Why so little love for the Robinson/Square drive screws?

[Exterous]

I don't get it. They are great to work with yet I can only ever find a tiny selection at HD (none of the other hardware stores nearby have them at all!) I know the philips head is designed to cam out but but in todays world of cheap screws 'cam out' seems to = stripped screw, not to mention the vastly greater control todays drivers have over torque.

 

[HeXen]

I prefer Resis torx or Spanner. simply due to security reasons, few thieves carry such tools to undo them and their very sturdy when anchoring down.
For most other stuff, philips is fine and you won't strip it out if you use the correct size philips bit. Its not really designed for super hard woods, concrete..etc.

Main reason being is compatability and accessibility. in other words, philips is extremely common.

 

[vi edit]

About the only time I ever see square drive used are in decking screws. And for that purpose I've never really had an issue with screws stripping out.

Also with the introduction of compact impact drivers stripping out a Phillips head is almost a thing of the past. You'll torque the screw in half or shear off the head of the bit before you strip the head of the screw out.

 

[grohl]

I am not sure of the terminology, but the square drive screws were a lot harder to work with than the star-patterned screws. My last job I made a bunch of wood shutters and drove about a 1000 of each. I prefer the phillips and the Deckmate screws for wood/fence/decking work.

 

[HeXen]

carbon tipped drivers and bits FTW
i don't even waste my money on cheap China drivers and impact bits and i always fit the driver with the screw i'm using so i get the correct size.
never an issue with stripping, but you also have to use the correct type of screw to the job your doing.

 

[AyashiKaibutsu]

I personally wish phillips would die. I like cheap furniture because it's lightweight, but seriously trying to deal with screwing in phillips head screws into the metal frames and whatnot is such a huge pain in the ass.

 

[3chordcharlie]

I am not sure of the terminology, but the square drive screws were a lot harder to work with than the star-patterned screws. My last job I made a bunch of wood shutters and drove about a 1000 of each. I prefer the phillips and the Deckmate screws for wood/fence/decking work.

I can't agree with this at all.

For situations where you need an uncertain amount of torque - and wood/fence/decking definitely fits this description - Robertson is much more reliable. Higher-torque heads let you drive through any knots, etc that happen to show up right where you need to screw.

I drove about 1000 red-robbies last weekend, and every one sunk to the depth I wanted, without slipping, and could easily be removed. I don't think for a second that 1000 #2 philips would have done as well.

Of course I'm in Canada so availability of quality Robertson bits and screws is not an issue.

 

[mmntech]

They're very common in Canada, where they were invented. I used to live up the road from the Robertson plant until it closed down and moved to China, naturally. Their office and distribution centre is still there.

Phillips screws definitely need to die. Same with hex screws. They're such a poor design. The cheap steel they make them out of strips very easily. Robertsons don't strip, you can torque them more. They're just better. I have no idea why they were never adopted outside of Canada.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

I grew up in Canada and remember Robertsons being used everywhere also.

Aside from "NIH" on the part of Americans, there's a practical strike against Robertsons: with flat or Philips heads, you have some flexibility in size matching between the screw and driver. With Robertsons, you have to have the exact right size of screwdriver, pretty much, or you are completely out of luck.

 

[AmdEmAll]

A few days ago at my camp site up at sleeping bear dunes the portopotty thing was put together with square drive screws. I thought that was pretty interesting and was wondering to my self why the hell don't they use these more often.

 

[Howard]

I grew up in Canada and remember Robertsons being used everywhere also.

Aside from "NIH" on the part of Americans, there's a practical strike against Robertsons: with flat or Philips heads, you have some flexibility in size matching between the screw and driver. With Robertsons, you have to have the exact right size of screwdriver, pretty much, or you are completely out of luck.

I don't see that as a disadvantage. Using an improperly-sized Philips is a recipe for disaster too.

And flat, seriously. Wow. Anybody that designs a system using flat screws had better be an eyeglass designer, or else their nuts deserve to shrivel up.

 

[Charles Kozierok]

I don't see that as a disadvantage.

After many years you might change your mind. My father hated Robertsons for that reason.

With a Philips, if you are careful, you have quite a bit of leeway. With the wrong Robertson you are SOL.

 

[Howard]

After many years you might change your mind. My father hated Robertsons for that reason.

Screw bits are like $2 each. That's not a valid excuse for disliking a drive style.

With a Philips, if you are careful, you have quite a bit of leeway. With the wrong Robertson you are SOL.

Sure, any old screw is fine as long as you just need to do finger-tight.

 

[Exterous]

For situations where you need an uncertain amount of torque - and wood/fence/decking definitely fits this description - Robertson is much more reliable. Higher-torque heads let you drive through any knots, etc that happen to show up right where you need to screw.

Thats what I seem to be doing the most of right now. Some of my disdain for philips is related to the over abundance of really soft screws that are provided anytime something comes with screws . Those seem to deform if you look at them wrong. Half the time they start to deform before the screw is all the way into the part where is was supposed to go!

With Robertsons, you have to have the exact right size of screwdriver, pretty much, or you are completely out of luck.

I have no idea if this is just because of availability in America but I have never even had an opportunity to buy anything other than #2 Robertson screws/bits and I know Senco only does #2 for their collated screw drivers*

Also with the introduction of compact impact drivers stripping out a Phillips head is almost a thing of the past. You'll torque the screw in half or shear off the head of the bit before you strip the head of the screw out.

I can see that. One of these days I'll get one but there are so many other tools I 'need' that I don't really want to spend the money on one. Would probably make my life easier though...

*If you have large flooring, drywalling, decking projects I strongly suggest getting a collated screwdriver. They are friggen amazing and make the job so much easier
http://www.senco.com/Documents/Specs/DS200_AC_SS.pdf :wub:

 

[alkemyst]

I prefer Resis torx or Spanner. simply due to security reasons, few thieves carry such tools to undo them and their very sturdy when anchoring down.
For most other stuff, philips is fine and you won't strip it out if you use the correct size philips bit. Its not really designed for super hard woods, concrete..etc.

Main reason being is compatability and accessibility. in other words, philips is extremely common.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives

Pozidrive is much better than phillips. Phillips is designed to strip to prevent over-torqueing.

Deck screws usually use Robertson heads.

In automotive use, I like switching out to allen/hex/torx type fasteners.

I hate slotted screws for the most part.