Why health insurance costs so much...

[Slew Foot]

Originally posted by: Veramocor
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad I have the insurance. I just think they are wasting away their profits.

The other thing that bothered me was the hospital rate of 800 bucks, that somehow gets negotiated down to 300. If I didn't have health insurance I'd be paying 800 at the hospital which is ridiculous for the amount of service you get. Where else but the medical field can you charge 8 times the fair market value of a service and get away with it. Even when you get a bad deal at a car mechanic you only pay like 2-3 times the fair market value. At least with the mechanic they give you the courtesy of telling you how much it is going to cost before they rip you off and you can find someone else.

No, you'd be paying $130 at the doctors office.

 

[WaTaGuMp]

Originally posted by: NSFW

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp

Originally posted by: NSFW

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp

Originally posted by: NSFW

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp

Originally posted by: Wheezer
could be worse....you could have no insurance to cover it.

In some cases its better NOT to have it, that's how bad it is.

When I had insurance I was paying $8/month for my meds. Now that I don't, I pay $10 for a 3 month supply.

Some things I will never understand...

If poor people can prove they don't have money then the state picks up the tab. Illegals come over here to have babies cause they know they can get it done for free.

State isn't picking up anything.

Taxpayers, state you get my point.

No taxpayers, state or federal.

Or are you not talking about my situation? I'm half blond on my mom's side.

I am talking about people crossing the border, they file for MSI which the state pays for.

 

[AlienCraft]

Had Shakespeare known of Insurance and it's agents of hell spawn, that line in Macbeth would have been "First we kill all the insurance agents, then the lawyers..." 😀

 

[Jschmuck2]

Originally posted by: AnnonUSA
Wait till we have National Health care....It will likely cost the full $800 per event, but don't worry, she won't be able to get an appointment for more than one test within 9 months anyway, so it will be a net savings...

http://www.fstdt.com/

 

[AnnonUSA]

OK so everyone that got their panties in a bunch over my statement...lighten up a bit and face the music. There has been no Government program that gas ever worked as it was supposed to without costing far far more than it was ever supposed to. Not to mention the bureaucracy of corruption that seems to spring from Government Money. Also factor in that lobbyists will do everything in their power to assure that health care costs do not get negotiated, similar to the Governments horrible Medicare overhaul, and you will begin to see the problem.

Even if the Government succeeds in reducing costs, less profits for Drug makers. Less Money for Doctors, etc. what kind of health care are we going to be getting. Factor in Abuses of the system, and you have a program that will dwarf the costs of any Government program ever.

Forcing people to purchase something they can not afford, is a burden, not a benefit. Excuse me if I see promises of National Health care nothing more than more Washington smoke and mirrors. Sure some will benefit, but most will not....

I should be all for National Health care, as I am self employed and pay astronomical fees for health care, for minimum coverage, rates that increase on average $150 to $200 a month every year. And yet I know any Government plan will not save me money, and will not get me a better plan...Because I am Middle class...and it is the middle class that will bear the burden of National Health care funding, like every other funding of programs in the USA.

 

[freegeeks]

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: nickbits

Originally posted by: zerocool84

Originally posted by: AnnonUSA
Wait till we have National Health care....It will likely cost the full $800 per event, but don't worry, she won't be able to get an appointment for more than one test within 9 months anyway, so it will be a net savings...

I have family that lives in a country with National Healthcare and while it's not next day, it was not 9 months from now. Too much FUD about National Healthcare.

My experience in Canada is that anything requiring a specialist and is non-life threatening will be a 3-4 month wait per appointment.

I'd take that over being in the us w/ no insurance anyday. Being poor here sucks...

Yes to that and the risk or getting denied here in the states is high. Many try to find an excuse to deny people. Also my family is in Europe so I guess it might be better healthcare over there.

My father is 81 and on dialysis, if he lived in Europe he would be dead cause they don't provide it to people over 72.

I'm European (Belgian) and you are talking out of your ass

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp

Originally posted by: Wheezer
could be worse....you could have no insurance to cover it.

In some cases its better NOT to have it, that's how bad it is.

I watched Sicko and I have to wonder how much of it is sensationalism and how much of it is reality.

 

[Uppsala9496]

THat's a messed up situation. My wife had to have the same thing done every week for a good 3 months. Took place in the doc's office and only cost me my $15 co-pay.
Was nice to have 100% in-network. Had Cigna.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: AnnonUSA
OK so everyone that got their panties in a bunch over my statement...lighten up a bit and face the music. There has been no Government program that gas ever worked as it was supposed to without costing far far more than it was ever supposed to. Not to mention the bureaucracy of corruption that seems to spring from Government Money. Also factor in that lobbyists will do everything in their power to assure that health care costs do not get negotiated, similar to the Governments horrible Medicare overhaul, and you will begin to see the problem.

Even if the Government succeeds in reducing costs, less profits for Drug makers. Less Money for Doctors, etc. what kind of health care are we going to be getting. Factor in Abuses of the system, and you have a program that will dwarf the costs of any Government program ever.

Forcing people to purchase something they can not afford, is a burden, not a benefit. Excuse me if I see promises of National Health care nothing more than more Washington smoke and mirrors. Sure some will benefit, but most will not....

I should be all for National Health care, as I am self employed and pay astronomical fees for health care, for minimum coverage, rates that increase on average $150 to $200 a month every year. And yet I know any Government plan will not save me money, and will not get me a better plan...Because I am Middle class...and it is the middle class that will bear the burden of National Health care funding, like every other funding of programs in the USA.

You really should research a little on the subject. Look at the UK model.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: sdifox

Originally posted by: AnnonUSA
OK so everyone that got their panties in a bunch over my statement...lighten up a bit and face the music. There has been no Government program that gas ever worked as it was supposed to without costing far far more than it was ever supposed to. Not to mention the bureaucracy of corruption that seems to spring from Government Money. Also factor in that lobbyists will do everything in their power to assure that health care costs do not get negotiated, similar to the Governments horrible Medicare overhaul, and you will begin to see the problem.

Even if the Government succeeds in reducing costs, less profits for Drug makers. Less Money for Doctors, etc. what kind of health care are we going to be getting. Factor in Abuses of the system, and you have a program that will dwarf the costs of any Government program ever.

Forcing people to purchase something they can not afford, is a burden, not a benefit. Excuse me if I see promises of National Health care nothing more than more Washington smoke and mirrors. Sure some will benefit, but most will not....

I should be all for National Health care, as I am self employed and pay astronomical fees for health care, for minimum coverage, rates that increase on average $150 to $200 a month every year. And yet I know any Government plan will not save me money, and will not get me a better plan...Because I am Middle class...and it is the middle class that will bear the burden of National Health care funding, like every other funding of programs in the USA.

You really should research a little on the subject. Look at the UK model.

Yeah, UK has one of teh most cost effecient medical systems in the world with higher life expectancy and general health (although a lot of that is probably cultural). As far as government programs go, both medicare and medicaid are fucked up system but they both have lower overhead than private insurance companies, by a significant margin too.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: Mo0o

Originally posted by: sdifox
You really should research a little on the subject. Look at the UK model.

Yeah, UK has one of teh most cost effecient medical systems in the world with higher life expectancy and general health (although a lot of that is probably cultural). As far as government programs go, both medicare and medicaid are fucked up system but they both have lower overhead than private insurance companies, by a significant margin too.

What really saddens me is the amount of money that is in US Health Care but it is nowhere near where it should be given the resources invested in it.

I say the US should outlaw lobbyists. That should help quite a bit.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: sdifox

Originally posted by: Mo0o

Originally posted by: sdifox
You really should research a little on the subject. Look at the UK model.

Yeah, UK has one of teh most cost effecient medical systems in the world with higher life expectancy and general health (although a lot of that is probably cultural). As far as government programs go, both medicare and medicaid are fucked up system but they both have lower overhead than private insurance companies, by a significant margin too.

What really saddens me is the amount of money that is in US Health Care but it is nowhere near where it should be given the resources invested in it.

I say the US should outlaw lobbyists. That should help quite a bit.

yeah it's a huge clusterfuck. Not a lot of options to change since verything is so entrenched. If Obama's plan to put in interoperable EMR actually goes through, hopefully we can see some returns.

 

[alkemyst]

the negotiated price you have found out about is more than likely not what they end up paying in the end.

If you don't like your insurance, change or pay out of pocket.

 

[rivan]

I didn't read the thread, but thought I'd throw some fuel on the fire.

About 10 years ago, my brother *destroyed* his ankle. A few surgeries, many pins, casts, supports, braces, etc later he's just fine. His initial stay in the hospital (worries of infection) was ~3 days. Fast forward 6 months, my mother (a nurse) is reviewing the billing paperwork. It's all covered by insurance, but she's reviewing it anyway. She had to ask for an itemized bill (instead of a single line item "3 days hospitalized - $20,000 or whatever).

So, my brother was charged for the wrong room - private ICU for 3 days (instead of the 3 days in a 2-person standard, non-ICU room). He was also charged for 3 pregnancy tests and a pap smear. The ibuprofen he was given worked out to something insane like $24/pill.

That was just the obvious stuff she caught. Who knows how much else was bogus.

 

[Gooberlx2]

Originally posted by: Sasiki
We had a baby last August. An ultrasound at the Dr. office was around $130. We had to get one done at the hospital one time because my wife's Dr's ultrasound tech was off that day. The hospital charged our insurance $450. Ridiculous.

I'm guessing the hospital is trying to make up their ER losses from other depts.

..not sayin' it's right though.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: rivan
I didn't read the thread, but thought I'd throw some fuel on the fire.

About 10 years ago, my brother *destroyed* his ankle. A few surgeries, many pins, casts, supports, braces, etc later he's just fine. His initial stay in the hospital (worries of infection) was ~3 days. Fast forward 6 months, my mother (a nurse) is reviewing the billing paperwork. It's all covered by insurance, but she's reviewing it anyway. She had to ask for an itemized bill (instead of a single line item "3 days hospitalized - $20,000 or whatever).

So, my brother was charged for the wrong room - private ICU for 3 days (instead of the 3 days in a 2-person standard, non-ICU room). He was also charged for 3 pregnancy tests and a pap smear. The ibuprofen he was given worked out to something insane like $24/pill.

That was just the obvious stuff she caught. Who knows how much else was bogus.

holly cow, nice padding work.

 

[zoiks]

Originally posted by: NSFW
Congrats on respawning!

Yep. Hope your kids don't become druggies or alcoholics. 😉

 

[tk149]

Originally posted by: Veramocor
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad I have the insurance. I just think they are wasting away their profits.

The other thing that bothered me was the hospital rate of 800 bucks, that somehow gets negotiated down to 300. If I didn't have health insurance I'd be paying 800 at the hospital which is ridiculous for the amount of service you get. Where else but the medical field can you charge 8 times the fair market value of a service and get away with it. Even when you get a bad deal at a car mechanic you only pay like 2-3 times the fair market value. At least with the mechanic they give you the courtesy of telling you how much it is going to cost before they rip you off and you can find someone else.

That $800 is subsidizing poor people who don't pay much, if anything. Public Aid pays some, but not much.

A car mechanic doesn't have to use a sliding rate scale to subsidize people who can't afford to pay.

 

[compman25]

Originally posted by: sdifox

Originally posted by: rivan
I didn't read the thread, but thought I'd throw some fuel on the fire.

About 10 years ago, my brother *destroyed* his ankle. A few surgeries, many pins, casts, supports, braces, etc later he's just fine. His initial stay in the hospital (worries of infection) was ~3 days. Fast forward 6 months, my mother (a nurse) is reviewing the billing paperwork. It's all covered by insurance, but she's reviewing it anyway. She had to ask for an itemized bill (instead of a single line item "3 days hospitalized - $20,000 or whatever).

So, my brother was charged for the wrong room - private ICU for 3 days (instead of the 3 days in a 2-person standard, non-ICU room). He was also charged for 3 pregnancy tests and a pap smear. The ibuprofen he was given worked out to something insane like $24/pill.

That was just the obvious stuff she caught. Who knows how much else was bogus.

holly cow, nice padding work.

He just doesn't know his sis, I mean brother as well as he thinks.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Veramocor
My wife and I are having a baby. She needs to have a non-stress test done every week. Basically the test measures fetal movement and heart rate.

The test can be done by a low level nurse takes about 30 minutes and less than 10 minutes of actual work from the nurse.

We have decent insurance, Aetna open access.

The insurance tells us we can't do the test when she visits her normal doctor and that we have to take it at the hospital. The doctors office does is for $130. The hospital charges $800 normally if you don't have insurance. The insurance company pays a pre-negotiated price of about $300. Almost double what the doctors office charges. Waste of their money and my wife's time having to go to two different places.



Cliffs:

Wife needs tests.
Insurance makes her go to the hospital which charges $800 compared to doing the test in house at $130.
Even at after negotiation it still costs the insurance company $300.

Are you mad at the insurance company that helps lower your insurance cost or the doctor that demands $500k pay, the nurse that demands $150k pay, and the admin staff that makes $100k?

 

[Sasiki]

My health insurance went up today.. it was 365 for family coverage. Now it is $500 for me, my wife and 8 month old son. The co-pay went up as well as the cost per day for hospital visits. We are eligible for the State of Alabama All Kids low fee health insurance for our son, but there is a 3 month waiting period. I would rather continue to pay $500 than him go without insurance for 3 months.

 

[Udgnim]

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