Why going to a good college isnt always the best idea

[MrDingleDangle]

let me clarify, in no way was I trying to say all Texas schools are bad...I was applying to a state school in Texas

I had spent the summer down there doing computer simulations and had been convinced by a prof. down there that i should go there for my PhD. This was not my original plan and I know the difference between the good state schools and different. I dont want to list schools by name, but when i was talking to a couple friends, they had never heard of the schools I was talking about, and frankly neither had I.

Sorry if i gave the impression that I was saying all state schools are bad.

On the good side, the guy I was working for offered me a job their instead doing exactly what I would be doing as a PhD so I can go down there and get paid and hopefully get in at a later date.

 

[thomsbrain]

haha, they won't teach you but they'll let you work for them?

 

[TheeeChosenOne]

Originally posted by: zCypher
School is not EVERYTHING. People get waaaaaaaaay too caught up in the whole school thing. It's important to get educated, yes. It's a good thing to have degrees and certifications under your belt, YES! But it is NOT everything and NEVER WILL BE everything. YOU are the person, YOU are the product. If you're sh!t, you're sh!t with or without a degree. Nobody wants to hire an idiot whether he's got credentials or not. Experience and character will get you where you want to go - school just may help you get there.

That said, everyone deserves an equal chance at a good edumacation.

I COMPLETELY AGREE!!

 

[Spoooon]

When you apply for grad school, they look into a lot more than just your GPA. If some guy went to Podunk U. and had a 4.0 and I went to MIT and finished out with a 3.0, I bet you I beat the guy from Podunk U.

 

[xuanman]

Originally posted by: Spoooon
When you apply for grad school, they look into a lot more than just your GPA. If some guy went to Podunk U. and had a 4.0 and I went to MIT and finished out with a 3.0, I bet you I beat the guy from Podunk U.

not necessarily. there are plenty of brilliant kids who go to podunk u's and plenty of mediocre kids who go to top colleges.

 

[FrontlineWarrior]

sure blame the school

 

[KMurphy]

i had to low

my bachlers from

me a job their instead

I graduated HS in the Texas public school system, then graduated with a BSEE from a Texas state university. I'm now employed with a very nice salary and an opportunity for free graduate school if I so desire. How did you spell on your application?

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: DarienEh, so which schools shouldn't be placed where?



Besides, this is just 1 opinion of how schools rank based on certain criteria.

i don't have specifics because i'm not sure how US news changes its weights every year but they do change their formula to knock public schools down a notch if they don't agree with how their rankings turn out. (the most documented case being turning the $$/student bias up after caltech was ranked above harvard, princeton, and yale for undergrad)

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: gopunk
i'm certainly no expert, but i think JHU is recognized to be one of the leaders in biomedical engineering... i know UT has good EE, CS, CE, ME, but i've heard a lot more about biomedical engr developments coming from JHU than UT.

where did anyone say that UT was better than johns hopkins at biomed engineering?

 

I think what really matters is what your major is and how you performed. My sis always tells me, you can go to a no-name school, but struggle hard to make a perfect GPA. If you have a perfect GPA, you will get an opportunity for admission to a prestigious school.

The problem though is, no-name schools are usually poorly equipped from faculty to resources. So chances are obtaining a perfect or close to perfect GPA isn't very easy if you have a major in the sciences especially.

But if you manage to get a perfect GPA, you have an equal chance as someone who went to an Ivy League school. You even have a better chance than those who went to Ivy League schools but had low GPAs. Often though, Ivy League schools offer services and resources that increases your chances of maintaining a reasonable/high GPA than a no-name school does. So chances are the reason your GPA is what it is is because you didn't on your part succeed in performing great in spite of resources made available.

 

[cressida]

.....

 

[jaydee]

Originally posted by: luvly
I think what really matters is what your major is and how you performed. My sis always tells me, you can go to a no-name school, but struggle hard to make a perfect GPA. If you have a perfect GPA, you will get an opportunity for admission to a prestigious school.

The problem though is, no-name schools are usually poorly equipped from faculty to resources. So chances are obtaining a perfect or close to perfect GPA isn't very easy if you have a major in the sciences especially.

But if you manage to get a perfect GPA, you have an equal chance as someone who went to an Ivy League school. You even have a better chance than those who went to Ivy League schools but had low GPAs. Often though, Ivy League schools offer services and resources that increases your chances of maintaining a reasonable/high GPA than a no-name school does. So chances are the reason your GPA is what it is is because you didn't on your part succeed in performing great in spite of resources made available.

I think you're sister has got it right. To add to that: after just one 3.7 GPA semester at a no-name two year school, I've gotten into 2 Engineering Universities I probably wouldn't have after high school (albeit, we're talking undergrad here). Also MUCH greater oppertunity for scholarships as a 3.7 transfer than a freshman.

I wouldn't necessarily assume poorly equipped and under-educated faculty though. Our facilities aren't great at the small SUNY school I'm at now, but all my math/science professors are very knowledgeable in their respective fields (2 physics, chem prof's have Doctorates in Physical Chemistry, the other 2 are working on thesis). They also point out we have some of the same curriculum, labs, lab equipment that RPI uses. It's not great and perfect, but certainly manageable, and despite popular opinion, it does require some skill and hard work to get a GPA that high at a 2-year state school. About 7-8% of all freshmen made then dean's list last semester (3.5 or better).

 

[dethman]

Originally posted by: KMurphy

i had to low

my bachlers from

me a job their instead

I graduated HS in the Texas public school system, then graduated with a BSEE from a Texas state university. I'm now employed with a very nice salary and an opportunity for free graduate school if I so desire. How did you spell on your application?

LOL!

 

[fizmeister]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: GeneValgene

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: Babbles
Just gotta chime in that at least in Texas about all of the state schools are superior to any private school.

They are all better than Rice huh?

rice is good for liberal arts and a lot of the natural sciences. but i say it is a rip off to pay to go to rice undergrad for engineering.

i heard rice gives hella financial aid...

Yeah, and nice merit scholarships. I turned down UT-Austin Honors Engineering (almost full ride), Cornell engineering and Johns Hopkins comp sci (they offered me a spot in their accelerated master's program as part of their undergrad admissions package) to go to Rice, and I just paid $121 this semester. Rice engineering may not be "ranked" as high as UT-Austin, but that's because it's grad programs are very small. I have a friend doing engineering at UT-Austin, and he's not doing near the amount of work similar engineering majors here are (I'm a Physics major by the way). I personally think Rice and UT-Austin are the only two schools in Texas worth attending, especially Rice (2600 undergrads, ranked top 15 in the country by U.S. News).

 

[rgwalt]

So, going to a state school does not mean you get an inferior education. In areas such as engineering and science there is a set of knowledge that you need to acquire to be proficient. It does not really matter *where* you acquire that knowledge. By going to a "top" school, you are competing against the best minds in the country. This can result in higher class averages than you would see at a state school, so if you are below the average at a top school, your GPA may suffer. That being said, I've seen quite a bit of grade inflation at top universities. I've seen students that pass classes without knowing a damned thing because the professors don't want to fail them for fear of being repremanded by the university. The university as a whole is in the business of selling education and making money. Each student failed is one less tuition payment for the university. While state schools look at it the same way, these schools don't make nearly as much money per student, and there are *always* people to take the place of those who fail out.

In any case, just because you went to JH doesn't mean you wouldn't have tanked the same courses at a state school. Accept some responsibilty for your GPA. Do not blame a bad GPA on the difficulty of the program alone.

R

 

[fizmeister]

Also, the best thing about a top school, is being with top students. You get as much, if not more, of an education from your peers than you do from a classroom. Ask anyone from Harvard, MIT, Rice, Chicago, Brown, etc., and they'll all agree. Speaking from experience, you meet some amazing people there, like those with patents, incredible poets, writers (pulitzer prize nominees), etc. I think it's worth taking the "GPA" hit, but from what I've heard, for grad school, GPA doesn't matter as much as having done research with a prominent scientist (which is easier to do at a top school). And classes can't be that dissimilar with state schools...

 

[udonoogen]

Originally posted by: dethman

Originally posted by: KMurphy

i had to low

my bachlers from

me a job their instead

I graduated HS in the Texas public school system, then graduated with a BSEE from a Texas state university. I'm now employed with a very nice salary and an opportunity for free graduate school if I so desire. How did you spell on your application?

LOL!

few of my engineering friends can spell perfectly. that doesn't mean they're not smart. most of them are friggin geniuses ... but in their own field. they're not english majors for a reason.

 

[DigDug]

Graduate schools weight GPA from top schools. It's as simple as that.

 

[fizmeister]

Originally posted by: BlipBlop
Graduate schools weight GPA from top schools. It's as simple as that.

That's what I figured. Also, some top schools have different GPA systems (MIT, Rice), where A-s drop your GPA (worth less than a 4.0), and you can get above a 4.0 GPA.

They have to weight it. A 3.8 GPA from Texas Christian University can't nearly be viewed the same as a 3.8 from Rice or MIT or Cornell.

 

[da loser]

i think when people look to recruit from the best schools, they really only want the best, they feel they can get good people elsewhere like good schools. also someone who has a high gpa from a good school, may still have the potential to do great things, while that mediocre person from a great school has no potential. the problem is not grade inflation, since schools and companies will just raise the bar themselves. the problem is when all schools dont have the same criteria, and the schools and companies have not educated themselves to those differences. so what happens to people with mediocre gpas from the best and good schools? who wins out? my bet is the good school because of an uneducated hiring process, the chances of the recruiter coming from the good school, and the higher probabilty that good school person was more active in their community outside of studying. of course if you are active at your great school doing research or winning competitions, it equalizes with the higher gpa person at the good school, so it's really up to the student afterall.

i didn't know that grad students got low grades, so i dont see how graduating with a masters degree will give you a crappy gpa. unless you're talking about your bachelors degree, which shouldn't matter because you have a good gpa with your masters. also i think a 3.8+ student from ut or texas a&m is at least a 3.5 coming from a great school. engineering programs aren't that much different in course work, they all use the same freaking books, just the competition.

 

[Booster]

Originally posted by: zCypher
School is not EVERYTHING. People get waaaaaaaaay too caught up in the whole school thing. It's important to get educated, yes. It's a good thing to have degrees and certifications under your belt, YES! But it is NOT everything and NEVER WILL BE everything. YOU are the person, YOU are the product. If you're sh!t, you're sh!t with or without a degree. Nobody wants to hire an idiot whether he's got credentials or not. Experience and character will get you where you want to go - school just may help you get there.

That said, everyone deserves an equal chance at a good edumacation.

Exactly. I fully agree. What are all these degrees worth if you can't do a quality work? Degrees are in theory, and there's just too many people busy with excelling in empty theories and lack any practice.

 

[LS20]

Originally posted by: BlipBlop
Graduate schools weight GPA from top schools. It's as simple as that.

yeah. i dont think it's right to place blame on the application pool from lesser schools. a good example is uc berkeley vs stanford wherein stanford's gpa inflation is well-known and taken into consideration by grad schools.

also,

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: Babbles
Just gotta chime in that at least in Texas about all of the state schools are superior to any private school.

They are all better than Rice huh?

ut is better than rice

 

[fizmeister]

Originally posted by: LS20

Originally posted by: BlipBlop
Graduate schools weight GPA from top schools. It's as simple as that.

yeah. i dont think it's right to place blame on the application pool from lesser schools. a good example is uc berkeley vs stanford wherein stanford's gpa inflation is well-known and taken into consideration by grad schools.

also,

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: Babbles
Just gotta chime in that at least in Texas about all of the state schools are superior to any private school.

They are all better than Rice huh?

ut is better than rice

Not according to the companies that recruit out of Rice , and not according to med schools, where 78 applied last year and 76 got in, and a 93% acceptance rate to Law School, 75% being top choice law/med/grad school of the applicant. Anyway, that's the hallmark of a top school. Plus, UT isn't ever called "The Harvard of the South", Rice is (and Duke, but that's a different south ).

 

[LS20]

Originally posted by: fizmeister


Not according to the companies that recruit out of Rice , and not according to med schools, where 78 applied last year and 76 got in, and a 93% acceptance rate to Law School, 75% being top choice law/med/grad school of the applicant. Anyway, that's the hallmark of a top school. Plus, UT isn't ever called "The Harvard of the South", Rice is (and Duke, but that's a different south ).

does accenture/anderson/deloitte-touche/pricewater house recruit out of rice? how come ut business school is favored over rice by businessweek, computer world, academy of management journal, scout report for business and economics, finantial times, etc. you wouldn't say outstanding research is a hallmark of a top school? wherein texas is also favored over rice by The Center (from UFL), national research council, and all above sources? you're saying a mark of a good school is its grads' acceptance into top law school... such as texas? (journal of legal studies, thomas e brennan's guide [supreme court/chief justice]) so people use rice as a stepping stone so they can get INTO texas law? lets not mention the engineering field...

 

[HokieESM]

That's very unfortunate... I'm sorry to hear about it. Grad school apps are tough this year (I'm on the student committee at Virginia Tech who interviews potential PhD students--that's what I am--and makes recommendations to the faculty)--the bad job market has led to a 50% increase in applications.

MOST graduate schools take your school into account--that's also why they have you take the GRE. If your GRE and your GPA don't "mix", then they'll definitely interview you.

Also. MOST admissions criteria for grad schools are very very liberal (except for med, law, and vet schools).... a 3.2 or so should get you in. And if you don't have a 3.2, they WILL argue that you don't have the general knowledge to continue--from ANY school. BUT, they WILL try to wash you out with qualifiers and preliminary examinations.

As far as learning from your classmates, that true. However, recall that there are a LOT of people who go to "less prestigious schools" for money issues or the like (family issues, etc). Its making the RIGHT friends and WANTING to learn. Also, ESPECIALLY in engineering, many of the top schools ARE state schools--especially for undergraduate work. Lots of students = big budget = facilities.

And its ALL a moot point for graduate school--you find a professor who is prestigious in YOUR area. And that may NOT be at a "prestigious school".... because professors choose to live/work at that university for a variety of reasons (I know a TOP researcher in mechanics who is a professor at UCSD simply because he loves the weather--and he's so good, that he brings his reptuation/students wherever he goes).