Why maybe going vegan should be a reality for many people.

[Capt Caveman]

I still eat meat, drink milk and eat eggs.

OP, needs to go away and stop making stupid posts. Fear mongering and preaches a lot but never follows any of his own advice b/c he's a hypocrite.

 

[Crono]

I'm a vegan for health and self discipline reasons mainly, though I am not fond of how animals are industrially farmed. It's bad for the people whose livings revolve around raising and slaughtering animals to feed others, and not just the welfare of the animals. People have the old timey farm concept in their heads when they picture where their food comes from - if they give it any thought at all (I certainly didn't before seeing some documentaries on Netflix and reading up on the subject) - but that's rarely the reality anymore.

On becoming a vegan for better health: I've been a vegan for ~3 years now, but I don't necessarily preach becoming a vegan unless you are willing to read up on the diet because it's very easy to become deficient in certain nutrients unless you are careful. Eggs, dairy, and meat provide certain minerals and vitamins that you can obtain from vegan food sources, but you can't just eat a narrow range of foods and expect to get enough vitamin D (which the body does manufacture from exposure to sunlight, but not necessarily enough especially during winter), iron, zinc, calcium, and other micronutrients if you don't eat nuts/seeds, beans, greens, etc but default to processed carbohydrates or other foods that are vegan but not necessarily ideal day after day.

And you'll likely have to take B12 supplements or a multivitamin - which may be a good idea, anyway, even if you aren't vegan - because that's not available from any (or many... there's still research being done, and B12 bioavailability is debatable) vegan foods.

If you know that going in, going vegan is great for the some of the reasons the OP mentioned (minus the inflammatory use of an Auschwitz image) and others. The vegan diet can be very rich in phytonutrients/phytochemicals, antioxidants, fiber, vitamins, and minerals. But for most people you can go for a more moderate diet if you don't want to go vegan and still reap most of the benefits. Studies have consistently shown that a Mediterranean style diet - basically one that promotes less meat, refined carbohydrates, and dairy, but more fish, whole grains, fruits, and vegetables - to be much better than the typical modern American (increasingly: global) diet.

It's not absolutely necessary to have a limited diet, but I'm of the opinion that if you discipline your moderation in at least some ways you are more likely to end up in a better situation health wise than the overconsumption society we live in would lead you to otherwise. It's easy for us to delude ourselves into thinking we are eating healthier than we are, or assume that we are eating "moderately" without actually examining what we eat. Common sense does go a long way, but so does nutrition education and paying attention to what you put on your plate.

 

[DrPizza]

By Godwin's Law, I declare the OP to have lost this argument immediately.

Chickens that are free ranging - truly free ranging, whose eggs are collected by hand are available - it's just that people don't want to pay $3/dozen eggs, they'd rather pay 89 cents per dozen.

Has the OP considered that farming vegetables contributes to global warming? Those tractors plowing the fields aren't solar powered. Those trucks hauling produce aren't solar powered. Not to mention those fields could be forested, and never barren. Thus, constantly absorbing CO2 from the atmosphere.

Further, more recent studies indicate that it's processed meats, not red meats when eaten in moderation, that increase the risk of coronary heart disease.

Methods and Results&#8212; We performed a systematic review and meta-analysis of evidence for relationships of red (unprocessed), processed, and total meat consumption with incident CHD, stroke, and diabetes mellitus. We searched for any cohort study, case-control study, or randomized trial that assessed these exposures and outcomes in generally healthy adults. Of 1598 identified abstracts, 20 studies met inclusion criteria, including 17 prospective cohorts and 3 case-control studies. All data were abstracted independently in duplicate. Random-effects generalized least squares models for trend estimation were used to derive pooled dose-response estimates. The 20 studies included 1 218 380 individuals and 23 889 CHD, 2280 stroke, and 10 797 diabetes mellitus cases. Red meat intake was not associated with CHD (n=4 studies; relative risk per 100-g serving per day=1.00; 95% confidence interval, 0.81 to 1.23; P for heterogeneity=0.36) or diabetes mellitus (n=5; relative risk=1.16; 95% confidence interval, 0.92 to 1.46; P=0.25). Conversely, processed meat intake was associated with 42% higher risk of CHD (n=5; relative risk per 50-g serving per day=1.42; 95% confidence interval, 1.07 to 1.89; P=0.04) and 19% higher risk of diabetes mellitus (n=7; relative risk=1.19; 95% confidence interval, 1.11 to 1.27; P<0.001). Associations were intermediate for total meat intake. Consumption of red and processed meat were not associated with stroke, but only 3 studies evaluated these relationships.
Conclusions&#8212; Consumption of processed meats, but not red meats, is associated with higher incidence of CHD [Coronary Heart Disease] and diabetes mellitus. These results highlight the need for better understanding of potential mechanisms of effects and for particular focus on processed meats for dietary and policy recommendations.

 

[HTFOff]

Invoking the holocaust in an attempt to convert others to veganism.

Mhmm.

Way to live up to that hipster asswipe stereotype, I guess.

 

[Deeko]

There are plenty of studies that refute the idea that eating meat is bad for your health or the cause of heart disease. I eat a very meat heavy diet and my cholesterol numbers are fantastic. Not impressed, not changing.

 

[Scarpozzi]

You know when you eat veggies you're exploiting poor immigrant workers right? Why the fuck do you guys hate immigrants so much?

This poor dude hates his life because you fuckers need a kale smoothie every morning.

What's worse is the white man makes him wade through that field of commercially grown poison ivy to pick those tomatoes on the other side of the farm. I wish you people would wake up and see what's REALLY going on here!

 

[purbeast0]

There are plenty of studies that refute the idea that eating meat is bad for your health or the cause of heart disease. I eat a very meat heavy diet and my cholesterol numbers are fantastic. Not impressed, not changing.

yeah i pretty much eat meat with every single meal.

the only meal i can eat without meat is cheese pizza. other than that, my meals need to include meat.

 

[Kaido]

yeah i pretty much eat meat with every single meal.

the only meal i can eat without meat is cheese pizza. other than that, my meals need to include meat.

Milk is basically liquid meat @ 8g protein per cup, and since cheese is made from milk, you're good :thumbsup:

 

[Sulaco]

Gee, you've convinced me...

:\

Why should I convince you of anything?

The proof is the consistently idiotic drivel that the OP posts. Whether you read that or see it is no concern of mine. But facts are facts.

 

[Mai72]

Why should I convince you of anything?

The proof is the consistently idiotic drivel that the OP posts. Whether you read that or see it is no concern of mine. But facts are facts.

U mad?

 

[luv2liv]

there is no doubt being a vegan is healthier. i tried it and lost 30 lbs within 3 months. but then the craving for meat started.
it's extremely hard to be a vegan in usa! temptations are everywhere and the price for good AND nutritious food is not affordable, it seems.

 

[Sulaco]

U mad?

Exhibit A.

 

[CPA]

Invoking the holocaust in an attempt to convert others to veganism.

Mhmm.

Way to live up to that hipster asswipe stereotype, I guess.

My first thought as well. Sorry OP, chickens aren't humans, and I won't ever compare the two in how they're treated. That picture does nothing, other than reinforce the fact that we have a lot of people to feed on this planet and mass production is one way to meet the demand.

 

[purbeast0]

there is no doubt being a vegan is healthier. i tried it and lost 30 lbs within 3 months. but then the craving for meat started.
it's extremely hard to be a vegan in usa! temptations are everywhere and the price for good AND nutritious food is not affordable, it seems.

i'd argue this. many vegans are underweight and frail as shit. to me that isn't healthy.

but then again, many non vegans are fat as fuck too lol.

 

[pcgeek11]

there is no doubt being a vegan is healthier. i tried it and lost 30 lbs within 3 months. but then the craving for meat started.
it's extremely hard to be a vegan in usa! temptations are everywhere and the price for good AND nutritious food is not affordable, it seems.

Because your body was cheating and eating meat ( your meat ). You were starving to death.

 

[Guurn]

I'm a vegan for health and self discipline reasons mainly, though I am not fond of how animals are industrially farmed. It's bad for the people whose livings revolve around raising and slaughtering animals to feed others, and not just the welfare of the animals. People have the old timey farm concept in their heads when they picture where their food comes from - if they give it any thought at all (I certainly didn't before seeing some documentaries on Netflix and reading up on the subject) - but that's rarely the reality anymore.

I've heard this from no small number of people but then when I point out that the animals hunters take are free ranging they still had issues with those animals being used for food.

I also tried being a vegetarian just to see what the big deal was. After about a month I was sick of Doritos and Mountain Dew and went back to a regular diet.

 

[Fritzo]

In the other hand, I eat low carb and eat lots of meat. I have 110/60 blood pressure, good muscle definition, I'm 6'4 and have fit in size 34 pants since I was in my early 20's.

So, if you want to be healthy, eat MORE meat

 

[waggy]

What's worse is the white man makes him wade through that field of commercially grown poison ivy to pick those tomatoes on the other side of the farm. I wish you people would wake up and see what's REALLY going on here!

those are the really evil farmers. They are willing to take up precious farmland to plant poison ivy just to be mean the workers.

I never did such shit when i had a farm. I just had a moat around the farm filled with piranha fish and gators!

there is no doubt being a vegan is healthier. i tried it and lost 30 lbs within 3 months. but then the craving for meat started.
it's extremely hard to be a vegan in usa! temptations are everywhere and the price for good AND nutritious food is not affordable, it seems.

sorry but that wasn't being healthier. 30lbs in 3 months wasn't that you were healthy and shedding fat. that was the fact that your body was starved and eating itself to survive.

Invoking the holocaust in an attempt to convert others to veganism.

Mhmm.

Way to live up to that hipster asswipe stereotype, I guess.

first thought i had.

 

[Tweak155]

sorry but that wasn't being healthier. 30lbs in 3 months wasn't that you were healthy and shedding fat. that was the fact that your body was starved and eating itself to survive.

This was my first thought as well, however if he was eating enough protein and doing exercise, it could have been all / mostly fat.

 

[bradley]

You know when you eat veggies you're exploiting poor immigrant workers right? Why the fuck do you guys hate immigrants so much?

This poor dude hates his life because you fuckers need a kale smoothie every morning.

I hope Mai addresses this point. Yeah we are helping to steal food directly from these slaves mouths. They can't even afford to eat the very food they pick and gather. But we live in a first world nation, so that gives us the right to pillage and plunder.

And this is just bananas...
http://www.democracynow.org/1998/7/7/the_chiquita_banana_story

Yeah, veganism for ethical reasons in this modern agricultural age *controlled by multinationals* is an egregious lie. Veganism long-term is unhealthy due to deficiencies that are created.

Oh and to say that animal products (in anything other than moderation) causes heart disease is just bad science. And that protein in moderation is bad for the average person with healthy functioning kidneys, no just no. Stop the bullchit vegans.

 

[bradley]

i'd argue this. many vegans are underweight and frail as shit. to me that isn't healthy.

but then again, many non vegans are fat as fuck too lol.

Vegans I know are fat skinny and have signs of muscle wasting. Especially fruitarians likely have unusual deposits of visceral fat strangling their liver and other vital organs. I eat vegetarian every once in a while, but veganism is like a slow genocide. No thanks.

 

[Jeff7]

I still eat meat, drink milk and eat eggs. I didn't make this thread to criticize people who do the same. But, let's look at the facts. Eating meat, eggs and dairy are bad. How bad? Really bad.

So lets look at the negatives to eating meat, drinking milk and consuming eggs.

1) Huge Increased Risk of Heart Disease.

The studies have shown many times over that eating meat increases cholesterol which will increase your risk of getting heart disease. It has also been shown that eating a vegan diet has many benefits. One is lowering cholesterol, and another is decreasing your risk of diabetes.

Have you ever had a heart attack? Have you witnessed anyone having one? It's not a pretty sight. So, the people who say that they don't care about their health are only fooling themselves.

A very popular You Tuber called Vegan Gains has just released a video on "What Causes Heart Disease."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qczRzcqxoIo

*Be Warned He Uses Foul Language At Times. May Not Be Work Safe.

But a huge decrease in intake of things like steak and bacon. May not be worth it.

2) Eating Meat is a HUGE Contributor to Global Warming.

This is something that is rarely talked about, but facts are facts. The meat industry is the largest contributor to greenhouse gas emissions. It's more than cars, planes, ships and trains COMBINED!

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/dec/03/eating-less-meat-curb-climate-change
...

Switch from cows to kangaroos. My understanding is that their gut contains bacteria that convert methane into usable energy for the roo. Also keep an eye out for companies that make roo-proof fences.


<later>

 

[JimmiG]

If lab grown meat becomes cheap enough, that would be the perfect solution. Less impact on the environment and the meat doesn't come with a brain attached to it.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I agree that the current ways of farming is not good. It is not good because a lot of good food is wasted. Usually with meat, it is frozen until needed but you can keep meat frozen only for so long or the texture and the taste will change.

I also buy free range eggs, milk cheese and when possible free range meat.
It is a bit more expensive, but it has less additives and tastes a lot better.

Free range eggs have better flavor.
Cheese that is made from milk coming from cows that are allowed to roam around in a meadow tastes a hell of a lot better, but it is then again also two to three times as expensive.
The milk of roaming cows tastes better.
Some time ago, i could choose between 1kg of chicken meat for around 5 euro or 500 grams of free range chicken meat for the same price.
I chose the free range chicken meat and when preparing it that evening, it did not shrink when i baked it. And it tasted a whole lot better.
For Cow and the once in a while occasional pork, i also try to get free range meat.

I like meat, but i only eat between 83 grams and 100 grams a day.
When i cook, i use between 250grams and 300 grams of meat for three meals to be used for three days.
Of course, i use a lot of fresh vegetables every time(with the exception of canned corn or kidney beans) .

Luckily, the groceries stores here, instead of dumping food in the waste bin when it is past the expiration date, one day before the expiration date food is sold at a discount. I made use of that sometimes, i mean i am going to eat it that evening. Not a problem. Better than throwing away. :thumbsup:

 

[JimKiler]

OP, I hear about the positives to vegan and vegetarian diets but I am sure there are some negatives too.