise it would just be erratic nonsense spewed out in your usual manner.
frankie, you never fail to fail.
Keep on keepin on.

 

[Jaskalas]

So, how to get past the demonization to actually have a conversation with everyone who needs to have the conversation?

If Trump can get elected, anybody can. And those same voters who believed in Trump won't be doing so hot in another 4-8 years. Should my current beliefs hold true, there is simply nothing "trickle down" can achieve for those voters. Picture the Republican resurgence as one last gasp before the plunge. Democrats simply have not presented as a big enough change from the status quo. The campaign will be tough, but it must be fought. I have every confidence that the voters who gave Obama and Trump their edge will yield us their support if we simply show them a path forward to help them.

Obama may have been new but he certainly wasn't radical, unless by radical you mean...

Young, charismatic, energetic. Obama rode a wave of backlash against Bush and Iraq. Against Republicans. Riding the wave of backlash against economic turmoil. Promising hope and change with an address at his nomination that reached people's hearts. It was a change in policy from the 90s, from the Republicans, and it was delivered on an emotional level. They denied Clinton in 2008 because voters wanted something fresh. They believed America had turned a page.

That plea for change has not gone away. Sanders and Trump captured that energy in 2016. You need to capture it again and run with it.
Obama skipped past racial tension. Trump skipped past moral tension. We can skip past Republican dogma and help our people.
We just need a campaign that is honestly telling it, showing the problem we all know is there, and delivering a big solution.

We win the conversation by holding a conservation. And not holding back. By dumping the status quo and moving forward.

 

[ch33zw1z]

This guy, he gets it

Ramiro OTOH, lol....

 

[FrankRamiro]

wow, so globally, all the protests were done by hollywood rich crack heads and being paid to do it. Awesome news. I am absolutely certain you have some citations to back this, otherwise it would just be erratic nonsense spewed out in your usual manner.
frankie, you never fail to fail.
Keep on keepin on.

I know you are UNDER DISTRESS; But i said Hollywood rich crack heads and the OTHERS ARE BEING PAYED, {now i must add by Geoge Soros} to riot and protest.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

I know you are UNDER DISTRESS; But i said Hollywood rich crack heads and the OTHERS ARE BEING PAYED, {now i must add by Geoge Soros} to riot and protest.

and again, I must say that is some scintillating insight, you must be able to cite these facts, right frankie?
And there was much more protest than riot, if you really care about accuracy.
Oh and it's 'PAID', not PAYED...
so citation your crazy ass up with these claims frankarino.

 

[xthetenth]

I know you are UNDER DISTRESS; But i said Hollywood rich crack heads and the OTHERS ARE BEING PAYED, {now i must add by Geoge Soros} to riot and protest.

And I'm sure you have good evidence of the massive monetary outlay that it would take to pay all those people (and incidentally get all the people talking about it in the way they talk about it). I'm absolutely sure that you don't just have an assumption that Soros pays all protestors that you lazily applied to avoid having to acknowledge the size of the protests.

 

[VRAMdemon]

I don't consider myself pigeonholed to a label. I have liberal views and conservative views. I find it shallow to treat people as a "label". But some of my full partisan conservative's I see at my business are having "creeping buyers remorse" and are simply blaming "liberals" for "making" them vote Trump into office. Their reasoning is bizzare - liberals don't agree with them enough and are mean to them.

If some conservative's are now admitting that they don't have a fundamental level of political maturity - that they deliberately tried to stuff a moldy bag of circus peanuts into our engine of government because they were mad that liberals weren't being respectful enough to them - and that now they want to blame the liberals for "making" them do it. I'm simply going to laugh at them.

To them, this seems to be about the thoroughly contemptible and spineless position that it's somehow the responsibility of liberals to defer to "coddle" conservative feeling's in order to deter them from making reckless electorial choices that even they themselve's aren't happy with, merely out of spite and resentment at liberals for not having agreed with them enough and coddled their feelings enough.

It's my job as a citizen to make the best electoral choices I can for my country in accordance with my principles, no matter what mean things my political adversaries may be saying to me. I'm frankly dissapointed at the idea that any self-respecting conservative wouldn't feel the same way.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

I know you are UNDER DISTRESS; But i said Hollywood rich crack heads and the OTHERS ARE BEING PAYED, {now i must add by Geoge Soros} to riot and protest.

Is this our first Russian troll? I was wondering when they would show up. They keep trying to take over the Atlantics's comment section but they aren't very bright or persistent.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Is this our first Russian troll? I was wondering when they would show up. They keep trying to take over the Atlantics's comment section but they aren't very bright or persistent.

nah, just think he's the usual semi-literate ranter

 

[agent00f]

If Trump can get elected, anybody can. And those same voters who believed in Trump won't be doing so hot in another 4-8 years. Should my current beliefs hold true, there is simply nothing "trickle down" can achieve for those voters. Picture the Republican resurgence as one last gasp before the plunge. Democrats simply have not presented as a big enough change from the status quo. The campaign will be tough, but it must be fought. I have every confidence that the voters who gave Obama and Trump their edge will yield us their support if we simply show them a path forward to help them.

Young, charismatic, energetic. Obama rode a wave of backlash against Bush and Iraq. Against Republicans. Riding the wave of backlash against economic turmoil. Promising hope and change with an address at his nomination that reached people's hearts. It was a change in policy from the 90s, from the Republicans, and it was delivered on an emotional level. They denied Clinton in 2008 because voters wanted something fresh. They believed America had turned a page.

That plea for change has not gone away. Sanders and Trump captured that energy in 2016. You need to capture it again and run with it.
Obama skipped past racial tension. Trump skipped past moral tension. We can skip past Republican dogma and help our people.
We just need a campaign that is honestly telling it, showing the problem we all know is there, and delivering a big solution.

We win the conversation by holding a conservation. And not holding back. By dumping the status quo and moving forward.

Just a heads up that the gist of your argument is we need politicians who're better at selling to the rust belt crowd, than Trump. This is why I suggested some time back that some lower class minority is going to have to take one for the team, among other solutions in that vein.

 

[zinfamous]

A lot of it boils down to the fact that Trump is a complete and total wise and beautiful woman.

 

[werepossum]

I've often compared it to battered spouse syndrome.

And it never fails to amuse.

Pretty sure they believed in Obama 8 years ago.
Not so much battered spouse as a drowning victim desperately clinging to and clawing to grab hold of any flotsam within reach.
Status quo is failing them and no longer on their radar.

Obama was new and radical. Trump was new and radical. Whoever wins 2020 needs to be new and radical.
It's time for no holds bar economic revolution. Only then can America stop drowning. Only then can they believe in a new normal.

Spot-on for this year. For 2020? You may be right, or Trump may crash and burn so hard that Americans say "Holy crap, no more of that new and radical for me!" Or, Trump may triumph so greatly that it matters not who the Dems nominate in 2020, a la Reagan and his 49-state re-election. We won't know for a couple years.

A lot of it boils down to the fact that Trump is a complete and total wise and beautiful woman.

Holy crap, what I read was not what I got when I quoted you!

I WAS going to agree with you. My own opposition to Trump had nothing to do with what he was saying and everything to do with how I perceived his character. Which was, um, well . . . part of a wise and beautiful woman.

 

[IronWing]

These were a bunch of Hollywood rich crack heads and others are complaining cause they are being payed to do so by the F***** democratic liberals/libertarians lunatics, most of these people are rich while millions are on poverty with no food or shelter.

Frankie gots his groove back!

 

[jackstar7]

Worth checking out: https://twitter.com/WhitehouseLeaks