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Why so many inactive SETI accounts...

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Originally posted by: Bleep
I jump
All the big dogs are strong words. I can't say that I have ever forgotten that I am a part of TeaM Anandtech. Whether you consider me one of the "big dogs" or not is not really relevant
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They were ment to be strong words, are you objecting that I have a opinion that is strong on this subject?? Or have you taken it personally in some way?
I am usually around the top 125 and have been in the top 100 quite a bit, I am not speaking from the point of a new member or one that has felt disinfranchised by the system. The question was asked and I answered with my true thoughts if you dont like them that is to bad. Sure I see milestones for 100 work units. That is a very nice thing to do and it is appriciated but that should not and cannot be the end all of the problem of people quiting because of the things I mentioned.
I also like the statement that what I say is "not really relevant" What is? may I ask. Not being relevant does not make it untrue.
My posts are made to try and bring to light some of the problems that cause people to quit the Team. I was on the RC5 team for about 3 years in fact I was one of the first to join the team. I switched to seti because of the McCowen thing. I have every right to state what I think is wrong and why people quit the team. Do you have any input into the question that initiated this thread or just to berate me for my interest.

Bleep
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I am not berating you by any means, nor did I say that you could not have your opinion or that your opinion was irrelevant. As crazee said, I was not considering what you said or posted as being irrelevant. If I did, I wouldn't have replied. My point was that what you thought of my standing on the team as a "big dog" was not relevant, I had something to say. And I did take it personally, not because I feel that I am guilty of anything, but because it affects the team. Believe it or not, I and a lot of others are very interested in the team and it's members.

When you use the word all, and don't quantify it in any way, people have no way of knowing what you mean. Is it the top 5 over all, the top 50, the top 100? Is it the top 10 daily producers? The top 25? Who are you grouping in as the evil "big dogs"? Is it the people in the top 10% over all in the SETI@Home project? The top 1%? Where do you draw the line? Are all of them really the way you perceive, or is it because you feel you have been mistreated by one or two?

If you would have read my entire post and understood it, I actually agreed with you on some of your points. People should not be criticized for their machine....remember that? Reread if you have to.

If the top members of any part of Team Anandtech are seen as distant, untouchable, rude, elitist, snotty, arrogant, or whatever else you can come up with by the majority of the team or by new members of the team, then that is a problem. I, however, don't feel that is the reason so many people on the SETI team are listed as inactive (the original point of this thread). I think it is because SETI doesn't give the more immediate results like RC5 or some of the other projects. Some machines are better suited to certain projects, I think that is what jliechty meant. I don't think anyone was serious in telling him that his systems were crap, that was just the reason he stopped doing SETI, he felt his systems would be better at something else.

I also don't really care if a team member runs SETI or any other project. The point is participating in a project that you enjoy or believe in. I have done more than one project and plan on trying some others in the future. I think a lot of people who you might be considering "big dogs", the people with access to large numbers of machines, also have experience that helps the team and new members. I have seen many posts from them when other team members ask for help. Networking, hardware, whatever. They have the experience.

 
Bleep
Refering back to your 1st post

I think that there are a lot of them that like a little competition but dont realise when they start that they are competiting against what amounts to corporate sponsers, that is, those that dont own any of the machines that they crack with. They are invited to join with competition as one of the attention getters and once they find they are non competitive they are gone.
Any & all teams will have members with different levels of output ,some inevitabley will not be competitive with others ,but it is quite possible to find a load who are at competitive levels.So on this point I think it just comes down to us saying something like 'Hey why not pick a race with someone of a similar output?😉'
So basically anyone who is an active member can be competitive🙂
Btw you wouldn't race a Mini against a Forumula1 car would you?!😛


Unless they join a miniteam they are left so far down the list that it is no fun for them, joining a mini team gives up there indivudiality
A new member might start along way down,you bound to! ,but part of the fun is climbing upwards!
As for the mini-teams sorry but this is just wrong ,most of the Mini teams involved in the MTR's are virtual mini teams ,which means you retain your own account & identity.
As the for the real Mini teams ,you are right but that's down to personal choice ,I'm sure the many who do join them are quite happy about it & like being a team within a team.

There are other problems also, there are those on Team Anandtech that P.M. others and tell them "look out and step aside --------and------- are comeing through why dont you upgrade your junk so you can help the team a little more" I got one of these several months ago from what turns out to be one of the top producers for the team, it is interesting because this person does not own any of the machines that he uses. He knows who he is.

If this person was being serious (seems unlikely) then yes he was in the wrong to speak like that ,all members ,whatever there output is ,are valued.I'm sure you must of seen this been said by many members over the years.
Bearing in mind how big TA is now I think it's amazing how little bad attitude & agruments there is ,but every now then something is bound to happen!

Agreed on ya last point😉

Doomer
In the early days it took a lot less time to crunch a WU. You could really make some serious progress then. Somewhere along the line they changed this to where it takes a lot longer
Yeah they updated SETI from v3.0 to v3.03 in Feb 2001 which added about 50% odd to WU times ,but you are missing a really important point here! ,people upgrade machines! ,lol ,4-6hrs/WU is common again😛.With high end machines doing them in under 4hrs.Much faster machines has made up for the slower client.Though I do appriecate that older rigs are stuck with their slower WU times with v3.03.

All the leaders got an early start and anyone coming aboard now doesn't stand a chance of even being noticed.
Hmm ,not sure who you are refering to as leaders ,I am certainly not ,but I did get an early start as did many early TA members ,I started in Oct 99.And thus it gave me a head start over anyone who started latter ,so what! ,that just the way things work out.If I had started when SETI started in April 99(beta) then I would be further ahead still.
As for not being noticed ,well I wouldn't agree completely here ,new members of any sized are welcomed aren't they? ,beyond that the thing that makes the most impact on being noticed for us smaller guns ,is how active you are in the forum!.
Also remember that many of the big guns started as small guns!😉 ,& small guns can have a very big impact on the team via other means other than WU output ,stats,recruiting & helping others.
For instance I recruitied Darkone,The_One & Smokeball (with Wiz) to name just a few(yeah I know I'm blowing my own horn!😉).Look at how massive an impact Engineer had on team size when he went on that recruiting spreey!🙂

Another general point I would like to make ,I realise that the big guns tend to be 'noticed' more ,this is inevitable,people are curious about their 'armada' & want to ask questions😉 ,that doesn't mean that us smaller guns are not important.Remember that the smaller producers consist of the majority of the team & thus the majoirty of the teams output.

This is depressing if you think about it, all that work for nothing.
No my friend ,it won't be for nothing ,even if we find nothing in ourlife time at least The search has been continued & some part of space has been looked at🙂

Anyway ,I've posted far too much already so I'm gonna shut it!😉
 
Unless they join a miniteam they are left so far down the list that it is no fun for them..

Not true! I'm a great example of this - I started with just a couple machines and grew from there. With the exception of a two-month period about a year and a half ago(when I was able to use a couple servers at work), my production is nearly all home-based; in fact, the only machine I get to use at work is mine, an Athlon 700 - and the only reason that it is an Athlon 700 is 'cuz I donated it to my work so I could have something faster than a P166.
rolleye.gif


Now maybe I'm the exception rather than the rule, but the point is I've been having great fun, met some wonderful people and have learned alot along the way. 🙂

 
Zim Hosein,

Looks like you have gotten quiet a response to your original question. Take a look at the S@N Top 25 Page: Top 25 Teams

Notice the column labeled, "Actief % 7d". For instance, you will see that Team Ars Technica Lamb Chop has "23,4" in that column. That's the Dutch way of writing "23.4". 😉

The ?% active? range from a high of 61.7% for Team EDGE to 11.7% for Team Slashdot. So we are somewhat in the middle of that stat.

Some teams cull inactive members. We have only done this in a very limited way to those "0 WU" members who no longer can be reached because of e-mail addresses that are no longer valid. It has been suggested by some that after a period of time those "0 WU" members who have not responded to PMs or e-mails be dropped. The only benefit to doing this would be the slight increase in the "% active members" number. I personally don't think this is a biggy ... one way or the other. If there ever appears to be a consensus on what to do with this group, I would be happy to comply.

Then there is the group of members who have completed "1+ WUs" but are now "inactive". All of the reasons hypothesized by the many who have posted to this thread are very likely to be the case in one or more instances. There have been efforts in the past to get these inactive members back in the active column and I'm sure there will be many more in the future. Some will answer the call and others will not. We are a collection of "free spirits" and "to each his own". 😉 🙂

I'd like to make a comment about the "mini-teams" since I have organized my own mini-team, "TeAm Smokeball". With a few exceptions (a general rule never fits everyone 😉 🙂 😛 to Sean2002 and Legend who do not fit this description), most of my mini-team would not be running SETI on their computers if it were not for my enthusiasm for SETI and for Team AnandTech. So in that aspect I think anyone forming mini-teams is a good thing for SETI and for Team AnandTech. A definition of a "mini-team" (to me) is anyone who has someone else crunching SETI WUs using their SETI E-MAIL ADDRESS. I have responded many times in the past (mostly via PMs) to others giving them some tips and ideas of how to build their own team. Some of most famous mini-teams that come to mind are TA-CUBE, TWTA (Team Within Team AnandTech), The Federation, BigWoofer, and I'll stop there but there are others that are in fact "mini-teams" but don't advertise the fact. 😉

I have written to some of you via PMs in the past with an idea to create reports based on different categories. My original idea was to have:
(1) Corporate/Schools
(2) Large Mini-Teams
(3) Small Mini-Teams
(4) Individuals with more than x computers
(5) Individuals with less than x computers

I never followed through on this idea because of the many "problems" trying to categorize everyone. Where to draw the line between Large and Small Mini-Teams? Where to draw the line between categories (4) and (5)? How to insure that some members don't fudge their numbers so they can be at the top of one category instead of at the bottom of the other category? Every time I got into trying to develop this concept it got more and more complicated and each and every time I just gave up.

I am very disappointed to hear that one member taunted another member that ended up with "hurt feelings". We all must be very careful with this typed written media we use to communicate. Always, I repeat always, be sure to place those smiley faces, winks, tongues, etc. to make sure the other party understands your meaning. Taunting can be fun if done in a proper way but it can bring people to blows if done recklessly.

So, Zim I hope you see the situation more clearly now about our ?inactive SETI accounts?. Things are sort of boring on the DC Forums for SETI Whackers at the moment but just wait until we approach those teams just ahead of us in the world standings ? the pace will quicken. Each team will respond, as did we, when it appears they are going to be passed.

Oh, I almost forgot. I may have to dust off a report I created some time ago concerning the ?big dogs?. The FINAL analysis was that our ?big dogs? are about equal to the ?big dogs? on the other top ranked teams. It is our ?little dogs? that make the difference. The daily producers of 1 ? 5 WUs are our strength. We need to recognize this and express our feelings of pride for them more often.
 
I was sorta disappointed when WU's started showing up on that forbidden acution site. 🙁 I didn't see much difference between buying WU's and cheating. 🙁
 
I was sorta disappointed when WU's started showing up on that forbidden acution site. I didn't see much difference between buying WU's and cheating.

Since I'm one of the people that was actually involved in such a purchase, I can address this. 😉

I didn't consider my purchase to be cheating then and I still don't now!

I made said purchase to help the TeAm in our quest to climb the Team Ladder; you will note that there's nothing on the name of the account here TA - Romulans to denote who it is or how it got there - this was deliberately done.

IF I had contacted the Seti@Home folks and requested those units be combined with my own personal account(and IF they'd agreed to do so), THEN yes I would see it as being somehow under-handed. But that didn't happen, nor will it. 😉

'Nuf said.

 
Zim Hosein, Looks like you have gotten quiet a response to your original question.
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Yes Smokeball, I did receive quite an overwhelming response to my original question. While I am very grateful for all the responses, I have to agree fully w/ the last part of you post,

So, Zim I hope you see the situation more clearly now about our ?inactive SETI accounts?. Things are sort of boring on the DC Forums for SETI Whackers at the moment but just wait until we approach those teams just ahead of us in the world standings ? the pace will quicken. Each team will respond, as did we, when it appears they are going to be passed.
Oh, I almost forgot. I may have to dust off a report I created some time ago concerning the ?big dogs?. The FINAL analysis was that our ?big dogs? are about equal to the ?big dogs? on the other top ranked teams. It is our ?little dogs? that make the difference. The daily producers of 1 ? 5 WUs are our strength. We need to recognize this and express our feelings of pride for them more often.
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While the crunchers who manage high WU's per day are extremely important, you know who you are 🙂 everyone counts, be it 1 WU per day or 1 WU per hour, it's a TeAm right?
 
While the crunchers who manage high WU's per day are extremely important, you know who you are everyone counts, be it 1 WU per day or 1 WU per hour, it's a TeAm right?
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Absofrigginlutely! 😀 EVERYONE counts on this team, whether they are doing 0.001 WU per day, or 100!

I also see the real Team Anandtech team as participating in different projects, whether it's SETI, ECCP, UD, F@H, or others. Team Anandtech comes first, projects come second!

😀
 
Personally I gave up on SETI@Home due to the Upload/download issues. Also because of the minimal support of OS's other than Windoze (yeah I prefer that Other OS ;-) )

Doing ECCP now & never any problems with cruching except when I have to take my machines off line (79 days for my server before I had to do a reboot for an upgrade)

AlricTheMad
 
Uploading/downloading issues should be a thing of the past soon, SETI is getting a new 100Meg pipe which they are 'plumbing in' now ,should be online next week 😀
 
Glad to see you have awakened from your slumber, blade_47. Welcome back to action. 😀
 
All the leaders got an early start and anyone coming aboard now doesn't stand a chance of even being noticed.
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I like not being noticed--i'm just in this for the crack! 😀

Glad to see ya around blade47 🙂
 
Thanks for the welcome. 🙂

Right now I just have a couple of machines on seti but hopefully I can get a couple more in the next few weeks. 😀
 
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