Why doesn't IQ rating correspond with everyday smarts? (I.E. Common Sense?)

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

RaiderJ

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2001
7,582
1
76
Originally posted by: mugs
a. Changing your oil is not "common sense."
b. The idea that intelligent people lack "common sense" or "everyday smarts" is perpetrated by people of lower intelligence to help themselves feel superior.

Not changing oil = dumb (why spend all that $$$ on a vehicle and not do basic maintenance?)

I've always had an issue with people who throw down big money on a new vehicle but fail to do even the basic maintenance. You'd think they would want the vehicle to last awhile. If you are vehicle ignorant, then buy a Chilton's manual at Borders (what I did). You don't have to do any maintenance yourself, but at least let somebody else do it.

Personally, I don't consider anyone lacking common sense to be "intelligent". They might be skilled at something like programming, but they can still be "dumb".

 

Mo0o

Lifer
Jul 31, 2001
24,227
3
76
Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Originally posted by: mugs
a. Changing your oil is not "common sense."
b. The idea that intelligent people lack "common sense" or "everyday smarts" is perpetrated by people of lower intelligence to help themselves feel superior.

Not changing oil = dumb (why spend all that $$$ on a vehicle and not do basic maintenance?)

I've always had an issue with people who throw down big money on a new vehicle but fail to do even the basic maintenance. You'd think they would want the vehicle to last awhile. If you are vehicle ignorant, then buy a Chilton's manual at Borders (what I did). You don't have to do any maintenance yourself, but at least let somebody else do it.

Personally, I don't consider anyone lacking common sense to be "intelligent". They might be skilled at something like programming, but they can still be "dumb".

If he's rich and he can afford it, why not have a professional change his oil so he can spend more time with his family. And personally i dont think having common sense makes you're intelligent.
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
46
91
Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Not changing oil = dumb (why spend all that $$$ on a vehicle and not do basic maintenance?)

Sorry I wasn't more clear, I was referring to MichaelD's post where he said the guy couldn't change his OWN oil. Getting your oil changed isn't common sense though, it's common knowledge; reading the manual (which tells you to change your oil) is common sense. And I agree that you'd be dumb to spend that kind of money on a car and not do basic maintenance.

That said, I change my own oil.
 

Brutuskend

Lifer
Apr 2, 2001
26,558
4
0
It's the Jack Handey principle. They spend too much time thinking deep thoughts to give common sense any consideration.
 

Brutuskend

Lifer
Apr 2, 2001
26,558
4
0
Originally posted by: MichaelD
Originally posted by: Deeko
I don't know anything about my car, and I don't want to. Why should I? I am intellgent, a good programmer I like to think(for my age anyway), I have plenty of 'street smarts', but I don't know anything about machinery, and I don't want to. Why would I when morons who couldn't get into college will do it for me?

Hmm. I work w/several guys that have a DOCTORATE and do all their own automotive maintenance and tinkering. Explain that. (I am not a PhD...else I would be able to pay someone to post on AT for me....but still, that's a hell of a generalization!)

I am shy of a 4-year degree but have about 75 credits and do my own tinkering...does that mean I'm ignorant or a caveman? :confused:

Besides...aren't you the drunk college kid that gets dumped by every girl he takes out when she finds out you're a dorm rat and can't hold your liquor? :p

My father was a minister and Collage Professor until he retired. He was always a do it yourselfer as well. I got that trait from him. He also makes his own furniture and restores antiques. There are exceptions to every rule.
 

RaiderJ

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2001
7,582
1
76
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: RaiderJ
Not changing oil = dumb (why spend all that $$$ on a vehicle and not do basic maintenance?)

Sorry I wasn't more clear, I was referring to MichaelD's post where he said the guy couldn't change his OWN oil. Getting your oil changed isn't common sense though, it's common knowledge; reading the manual (which tells you to change your oil) is common sense. And I agree that you'd be dumb to spend that kind of money on a car and not do basic maintenance.

That said, I change my own oil.

I figured that's what you meant - my post was more geared towards all the morons (usually middle-class white women) that I encounted in the service drive at the Subaru dealership I worked at. These people would spend $20k+ on vehicles, and get pissy when it took some time to get all the maintenance done.

"What do you mean the oil needs changing? I just did that this summer!" :roll:
 

MartyMcFly3

Lifer
Jan 18, 2003
11,436
29
91
www.youtube.com
Originally posted by: TwiceOver
I have run into quite a few people that are "Books Smart" but can barely take care of themselves.

My sister is like this. Got straight A's throughout school, can tell you when things happened or where but the slightest thing goes wrong and she calls my parents asking what to do half the time. Shes 24.
 

Sahakiel

Golden Member
Oct 19, 2001
1,746
0
86
Originally posted by: Rainsford
I think of "smart" as being more about intelligent about many things, not one special area. The Unix geek who can program with his eyes closed but can't cross the street is just as "stupid" as the jock at the bar who can talk the girls up but couldn't figure out the 4th side of a square given the other 3.

There's all sorts of different kinds of dumb, IQ only measures one unfortunitly.

Heh. Am I the only one that wonders why you need to know three sides of a square to figure out the fourth?

Human neurology is still largely enigmatic. how the brain works to decipher "simple" tasks such as image recognition is still in research. Up until only a few years ago, nobody knew how the body detects changes in temperature, and not that long ago somebody finally figured out how the body detect smells.
That said, my speculation is that "intelligence" in the everyday sense of the word is usually a measure of one's ability for abstract thinking. In other words, the thinking process of a "very intelligent" individual tends to follow a different track than an "average" individual. That's probably why the common sense and absentminded sterotypes exist. Intelligence is similar to schizophrenia; reality doesn't compute well in the brain.

On a side note, the brain processes different tasks differently. Language, for example, is an entirely different cognitive process as compared to sensory perception or conscious planning. It is quite possible to be highly developed in one area and sorely lacking in the other.
 
May 16, 2000
13,522
0
0
Well, you ask a question which neither medical nor psychological science can fully answer.

Originally IQ was for finding out who might be retarded with regards to school learning. Binet was asked to create a test by which the French school system could identify those kids that would not be able to learn in a normal setting. Binet took the approach that people learn more the older they get. Therefore to him IQ was a function of mental age (how much kids new; arrived at by answering common knowledge questions in a test) divided by chronological age. He established a baseline of comparison by testing thousands of children of each age. Thus, if you are 10 and answer as many questions as the average for 10 year olds, you have a 100 IQ and are therefore normal. The standard deviation on the IQ scale was likewise directly carried over from the SD of the testing he had performed. There are obviously many MANY flaws with this system, which is why Stanford-Binet testing has fallen out of use.

Wechsler changed things by saying there was a difference between knowledge and intelligence. He further broke with tradition by establishing different testing for preschool, school, and adult testing. By splitting IQ into general information and pure reasoning sections he was able to establish a slightly better distinction between knowledge and intelligence and one less susceptible to variance by culture or upbringing. It was still not the whole answer however.

Gardners work has been nothing short of revolutionary, by identifying individual areas of intellect based not so much on acquired knowledge but on potential and ease of acquisition in 8 key areas. I believe his work more than any other explains the phenomenon you're describing...people who are brilliant in one area, but slow as molasses in another. People can be musical prodigies, and not have a clue how to spell, or how to deal with others, or how to do a handspring. Other people can natural dance and paint, but not be able to solve simple math problems. Gardners multiple intelligence theory provides answers here.

Quickly gaining in popularity is Sternberg, who declares that intelligence is really just adaptability in 3 key areas; componential (book smarts), experiential (people smarts), and contextual (life smarts). The biggest problem with Sternbergs theories is their subjectiveness. It's almost impossible to really quantify these things, especiall across cultural borders. Even so, it's a simple concept and one which provides some insights.

All of these methods have some things in common and some differences, but none completely address the core question of 'what is intelligence'. Biology can't completely attribute it. Philosophy provides no solid answers. It's enigmatic at best.

Speaking as someone who's spent a lifetime in programs for 'exceptional intelligence' I have decided that while there are definately some core distinctions between someone average and someone 4 or 5 standard deviations above normal, IQ as it's commonly understood is not an accurate measure of much. The curve doesn't accurately represent differences between retarded, normal, exceptional, and truly brilliant. Nothing discusses the sociological impact of these different score ranges, and believe me, IQ is much more about what the world does to us than what we do to or for the world. Grades have nothing to do with IQ, although they vaguely have some relation to knowledge. Income/careers have little correlation, although extremely high or low IQ's are equally detrimental to modern workplace dynamics. All of this has led me to pursue my degree in education, in hopes of developing more balance between IQ and Personality and Schooling and Society. It's really a fascinating field of study if you're interested.
 

RagingBITCH

Lifer
Sep 27, 2003
17,618
2
76
Just b/c you can take a test well or have a degree doesn't man jack squat in terms of common sense. Just like how certain people are better adapted at doing better things than others.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,601
167
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
Okay, there are a significant number of super intelligent people who lack common sense.

However, there seems to be an even greater percentage of average intelligence people who lack common sense. Unfortunately, those people are too stupid to realize that what they perceive as common sense in, in fact, often nothing more than incorrect rationalizations.
 

Babbles

Diamond Member
Jan 4, 2001
8,253
14
81
Right as somebody mentioned in a long post a few above IQ is a little difficult to understand what is really going on and what the numbers actually mean. Also I have read that IQ really should be seen as a capacity to learn, not knowledge gained. Just because somebody may test at one point in their life with an above average IQ, that does not mean they are necessarily smarter, better, more knowledgable than others.

I would rather just stay away from the mess. When people start to throw out IQ numbers, my eyes glaze over.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,601
167
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
Here's a counter-example of the oil change example above - why SHOULD someone do routine maintenance on their brand new vehicle - if they intend to trade it in after 20k miles?
Simply change the oil, filter, etc. 100 miles before the trade in and claim you maintained it regularly - it saves the unscrupulous person money, which to them may make more sense than spending a total of $100 and going to the time inconvenience, when the outcome will have no effect on their own life.
 

adlep

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2001
5,287
6
81
No one is pefect...
I guess our brains do work in a specifc, unique way. That is why everyone has its own, unique way of interacting with the world....
 

KLin

Lifer
Feb 29, 2000
30,458
764
126
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Here's a counter-example of the oil change example above - why SHOULD someone do routine maintenance on their brand new vehicle - if they intend to trade it in after 20k miles?
Simply change the oil, filter, etc. 100 miles before the trade in and claim you maintained it regularly - it saves the unscrupulous person money, which to them may make more sense than spending a total of $100 and going to the time inconvenience, when the outcome will have no effect on their own life.

except that karma will come around to bite them in the ass no doubt :p
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: KLin
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Here's a counter-example of the oil change example above - why SHOULD someone do routine maintenance on their brand new vehicle - if they intend to trade it in after 20k miles?
Simply change the oil, filter, etc. 100 miles before the trade in and claim you maintained it regularly - it saves the unscrupulous person money, which to them may make more sense than spending a total of $100 and going to the time inconvenience, when the outcome will have no effect on their own life.

except that karma will come around to bite them in the ass no doubt :p

If you believe in karma...

Not saying I'd do it, I'd feel like an ass. But believing in reaping what you sow is really just a poor excuse for feeling better when someone gets away with something they shouldn't, whether it's personal or just something we read about in the news.
 
May 16, 2000
13,522
0
0
Originally posted by: htmlmasterdave
Your IQ rates your ability to learn, and how quickly. It has nothing to do with what knowledge you have.

Well, I already addressed this, but since apparantly no one reads anymore I'll state it again for accuracy.

IQ measures different things depending on which test you take. The two most common tests, the Stanford-binet and the Wechsler, measure (respectively) mental age vs chronological age knowledge averages (but not capacity or ability in any way), and 50% knowledge 50% ability (but again, not capacity).

Not trying to rain on anyones parade, just providing correct info.