Why does spinning up a DVD in an IDE DVD drive tend to momentarily lock up the computer?

[fuzzybabybunny]

Just wondering. It's annoying.

My hard drive's SATA, my NEC burner is IDE, when I put in a DVD disc it takes anywhere from 5-10 seconds just to say "hey, there's a disk in here" and spin up, which to me is too long. During this 5-10 second period, my entire computer stops responding until the disk has spun up completely.

What's going on?

 

[xtknight]

I believe the driver has to issue I/O interrupts. These, as you can imagine, 'interrupt' the normal work flow of the CPU.

 

[DaveSimmons]

I'm pretty sure it's just Autrorun scanning the CD or DVD to "helpfully" index it and show you the popup menu with choices like explore and play music.

Try turning off "Auto insert notification" for the drive in device manager and see if that helps (control panel > system > hardware)

 

[Nocturnal]

I've asked this many times and posted about it a while ago and found that no one really knows and that figuring out how to stop it is a moot point, you can't. Even with autorun disabled you still get that moment of pause when the disk is being read.

 

[henryay]

Yea, every computer does that. Anytime you have the drive listed, it will try to search for it.

 

[xtknight]

Well, these accesses typically freeze the mouse up and halt all painting for a brief moment, so it's got to be something other than another AutoPlay thread doing its work. The extended delay is probably because of AutoPlay, but the mouse shouldn't be frozen when AutoPlay is scanning. Perhaps it has to freeze the system whenever it has to make any big read operation, and AutoPlay is causing lots of big reads.

 

[pcgeek11]

Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

In the thousands of computers I've worked with, I've never seen a computer that didn't pause when you threw a CD in. Try opening windows explorer when you put a CD in the try and let it start reading. There's no way you don't have a pause. All computers do.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

In the thousands of computers I've worked with, I've never seen a computer that didn't pause when you threw a CD in. Try opening windows explorer when you put a CD in the try and let it start reading. There's no way you don't have a pause. All computers do.

ditto.

anyone use a SATA DVD drive yet? I have not, curious to know if they do.

 

[lamere]

Originally posted by: ch33zw1z

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

In the thousands of computers I've worked with, I've never seen a computer that didn't pause when you threw a CD in. Try opening windows explorer when you put a CD in the try and let it start reading. There's no way you don't have a pause. All computers do.

ditto.

anyone use a SATA DVD drive yet? I have not, curious to know if they do.

I have one and the pause is very minimal, if even noticeable.

 

[jazzboy]

A computer I bought over 6 years ago had a Pioneer DVD-ROM drive that COULD read as it spun up (instead of waiting to fully spin up) and it was such a joy to use.

I wonder what the latest Pioneer DVD drives are like in this respect.

 

[Smartazz]

I've been wondering the same thing, it is really annoying.

 

[Atheus]

Originally posted by: xtknight
I believe the driver has to issue I/O interrupts. These, as you can imagine, 'interrupt' the normal work flow of the CPU.

I thought the point of interrupts was that the CPU would _not_ need to pause and wait for slow I/O devices?

 

[BoboKatt]

Just as a side note in this regard, I have always hated such pauses brought on by inserting a CD or DVD within a drive. I have noted that making sure your optical drive is on its own channel and separate from all other drives, having DMA on and latest BIOS for it, making sure it's set to it's highest rating/speed within the IDE controller... etc would take care of everything.

However what I noted is that there are simply some models that take longer to read or spin up and some others do not. My trusty BenQ 1640 has almost no pause, or at least none that I can discern. Generally when I insert a blank DVD for example I am actually waiting for it to be read so I can start to burn. When I insert a store-bought game, I am at that time waiting for the autoplay to come up so I am not doing anything else. If something is running in the background I don't really notice if it's being slowed down or not.

Again a proper setup,

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Atheus

Originally posted by: xtknight
I believe the driver has to issue I/O interrupts. These, as you can imagine, 'interrupt' the normal work flow of the CPU.

I thought the point of interrupts was that the CPU would _not_ need to pause and wait for slow I/O devices?

Well, sort of. An 'interrupt' makes the CPU stop what it is doing and take care of some event (usually a hardware-related one) that is happening. A special piece of code called an 'interrupt handler' is run to take care of the event. And in general, nothing else can run while that interrupt handler is executing -- it monopolizes the CPU so it can get exclusive access to the hardware. Usually these are very fast, though.

DMA-based I/O uses interrupts to signal the CPU when an I/O has completed in the background, so that the CPU/driver doesn't have to sit and wait for the transfer to finish. Interrupts are also used for other command/control events involving I/O devices.

I would guess that the drive is basically 'locking up' the IDE channel while it spins up -- and if a driver tries to access the channel while the drive is doing its thing, it has to wait. This might make that kind of interrupt handler take much longer than normal to execute. That, or the IDE drivers in Windows block other threads during certain operations, and if they are forced to wait, everything has to wait. But that's just a theory.

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Atheus

Originally posted by: xtknight
I believe the driver has to issue I/O interrupts. These, as you can imagine, 'interrupt' the normal work flow of the CPU.

I thought the point of interrupts was that the CPU would _not_ need to pause and wait for slow I/O devices?

This is really beyond my area of knowledge but that was my best guess. Programs don't have to actively check for events (even if they have not occurred) in their process loop. This is what saves CPU usage. However, when an interrupt does occur, the CPU must dump its current state of execution and yield.

http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=132882

Maybe it's a PIO/DMA issue too.

The NVIDIA IDE drivers have been known to make this worse. Try disabling AutoRun completely and see what happens.

Run the Registry Editor (REGEDIT.EXE). Just type that program name into the box after choosing "Run" from the Start menu.
Navigate to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Cdrom.
Double-click the Autorun value, and type 0 for its value. (If it's not there, create it by selecting Edit -> New -> DWORD Value, and typing "Autorun" for its name.)
You may have to log out and then log back in for this change to take effect.

 

[pkme2]

My DVD takes up to 15 secs to open and display contents of an inserted disk, and I've gotten used to that fact.
I just go about my regular business until it's ready.

But when I insert a blank disc, it reacts a lot faster. Within 2-3secs, the link to Nero StartSmart is shown.

IMO, the different DVD/CD burners react differently and one should check them out. All my DVD burners are LG.

 

[Markbnj]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

In the thousands of computers I've worked with, I've never seen a computer that didn't pause when you threw a CD in. Try opening windows explorer when you put a CD in the try and let it start reading. There's no way you don't have a pause. All computers do.

It's not typical on the machines I use for the mouse and UI to freeze up. Explorer refresh delays, delays in populating drop down menus, I see that when the optical drive is spooling up, but the desktop remains responsive. Dual core systems may be somewhat better in this regard than single core.

 

[Idontcare]

Same here, my system does not "hang" or "freeze" while a disc spins up.

I can go about doing anything as usual, even opening explorer or accessing my USB flash drives, etc, for the 3-5s it takes for autoplay to pop-up the "what would you like to do wioth this disc" windows box.

The OP may have no choice but to accept their system's performance, but it would drive me crazy to have a computer that does that knowing from experience that it doesn't have to be that way.

 

[Atheus]

Originally posted by: Matthias99

Originally posted by: Atheus

Originally posted by: xtknight
I believe the driver has to issue I/O interrupts. These, as you can imagine, 'interrupt' the normal work flow of the CPU.

I thought the point of interrupts was that the CPU would _not_ need to pause and wait for slow I/O devices?

Well, sort of. An 'interrupt' makes the CPU stop what it is doing and take care of some event (usually a hardware-related one) that is happening. A special piece of code called an 'interrupt handler' is run to take care of the event. And in general, nothing else can run while that interrupt handler is executing -- it monopolizes the CPU so it can get exclusive access to the hardware. Usually these are very fast, though.

DMA-based I/O uses interrupts to signal the CPU when an I/O has completed in the background, so that the CPU/driver doesn't have to sit and wait for the transfer to finish. Interrupts are also used for other command/control events involving I/O devices.

LOL, thanks for the CS101 refresher course 😉

I would guess that the drive is basically 'locking up' the IDE channel while it spins up -- and if a driver tries to access the channel while the drive is doing its thing, it has to wait. This might make that kind of interrupt handler take much longer than normal to execute. That, or the IDE drivers in Windows block other threads during certain operations, and if they are forced to wait, everything has to wait. But that's just a theory.

I'm sure the drive is locking up the channel, and that would explain the pause if it only occurred when accessing another device on that channel, but what about people who's UI freezes up? It doesn't happen to me personally, it only pauses when I try to access explorer or something, but my hard drive is on a SATA channel. The IDE channel lock can't be to blame for that...

 

[Auric]

I concur total freeze is abnormal.

A li'l testing reveals the only way to induce any delay is by attempting to access the disc before it is ready (before or just after closing the tray). Even then it it does not freeze the system but only shows the mouse timer and prevents selecting anything else in that instance of Explorer (or PowerDesk) during the time it takes to read the disc. Other instances remain functional as do other apps and the system in general. To reitereate, even a single instance does not suffer a delay unless the drive is purposely clicked on before the disc is ready.

I do not recall anything but this behavior in the past. So, I can only guess if it is not a hardware issue that it may be some automatic software crap as DaveSimmons mentioned. Still, I don't get how it could interfere so much.

Those with the problem what storage controller is being used? Got specific drivers installed? Confirmed DMA mode &c as BoboKatt mentioned?

 

[IEC]

Originally posted by: henryay
Yea, every computer does that. Anytime you have the drive listed, it will try to search for it.

My computer barely does it, but that may be because I have a custom nLited install of XP with autorun killed 😀

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: Atheus

I would guess that the drive is basically 'locking up' the IDE channel while it spins up -- and if a driver tries to access the channel while the drive is doing its thing, it has to wait. This might make that kind of interrupt handler take much longer than normal to execute. That, or the IDE drivers in Windows block other threads during certain operations, and if they are forced to wait, everything has to wait. But that's just a theory.

I'm sure the drive is locking up the channel, and that would explain the pause if it only occurred when accessing another device on that channel, but what about people who's UI freezes up? It doesn't happen to me personally, it only pauses when I try to access explorer or something, but my hard drive is on a SATA channel. The IDE channel lock can't be to blame for that...

I've seen this behavior as well. I distinctly remember problems when I had a batch of bad CD-RW discs that, for whatever reason, would make the drive flip out when you tried to read one after burning it (it would just seek, and seek, and seek... and never come back, or at least not quickly). I would have to eject the disk (by hitting the eject button on the drive) to make it come back.

If the drive is monopolizing the IDE channel, and the IDE driver is monopolizing the CPU waiting to check the status of the channel, it would 'lock up' the whole system. That's what I think is happening. Windows may check the status of attached devices every now and then even if you're not actively accessing them.

Basically, it's a poorly-written IDE device driver, or else the controller/drive is constantly interrupting the CPU to the point where it's not getting any 'real' work done.

 

[imported_Tick]

I've tested this, and my sata dvd drive and 2x Xeon 5140 box has no detectable freezing when putting a dvd. If it's there, I can't tell.

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Markbnj

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: pcgeek11
Just to make you feel bad but mine doesn't do it?? laptop or desktop.

pcgeek11

In the thousands of computers I've worked with, I've never seen a computer that didn't pause when you threw a CD in. Try opening windows explorer when you put a CD in the try and let it start reading. There's no way you don't have a pause. All computers do.

It's not typical on the machines I use for the mouse and UI to freeze up. Explorer refresh delays, delays in populating drop down menus, I see that when the optical drive is spooling up, but the desktop remains responsive. Dual core systems may be somewhat better in this regard than single core.

"Explorer refresh delays, delays in populating drop down menus, I see that when the optical drive is spooling up"

That's specifically what I'm talking about. I never said the mouse froze. But if you cannot select drop downs, open explorer or various other task, that IS a delay in system response that every computer I've ever used has. It's just a fact of DVD/CD drives.

I still see this with my IDE DVD and CD writers on my C2D E6600.

Sometimes the mouse will studder across the screen though. It depends on the machine.