Why is text unreadable on a TV when my computer is hooked up to it?

[idNut]

What causes this? DPI or is that only with printers and scanners? I have no clue.

 

[QueBert]

Originally posted by: idNut
What causes this? DPI or is that only with printers and scanners? I have no clue.

TV's are low low resolution, you will be BLIND if you try and use a TV as a monitor. Don't believe me? just talk to anyone who owned one of those Gateway monsters that came with the 27-32 television set.

a TV ain't for displaying text.

a tv looks good for images because of how it's interlaced, or something (it's late I can't think!) but text looks bad, unless it's pretty big.

 

[Mingon]

I have a SN41g2, with a geforce 3 (dont know the make) and the tv-out on an rca cable is excellent, using the TVtool shareware. I can read 800*600 webpages no problem.

 

[ScrewFace]

Remember, not all TV's are created equal. My 19" Sylvania has a special 'Game' mode where text is more than legible enough but the text isn't very readable when not in 'Game' mode.

 

[SemperFi]

How do you have it hooked up to your tv?

I had mine connected via composite connection and the text was unreadable. I recently bought a new tv that has svideo connection and wow what a difference. I wouldn't want to do web surfing on a large scale but text is readable. My tv also has DVI but I haven't tried that yet. I am expecting that to be a whole lot better again.

 

[sep]

Back when I was playing with this concept...like webtv, I couldn't read text on my 32inch tv with 640x480 output over RCA. Once I connected with SVideo and upped the res to 800x600 it definitly increased the quality, but still wasn't worth straning the eyes.

I have read that the only way to get crisp text on a tv is to use a HDTV. Anyone else?

...Idnut...sorry you missed the LAN PARTY.

 

[glugglug]

The format of the TV signal is NTSC, known jokingly as Never Twice the Same Color.

This is because the hue and brightness signals (it's actually HSV going to the TV not RGB) going through that RCA cable are close in frequency and carried on the same pins, so they interfere with each other heavily. In fact old Apple // systems actually rely on this interference to produce colors by outputing a 280x192 black & white signal causing predictable interference patterns. That's right, 280x192 is too high resolution to do on a TV set without getting color bleeding from interference.

The way they produce readable text on TV broadcasts (even though its much bigger than you'd normally use on the computer) is that the images are heavily anti-aliased to reduce this interference before broadcast. (the interference mainly only occurs on edges between highly contrasting colors, i.e. black text on white if you don't give it a grey edge).

Some color combos work better through this than others. Blue & white is a much better combination than black & white for it.

Also, since the scan lines run horizontally, the color bleeding, etc. only happens in the horizontal direction. You can use the full 480 vertical resolution, but a lower horizontal resolution will work better on TV (unless you anti-alias to make up for it).

 

[idNut]

Very helpful. I'm using S-Video to hook it up and text is unreadable unless you have the res at 8x6.

Sep, yeah, nature sucks.

 

[Dijay]

How readable is text on a HDTV? Can it be used as a full time moniter?

 

[videobruce]

Originally posted by: Dijay
How readable is text on a HDTV? Can it be used as a full time moniter?

Good question! Anyone have a computer hooked up to a HDTV (16x9) projection TV?

 

[Dijay]

I'd be more interested in a widescreen HD "tube" TV......I'm not a fan of projection TVs. But I'd still like to hear how those look as a moniter as well.

 

[Boogak]

I have a 8500LE hooked up to my Toshiba 43" HD RPTV (4:3 since I watch mostly 4:3 material). I've used s-video, the ATI HDTV Component adapter, and my current Audio Authority Video VGA to Component transcoder. I can't tolerate s-video output anymore, the component output is sooo much crisper. Web browsing is feasible.

To illustrate the difference, here's a pic I took using my Nikon Coolpix 800 camera mounted on a tripod from the same spot at the same angle of my TV, both using the s-video connection and then the ATI HDTV Component adapter. Both are running at 640x480. Even these pics don't really do it justice on how much better it looks over s-video.

S-VIDEO
Component

 

[videobruce]

How much was the transcoder?

Problem with that, for the extra $$ for that device wouldn't it be better to invest that into a VGA projection monitor w/o the transcoder?

 

[Boogak]

The transcoder is only $109 at www.copperbox.com. I already had my TV for a year before I decided to build a HTPC. Had I known I was going to go down that path, I would've definitely chosen a TV with VGA inputs and true 720p support. Ooooh well, I can't complain, I still get a pretty decent picture on my equipment.

 

[SeybaNumberTwo]

My friend has a 56" RCA HDTV.. text is very readable. Too bad I hate the low resolution.

 

[videobruce]

Originally posted by: Boogak
The transcoder is only $109 at www.copperbox.com.

That's pretty cheap. I was expecting $500-$1000
I will have to check that out.

 

[rbV5]

How readable is text on a HDTV? Can it be used as a full time moniter? ....................Good question! Anyone have a computer hooked up to a HDTV (16x9) projection TV?

I'm using my 55" 16:9 HD display hooked to my HTPC. You could use a digital display for a monitor yes, but burn-in will be a real problem unless you spring for a DLP RPTV. I use my large display for video and gaming, and leave the browsing and wordprocessing to my CRT. I use the native component output of my AIW and my HD card connects using HD-15 (VGA).

 

[Dijay]

wow thanks for the pics. thats a huge difference but you can't expect much with S-video anyways.


"I've used s-video, the ATI HDTV Component adapter, and my current Audio Authority Video VGA to Component transcoder. "

Is there much difference between the ATI HDTV component adapter and the audio authority VGA to Component transcoder?




"I would've definitely chosen a TV with VGA inputs and true 720p support. "

why can't you get that with your curent setup?.....or is it that your TV doesn't support it. Can you do 1080i?...insted of 480p




last question about burn in. Would there be much more chance of a burn in useing a "tube" TV then just a normal moniter. Aren't they pretty much the same thing. (I think they are both CRTs right?)

thanks

 

[budgieboo]

hi i was just curious if the display would be like a monitor on a flat tv, my reasoning is because lcd's are flat, so a flat tv in a big box is the same. i may be wrong. please let me know it would be cool to use a flat 20" as a monitor for my pc

 

[Vernor]

Because NTSC is 1950s technology.

 

[Doh!]

Originally posted by: budgieboo
hi i was just curious if the display would be like a monitor on a flat tv, my reasoning is because lcd's are flat, so a flat tv in a big box is the same. i may be wrong. please let me know it would be cool to use a flat 20" as a monitor for my pc

It's not crisp as a lcd but it's much better than a conventional TV using either a RCA cable or a S-Video cable (I use a monitor cable as my Samsung flat TV has a 15-pin monitor input). My father-in-law in Korea has a LG 60" LCD Projection HDTV (I don't think it's available in the U.S. but it's thicker than a PDP but about 1/3 of a conventional projection TV) that also has a 15-pin monitor input and it looks just as good as a regular LCD monitor (it goes as high as 1600x1200). It's around $6,000. He also has a 50" PDP HDTV which I have yet to hook up a laptop because an interior designer put a stupid shelf right below the TV which was blocking the access to all extra audio/video/PC inputs/outputs (I'll do on my next trip). It appears that most high-end TVs have 15-pin monitor input which will help the image quality.

 

[Boogak]

Originally posted by: Dijay

"I've used s-video, the ATI HDTV Component adapter, and my current Audio Authority Video VGA to Component transcoder. "
Is there much difference between the ATI HDTV component adapter and the audio authority VGA to Component transcoder?

"I would've definitely chosen a TV with VGA inputs and true 720p support. "
why can't you get that with your curent setup?.....or is it that your TV doesn't support it. Can you do 1080i?...insted of 480p

last question about burn in. Would there be much more chance of a burn in useing a "tube" TV then just a normal moniter. Aren't they pretty much the same thing. (I think they are both CRTs right?)

1. The ATI HDTV adapter actually is better with crisper text and colors, but it has serious problems with overscan and a scrolling desktop effect at resolutions over 640x480. I finally gave up on it (I needed usable 640x480 and 800x600 resolutions for games) and decided to get the Audio Authority adapter instead. While picture quality is not quite as good as the ATI adapter, it's still alot better than s-video out.

2. My TV doesn't support 720p, only 480p and 1080i. 1080i has more lines of resolution, but there is a pretty noticable flickering effect since it is an interlaced signal (alternating lines are drawn with each refresh). While it's OK for games, it's annoying for text. So I just end up using the progressive modes most of the time.

3. Not really sure on this, but I would think regular direct view TVs shouldn't have a problem with burn-in like projection TVs do.

hi i was just curious if the display would be like a monitor on a flat tv, my reasoning is because lcd's are flat, so a flat tv in a big box is the same. i may be wrong. please let me know it would be cool to use a flat 20" as a monitor for my pc

A flat TV wouldn't matter, it still has a horrible dot pitch compared to CRT monitors and with s-video out, you're still limited to a 480i signal.