Why is suicide illegal?

[JohnOfSheffield]

The reason it's illegal is because when someone gets to the point of taking their own life, they may include others.

If people that killed themselves always did it without collateral damage then I am sure it wouldn't be illegal everywhere.

That would already be illegal, murder is ALWAYS illegal regardless of if you kill yourself or not.

It's not illegal "everywhere" it's just that people think that it's wrong and therefore it must be stated in law that it is illegal.

It's a christian stance, human life holds no inherent value unless you are religious.

 

[Kappo]

That would already be illegal, murder is ALWAYS illegal regardless of if you kill yourself or not.

It's not illegal "everywhere" it's just that people think that it's wrong and therefore it must be stated in law that it is illegal.

It's a christian stance, human life holds no inherent value unless you are religious.

Uh, I'm not Christian and it holds value to me. Just looking for attention today, are we?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Uh, I'm not Christian and it holds value to me. Just looking for attention today, are we?

Not YOUR life shitsforbrains, HUMAN life, if someone wants to shoot their brains out do you think their life holds value to a degree where they should not be allowed to do so if they wish?

THAT is about the inherent value about human life itself and of what value is it if you cannot even decide for yourself if you want it?

The idea that you matter to anyone but yourself and for a short period of time to those in your direct family is bullsheit, you are not even a blip on the radar of life.

 

[Kappo]

Not YOUR life shitsforbrains, HUMAN life, if someone wants to shoot their brains out do you think their life holds value to a degree where they should not be allowed to do so if they wish?

THAT is about the inherent value about human life itself and of what value is it if you cannot even decide for yourself if you want it?

The idea that you matter to anyone but yourself and for a short period of time to those in your direct family is bullsheit, you are not even a blip on the radar of life.

Perhaps your sad existence is such, but some of us do not only think of ourselves. Funny that you say "it only matters to you" and "your direct family" in the same sentence, which is a conflict.

Public schools, huh?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Perhaps your sad existence is such, but some of us do not only think of ourselves. Funny that you say "it only matters to you" and "your direct family" in the same sentence, which is a conflict.

Public schools, huh?

Read my post again because while you might have read it, you have not understood it.

Do you think the world cares if you die in five minutes? You won't and your family will care for a short amount of time.

You are useful alive but easily replaced when dead and your life, like anyone elses life is just gone when it's gone, in a short while, no one will even think about that you ever were here.

IN short, there is NO inherent value in human life.

 

[nobodyknows]

the problem is most of these aren't really planned out as far as the final event. It's a crime of passion more or less.

One day dad just pulls himself into the familiy garage like he always has, no one jumps up anymore to see him at the door anyway...so he just puts on some relaxing music, shuts the garage door and leaves the ignition running.

A few days later they discover his whole family dead of CO poisioning.

Well, I was speaking of MY half baked plan. It would do the job for me without harming anybody else, they would have a nice body for a funeral and to give them some clousure, and no brains to scrape off the walls.

I, nor you have any control over what some other random guy does. Some of them kill their whole families before they kill themselves. I suppose in their twisted heads they are sparring them the embarassment, or from having to deal with the cold, cruel world? Whatever it is, it's twisted.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Well, I was speaking of MY half baked plan. It would do the job for me without harming anybody else, they would have a nice body for a funeral and to give them some clousure, and no brains to scrape off the walls.

I, nor you have any control over what some other random guy does. Some of them kill their whole families before they kill themselves. I suppose in their twisted heads they are sparring them the embarassment, or from having to deal with the cold, cruel world? Whatever it is, it's twisted.

Well, his plan is unusable as it is because the CO2 overwhelms the CO amount and without a direct breathing tube they'll run out of gas way before they notice anything besides a slight cough and teary eyes.

My way would be the 870 in the mouth. tilted about 35 degree upwards to blow the neurocortex right out of my skull.

 

[Kappo]

Read my post again because while you might have read it, you have not understood it.

Do you think the world cares if you die in five minutes? You won't and your family will care for a short amount of time.

You are useful alive but easily replaced when dead and your life, like anyone elses life is just gone when it's gone, in a short while, no one will even think about that you ever were here.

IN short, there is NO inherent value in human life.

Like I said, in your sad existence, there may be no value. The perspective you are taking is that the entire world has to care about something in order for it to have value. With that standpoint, nothing has value. People who think nothing has any value typically are attempting to project their own deficiencies onto the world in an attempt to stave off depression or general loss of self-worth.

Good luck with that.

 

[nobodyknows]

Read my post again because while you might have read it, you have not understood it.

Do you think the world cares if you die in five minutes? You won't and your family will care for a short amount of time.

You are useful alive but easily replaced when dead and your life, like anyone elses life is just gone when it's gone, in a short while, no one will even think about that you ever were here.

IN short, there is NO inherent value in human life.

I think you have a skewed view. Isn't civilization based on that fact that their IS inherent value in human life? No man is an island, no?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Like I said, in your sad existence, there may be no value. The perspective you are taking is that the entire world has to care about something in order for it to have value. With that standpoint, nothing has value. People who think nothing has any value typically are attempting to project their own deficiencies onto the world in an attempt to stave off depression or general loss of self-worth.

Good luck with that.

Unfortunatnly for me, people depend on me to make life or death decisions for a whole lot of people, i am the first in and always the one who deciedes what happens.

I'm sure my children would care, for a short while, but eventually they wold be gone out of this world too and a short while in 4.3 billion years is what our lives and the lives of our entire family is about.

Perhaps if you had read my post, you'd understand that because i said just that.

My life has value to me and those near me, not to this world, this world couldn't care less if i lived or died, you can die tomorrow and i won't care or even know about it, you are perhaps mourned for a short period of time, like you mourned your grandfather...

I think that ACTIONS have value, not judgement over others rights or wrongs but the things that i do.

I kill people for a living, that is the basic thing that i do. Are their lives inherently valuable? Not to me. I don't involve myselft with their crimes, i just plan for a couple of hours and bring my team through, no one is ever left alive when we have passed.

No one has any inherent value to anyone but for a short period of time, in 1k years, no one will ever know we ever existed.

 

[piasabird]

Murder is illegal and suicide is just murder. Some reasons for this may be financial. Imagine someone buys an insurance policy, and then kills themselves in hope of a financial reward for their spouse or their children.

When you commit suicide you are also saddling your funeral expense on your relatives. If you are married you may also be affecting your immediate family with a financial burden of losing your income, your physical help, and your emotional help. Suicide is just a selfish act. So dont be a selfish quitter on life.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

I think you have a skewed view. Isn't civilization based on that fact that their IS inherent value in human life? No man is an island, no?

No. Civilisation is based on equal value, not value of life itself.

Any man can and will lift a community, platoon, regiment, nation, what have you, everyone needs a leader to tell them what to do becaus most people are fucking cattle and that is all they are, democracy or not, they will still follow their leader and vote only for him.

I'm fairly sure you know what i mean.

 

[Kappo]

Unfortunatnly for me, people depend on me to make life or death decisions for a whole lot of people, i am the first in and always the one who deciedes what happens.

I'm sure my children would care, for a short while, but eventually they wold be gone out of this world too and a short while in 4.3 billion years is what our lives and the lives of our entire family is about.

Perhaps if you had read my post, you'd understand that because i said just that.

My life has value to me and those near me, not to this world, this world couldn't care less if i lived or died, you can die tomorrow and i won't care or even know about it, you are perhaps mourned for a short period of time, like you mourned your grandfather...

I think that ACTIONS have value, not judgement over others rights or wrongs but the things that i do.

I kill people for a living, that is the basic thing that i do. Are their lives inherently valuable? Not to me. I don't involve myselft with their crimes, i just plan for a couple of hours and bring my team through, no one is ever left alive when we have passed.

No one has any inherent value to anyone but for a short period of time, in 1k years, no one will ever know we ever existed.

Actions have value how? Since nothing matters because everything will eventually die, how are actions exempt from the lack of value?

 

[nobodyknows]

No. Civilisation is based on equal value, not value of life itself.

Any man can and will lift a community, platoon, regiment, nation, what have you, everyone needs a leader to tell them what to do becaus most people are fucking cattle and that is all they are, democracy or not, they will still follow their leader and vote only for him.

I'm fairly sure you know what i mean.

I should have said built instead of based. Without those who came before us we would still be in the stone age. We don't know which human life is going to make which discovery that aids in building civilization, but we do know that we keep progressing and that the progress is enabled by all the human lives that came before us.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Actions have value how? Since nothing matters because everything will eventually die, how are actions exempt from the lack of value?

Play daft all you like, refuse to read what i write with all your might, at the end of the day, you're just another silly retard that i wasted a few moments debating with.

Because i don't believe, not even for a second, that someone as daft as you are trying to portray yourself as has the ability to connect to the interwebs.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

It's probably illegal for several reasons:

(1.) Christianity. It's a form of religious dictatorship. These wackos even oppose humane voluntary assisted suicide for people who are terminally ill and want to keep brain dead people (Terry Schaivo) on life support (which seems as though it would be against God's will and playing God).

(2.) Some people think it's bad for our society. Children could become orphaned. Debts could go unpaid. Slaves who work poverty-wage jobs might not be around to work any longer. (Some employers need low-paid college-educated people who are underemployed to provide extra value they don't want to pay for.)

This last point is somewhat debatable because a Machiavellian politician might look at proletariat suicide and think to himself, "That means we'll have one less unemployed person to deal with and to make the numbers look bad."

I'm fully in favor of legalizing suicide to the point where anyone who is over age 18 could appear before a court to certify that they want voluntary euthanasia, obtain a license for it, and then go to a pleasant suicide center for peaceful, humane death.

Here's a Frontline documentary about a terminally ill man who traveled to Switzerland for euthanasia:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/suicidetourist/

There are also various organizations that want to make it legal, at least for the elderly and terminally ill. Some have even produced videos showing how to make plastic bags for asphyxiation or how to purchase nembutal in Mexico at pet shots.

This old nurse's video on how to make an "exit bag" has been censored from YouTube: Doing it with Betty. However, there's also Doing it with Chi.

Australian news video: Journey to Mexico to purchase Nembutal (aka "Australian Veternary Supplements").

Some groups are trying to find a way to combine common household chemicals (which really can't be made illegal) so that people can easily have painless, pleasant deaths. (A "peaceful pill"). One method that might be becoming increasingly popular is "detergent suicide" where you combine lime sulfur (available at some gardening centers) with a strong acid (say HCl) to produce Hydrogen Sulfide gas, which is deadly. Apparently it was considered for use in chemical warfare during WWI.

It smells like fart gas but is probably pretty quick and painless. Hazmat teams and first responders across the U.S. are being trained in how do deal with hydrogen sulfide suicides because it can pose dangers to people. (People will often mix the ingredients in their car, so it could be dangerous when the police or fire department come to open the vehicle to help what might appear to be an unconscious person.)

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

I should have said built instead of based. Without those who came before us we would still be in the stone age. We don't know which human life is going to make which discovery that aids in building civilization, but we do know that we keep progressing and that the progress is enabled by all the human lives that came before us.

Not really.

We don't actually take much from our forefathers as we progress, in fact, when we do we find it holding us back.

Progression needs new blood and not holding on to previous misconceptions is a GOOD thing.

Human life is worth nothing, nothing what so ever, ideas might be worth something, life inherent is worth less than it costs to prepare for the burial.

 

[pcgeek11]

Adultry is also a sin, but it's not illegal.

o, there are several where it is legal (or at least not illegal). See:
http://www.mcwilliams.com/books/books/ai…

It is ILLEGAL in:
Alabama
Arizona
Colorado
Florida
Georgia
Illinois
Indiana
Kansas
Maryland
Massachusetts
Michigan
Minnesota
Mississippi
Missouri
Montana
North Carolina
Oklahoma
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Tennessee
Utah
Virginia

As of 1996.

This information is from Peter McWilliams' book "Ain't Nobody's Busisess if You Do" and is based on information provided by Thomas Coleman, Spectrum Institute, P.O. Box 65756, Los Angeles, California 90065

 

[waggy]

i feel that it should be still be illegal (it allowed the courts to force people into therapy) but should be legal under special instances.

No way should a person in good health, who lost a job, going to jail, divorced etc or the usual shit teens think its a good idea to kill themselves over. anyone like that really needs help not being dead.

now someone who has a life ending disease (such as bone cancer) who is going to die shortly and in a painful way should have the option to end there life how they want. or someone with Alzheimer who still has some wits about them.

otherwise i feel suicide is the cowards way out.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

This all works great until your 'garage' is below others living there too.

I dunno if that's all that effective today. The idea is that you'll die painlessly from the Carbon Monoxide, but today's catalytic converters do a good job of turning it into CO2. I suppose that there might not be enough oxygen to convert it to CO2 eventually, but then there wouldn't be enough for your car to keep running, either.

Detergent Suicide sounds like a better way to do it:

http://megalodon.jp/2010-0207-0241-06/itteyosiiwatteyaru.web.fc2.com/howtodetergentsuicide.html (Gotta click the link at the top of the page to enter the site; it's in English.)

 

[Murloc]

if you successfully suicide there are no consequences.
In switzerland assisted suicide is legal (but it's on the border of legality and it's very controversial). You provide justifications for wanting to die, go there, they give you barbitu-whatever to drink in a glass, and you go out dead.

It's not nice if you live nearby though, because they stay in a house and you see people going in and coffins coming out.
They tried to block it multiple times.

If suicide was legalized and the state controlled it it would be much easier, because you wouldn't have to pick up corpses from the bottom of the verzasca dam or stuff like that, and you wouldn't have to deal with failed suicide attempts with physical consequences.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

if you successfully suicide there are no consequences.
In switzerland assisted suicide is legal (but it's on the border of legality and it's very controversial). You provide justifications for wanting to die, go there, they give you barbitu-whatever to drink in a glass, and you go out dead.

It's not nice if you live nearby though, because they stay in a house and you see people going in and coffins coming out.
They tried to block it multiple times.

Here's the suicide in Switzerland video. I think this guy was slowly dying of Lou Gehrig's Disease:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/suicidetourist/

They had to go through a whole rigamarole where it was videotaped and where the guy (I think) signed a paper. Then afterward the assistant had to call the police to report a suicide. (I think they used Nembutal.)

 

[WhipperSnapper]

No way should a person in good health, who lost a job, going to jail, divorced etc or the usual shit teens think its a good idea to kill themselves over. anyone like that really needs help not being dead.

With the current depression, we will probably see an increase in suicides as time goes on. Imagine losing everything you ever had and being condemned to homelessness. You can no longer care for your children, you have some easily-treated health problems (or maybe a toothache) but no insurance. You don't have money for food. You're going to lose your car. You are unemployable because you've been unemployed for so long, you have mountains of student loan debt for an education that has become worthless and no longer has any employment value.

Facing what may be permanent homelessness, poor health, humiliation, depression, and hunger, might you too want to kill yourself? What if you've just lost all of your energy and desire to continue living?

The way things are going in this country, some people really don't have anything to live for and have excellent reasons for wanting to die even if they are otherwise in good health.

 

[ericlp]

i feel that it should be still be illegal (it allowed the courts to force people into therapy) but should be legal under special instances.

No way should a person in good health, who lost a job, going to jail, divorced etc or the usual shit teens think its a good idea to kill themselves over. anyone like that really needs help not being dead.

now someone who has a life ending disease (such as bone cancer) who is going to die shortly and in a painful way should have the option to end there life how they want. or someone with Alzheimer who still has some wits about them.

otherwise i feel suicide is the cowards way out.

yeah... fuck it. get in a car and ram it into on coming traffic... jump off a building and land on someone or someones car or whatever ...

How about get drunk off your ass because your too depressed and get in a car ... go for a drive... Hmm, How about all those assholes that try to Over Dose on drugs. But they fail and now are just more retarded then they were before.

Smooth man... REAL smooth. If someone want's to end their life be pro choice about it for god's sake. I think it should be left to the individual. There are too many people on this planet anyway and ya know what? Even if 10% killed themselves... There are enough idiots having even more kids right now to cover that.

Why be a victim of someone trying to kill themselves and possible killing others in the process then just letting them do it. If they don't succeed today they probably will if they really want too.

It's people like you that "CAN'T judge for themselves" that make it bad for the rest of us.

Now if you want to preach the bible or whatever hand out some pamphlets before going into the suicide booth then so be it! I don't see any reason trying to NOT talk someone out of it, but if they want to do it, fine. Do it in a safe / painless manner that won't hurt them or anyone else.

 

[nobodyknows]

Not really.

We don't actually take much from our forefathers as we progress, in fact, when we do we find it holding us back.

Progression needs new blood and not holding on to previous misconceptions is a GOOD thing.

Human life is worth nothing, nothing what so ever, ideas might be worth something, life inherent is worth less than it costs to prepare for the burial.

If ideas are worth something, then life has to be worth something because without life there are no ideas.

To my way of thinking, just because something has no "inherent" value doesn't mean it doesn't have value.