Why is intel getting destroyed by Qualcomm in ARM? why only snapdragon in top phones?

[john5220]

What you guys think?

And how far has cellphone GPU reached the adreno 420? I heard its surpassed 7800 GTX right?

What about 8800 GTX?

Or a Radeon HD 3870?

And how the hell in god's name did Qualcomm get so rich so fast? their operating income is 25 billion us dollars. In Comparison AMD is only $5 billion, how the hell is this even possible?

 

[NTMBK]

Anand did some testing last year: http://www.anandtech.com/show/6877/the-great-equalizer-part-3

 

[john5220]

Also can someone tell me why intel does not win the mobile market in the way qualcomm does? isn't intel the best in CPU? so why are they so far back I mean all the top smartphones do not have any intel chips in them.

And finally can someone tell me why don't qualcomm make desktop GPUs? if they are so good with smartphones who not also make GPU for desktop? why do we only have 2 companies AMD and Nvidia? why not another company?

thanks

420 looking good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib9N9w__Raw

 

[Insomniator]

Also can someone tell me why intel does not win the mobile market in the way qualcomm does? isn't intel the best in CPU? so why are they so far back I mean all the top smartphones do not have any intel chips in them.

And finally can someone tell me why don't qualcomm make desktop GPUs? if they are so good with smartphones who not also make GPU for desktop? why do we only have 2 companies AMD and Nvidia? why not another company?

thanks

Qualcomm makes too much money in mobile to bother putting in the R&D into the desktop section and trying to compete with AMD/Intel. Desktop is dying, mobile is the future.

Qualcomm (and others) had a headstart on Intel in mobile, Intel has just recently really started trying.... just not so popular yet.

Its not just 'lets make a desktop or mobile chip' because we are good at one of them. Costs BILLIONS to develop new product, and it has to be worth it. You think QC is going to build a desktop chip to try to squeeze into the hands of the few people buying desktops at best buy these days?

 

[netxzero64]

x86 is not that optimized yet to run on android AFAIK. Performance is yet to be unleased on the Android 5.0

 

[ShintaiDK]

Also can someone tell me why intel does not win the mobile market in the way qualcomm does? isn't intel the best in CPU? so why are they so far back I mean all the top smartphones do not have any intel chips in them.

Integration and modem. Qualcomm is more or less a 4G monopol.

 

[Mondozei]

Desktop is dying, mobile is the future.

That must be why tablet sales are falling off a cliff and why the PC market has started a rebound, most notably in Intel's latest report.

Qualcomm (and others) had a headstart on Intel in mobile, Intel has just recently really started trying.... just not so popular yet.

Intel has been trying for several years now, that's not "recently". They are basically paying OEMs to use their chips, that's how well it goes ("contra-revenue").

The reality is that more money isn't always the answer. Intel has the brains, but Qualcomm has the experience and the leadership. Doesn't mean that Qualcomm are invincible, but I'd put my wager on Mediatek/Rockchip instead of Intel on mobile.

Folks have been trying to hype Intel for many years now, on the lazy assumption that leadership in one area(PCs, whether it is desktops or laptops) would automatically extend into SoCs. It hasn't happened and it probably won't.

Also, Intel's SoC efforts have been more concentrated in tablets, whose sales are now falling. Even Samsung has failed to get any design wins out of their Exynos line, in no small part because other OEMs don't want to help them. It's a confluence of forces that ensures that Qualcomm is leader of the pack.. for now. If Xiaomi does an Apple and come up with their own SoCs, and Mediatek/Rockchip increase their presence, Qualcomm can be threatened. But not by Intel.

Integration and modem. Qualcomm is more or less a 4G monopol.

That's a laughable oversimplification.

 

[john5220]

^ you are right recently I sold my tablet, its somewhat useless when you have big screen phones I can't walk around with both devices especially when these 5+ inch phones now are good size and has the sim card to accept and receive calls.

I usually always look for qualcomm chips when buying phones. They run cooler than the competition. My nexus 4 is a lot cooler than most samsung phones with exynos.

I used to think these complex microchips were magic where only intel, AMD and Nvidia is capable of succeeding but Qualcomm has proved otherwise here.

Years ago I never taught much about QC all I know is they made WIFI adapters or something in laptops. Where the heck did these people get all this brains to develop stuff so fast? you never would think that a cellphone could be this powerful

Check this the Unreal Engine 4 running on the Nexus 5 with the older snapdragon 800 with adreno 330

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEFDegk_OTM

^ so hard to believe thats a cellphone. So hard to believe that is for real!!!

 

[Silverforce11]

x86 is not that optimized yet to run on android AFAIK. Performance is yet to be unleased on the Android 5.0

Yup, ARM had a long head start and became dominant. Intel is playing catchup and they aren't even making a dent, scary when you consider how big Intel is.

 

[monstercameron]

Yup, ARM had a long head start and became dominant. Intel is playing catchup and they aren't even making a dent, scary when you consider how big Intel is.

I wouldnt say that, tonnes and tonnes of shezen tablets and other large china brands have intel atom in their products. anecdotally the tesco hudl 2...
also intel does sorta have the 64bit lead in android, although I dont know how much of a difference it makes.

 

[john5220]

^ how much is intel even charging for their chips to put in chinese tablets and phones?

far as I see all those chinese trash phones have mediatek chips in them. I live in a 3rd world where there is an abundance of all sorts of clone brands a replica iphone and replica galaxy s5 etc and they all are garbage with mediatek and the ones that don't have mediatek end up having qualcomm. LOL even those "BLU" phones have mediatek in them and the high end ones have qualcomm. The One Plus ONE that you need invites have qualcomm.

One wonders how cheap intel has to sell those chips the profits are probably next to nothing. Kinda scary because Qualcomm's operating revenue is $25 billion US.
In comparison AMD is $5 billion US and intel is about $52 billion US

Even with AMD's big GPU manufacturing they are a fraction of Qualcomm somehow. And I think this is why QC has been able to dominate the market so much, intel GPU performance is lagging really bad compared to Adreno 420. This is pretty scary considering the vast size and scale of intel, seems no matter how hard they try they cannot catch up even by paying manufacturers to put their chips in.

All the top brands HTC one M8, Galaxy S5, Sony Z3, Nexus 4,5,6 all seems to be qualcomm. Yet we are hearing intel in low budget chinese stuff and have to compete with the likes of mediatek? wow really scary for their size and power.

I wonder how samsung Exynos stacks up against all of this.

 

[frozentundra123456]

Pretty much an apples to oranges comparison. ARM vs x86. Intel's biggest problem though is lack of an integrated modem.

 

[Keysplayr]

I wouldnt say that, tonnes and tonnes of shezen tablets and other large china brands have intel atom in their products. anecdotally the tesco hudl 2...
also intel does sorta have the 64bit lead in android, although I dont know how much of a difference it makes.

And I have an ASUS MeMO Pad 8 with Intel Atom in it. Bay Trail Quad core. Thing is very fast and comparable to some of the top tier ARM processors out there now.

 

[john5220]

^ But who don't the top devices use intel?

Forget nonsense like MeMO pad etc. We are talking about Galaxy S5, HTC one M8, Galaxy Note 4, Nexus 6, Sony Xperia Z3 and many others.

We are talking about the big dogs here, flagship devices not toys like Memo Pad.

Also I would like to see proof that intel has better performance or performance that can compete with Qualcomm's Adreno 420 GPU

 

[iiiankiii]

I think it has to do with the LTE integration. Qualcomm is much better at that than anybody out there (power efficiency, range,etc.). I'm sure samsung would love to use their own SoC if it could. But, I don't think they can compete in phones BC of the the integrated connectivity.

 

[monstercameron]

And I have an ASUS MeMO Pad 8 with Intel Atom in it. Bay Trail Quad core. Thing is very fast and comparable to some of the top tier ARM processors out there now.

This irks me as an apu fan but I also have a dell venue 8 pro, atoms are ok.

 

[frozentundra123456]

^ But who don't the top devices use intel?

Forget nonsense like MeMO pad etc. We are talking about Galaxy S5, HTC one M8, Galaxy Note 4, Nexus 6, Sony Xperia Z3 and many others.

We are talking about the big dogs here, flagship devices not toys like Memo Pad.

Also I would like to see proof that intel has better performance or performance that can compete with Qualcomm's Adreno 420 GPU

So seems like you are answering you own questions. And anytime anyone says anything good about intel, you dismiss it, so what exactly is the point of the thread?

 

[john5220]

^ no their Devil's Canyon is top notch.

 

[stahlhart]

Wrong forum.
-- stahlhart

 

[StrangerGuy]

It's called IP licensing powerhouse + integrated LTE modem >>>>>>>>>> excessive performance that really no one outside of hardcore Android circles cares about.

Qualcomm successes also have to do with how Intel gave up the market on the silver platter because if Atom was too good for the general user it will cut into their expensive Core chips; the first warning sign being the original netbook craze.

 

[ChronoReverse]

I like my Galaxy S4 with a Snapdragon and iPads are always a good experience but my lowly Vivotab running Windows (full) on an Atom provides a _way_ better Internet browser experience whether it be Internet Explorer or Chrome or Firefox. It's really not even close.

I don't care how well the high end Snapdragon and Apple phones/tablets score in the javascript benchmarks; the actual usability isn't similar. It's probably just software but you'd think they'd be able to do a good job optimizing on Android and iOS

 

[lopri]

You would have to be an ostrich to work with Intel after seeing its business practices in the PC market over the decades.

 

[Bateluer]

Integration and modem. Qualcomm is more or less a 4G monopol.

Thats the gist of it. If you want to make a phone or tablet with an LTE radio in it today, get it through the FCC and applicable carrier approvals, you'll need a Qualcomm soc in it.

Intel's been trying for several years now, and its always been 'wait for the next gen' type of thing.

If you want an Android Intel based tablet though, there's no shortage of Clovertrail based tabs over at Merimobile.

 

[Brian Stirling]

Intel fixated on destroying AMD and didn't pay enough attention to mobile. By the time they had largely finished AMD off ARM was dominant in mobile and Intel was playing catch up.

There is, however, another factor here and that's that Intel, having largely a monopoly in the desktop, could charge a premium and did. With mobile the margins are much smaller and the profit/wafer is less. So, even if Intel was to gain a decent market share they would not be making huge money and would, in fact, be making less money out of each FAB than they do with desktop processors.

Mobile isn't Intel's sweet spot...


Brian

 

[Graze]

x86 is not that optimized yet to run on android AFAIK. Performance is yet to be unleased on the Android 5.0

WHAT???!