Why do people think Statistics is Math.

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DVK916

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Dec 12, 2005
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Lots of people seem to lump stats in with math. I don't think you should. Even Mathematical Statistics isn't really math. You really can't call it applied math, since Statistical Theory/Mathematical Statistics isn't applied at all.

For example, this is NOT a math theorm, but a stat theorm.

let f(x1,x2,...x,n|theta) be a distribution, and

let theta-hat be an unbias estimator of theta, then

http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/4/8/6/4863a647daf34f1e0b8a05c316c03a05.png


This statement can be proven mathematicaly, but this isn't a math theorm, it is a stat theorm.

So again, stat isn't math.


The reasont he above theorm isn't a math theorm, is because it was discovered by a statistician, and is used only in Statisitics.
 
Aikouka

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Because everything is based on mathematics and it isn't a physical science unlike some of the physical sciences that have a heavy math basis (like physics).

EDIT: You think you can complain about stats... Computer Science wasn't considered separate from Math for a long time yet depending on what we do, we don't do a ton of math :p. Our math knowledge is more of the applied mathematics domain.
 
D

DVK916

Banned
Dec 12, 2005
2,765
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Originally posted by: Aikouka
Because everything is based on mathematics and it isn't a physical science unlike some of the physical sciences that have a heavy math basis (like physics).

EDIT: You think you can complain about stats... Computer Science wasn't considered separate from Math for a long time yet depending on what we do, we don't do a ton of math :p. Our math knowledge is more of the applied mathematics domain.
Click to expand...

Damn, atleast stat involves a lot of theoretical math, not just applied.

Do people still think CS is Math.
 
jman19

jman19

Lifer
Nov 3, 2000
11,225
664
126
Why do you really care?

AFAIC, it's a scientific field heavily rooted in mathematics.
 
jman19

jman19

Lifer
Nov 3, 2000
11,225
664
126
Originally posted by: DVK916
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Because everything is based on mathematics and it isn't a physical science unlike some of the physical sciences that have a heavy math basis (like physics).

EDIT: You think you can complain about stats... Computer Science wasn't considered separate from Math for a long time yet depending on what we do, we don't do a ton of math :p. Our math knowledge is more of the applied mathematics domain.
Click to expand...

Damn, atleast stat involves a lot of theoretical math, not just applied.

Do people still think CS is Math.
Click to expand...

There's a lot of theoretical math involved with CS actually.
 
O

otispunkmeyer

Lifer
Jun 14, 2003
10,442
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no idea, ever since secondary school in yr9 (13/14 year olds) we've been taught maths and stats....always made sure that they were distinct and not one.
 
Aikouka

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Originally posted by: DVK916
Damn, atleast stat involves a lot of theoretical math, not just applied.

Do people still think CS is Math.
Click to expand...

CS is considered a Mathematical Science. It has a base in math, but to think all we do is write equations is a bit off :p.
 
D

DVK916

Banned
Dec 12, 2005
2,765
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Originally posted by: jman19
Originally posted by: DVK916
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Because everything is based on mathematics and it isn't a physical science unlike some of the physical sciences that have a heavy math basis (like physics).

EDIT: You think you can complain about stats... Computer Science wasn't considered separate from Math for a long time yet depending on what we do, we don't do a ton of math :p. Our math knowledge is more of the applied mathematics domain.
Click to expand...

Damn, atleast stat involves a lot of theoretical math, not just applied.

Do people still think CS is Math.
Click to expand...

There's a lot of theoretical math involved with CS actually.
Click to expand...

Ah, it is more discrete math, though right.
 
GasX

GasX

Lifer
Feb 8, 2001
29,033
6
81
Statistics is simply the application of math to distort public perception.
 
jman19

jman19

Lifer
Nov 3, 2000
11,225
664
126
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Originally posted by: DVK916
Damn, atleast stat involves a lot of theoretical math, not just applied.

Do people still think CS is Math.
Click to expand...

CS is considered a Mathematical Science. It has a base in math, but to think all we do is write equations is a bit off :p.
Click to expand...

Do you think writing equations is all mathematicians do? :confused:

Anyway, I've studied a lot of CS, so I wouldn't think that :p
 
D

DVK916

Banned
Dec 12, 2005
2,765
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Originally posted by: Mwilding
Statistics is simply the application of math to distort public perception.
Click to expand...


No it isn't.
Statistics pertaining to the collection, analysis, interpretation or explanation, and presentation of data.

It is both applied and theoretical.

 
Aikouka

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Originally posted by: jman19
Do you think writing equations is all mathematicians do? :confused:

Anyway, I've studied a lot of CS, so I wouldn't think that :p
Click to expand...

Yes, I am quite steadfast on that belief ;)! Actually, it's just more looking at the contemporary view of what Mathematics is... which is the majority of what people learn (up to say.. Algebra 2 or maybe Trigonometry if they're "lucky"). A great deal of what people learn in math is pretty much equations (save Geometry, where they're introduced the wonders of logic and theorems!)
 
GasX

GasX

Lifer
Feb 8, 2001
29,033
6
81
Originally posted by: DVK916
Originally posted by: Mwilding
Statistics is simply the application of math to distort public perception.
Click to expand...


No it isn't.
Statistics pertaining to the collection, analysis, interpretation or explanation, and presentation of data.

It is both applied and theoretical.
Click to expand...
7 out of 10 ATOTers think you don't know what the eff you are talking about.
 
M

Matthias99

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2003
8,808
0
0
Originally posted by: DVK916
Lots of people seem to lump stats in with math. I don't think you should. Even Mathematical Statistics isn't really math. You really can't call it applied math, since Statistical Theory/Mathematical Statistics isn't applied at all.

For example, this is NOT a math theorm, but a stat theorm.

let f(x1,x2,...x,n|theta) be a distribution, and

let theta-hat be an unbias estimator of theta, then

http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/4/8/6/4863a647daf34f1e0b8a05c316c03a05.png


This statement can be proven mathematicaly, but this isn't a math theorm, it is a stat theorm.

So again, stat isn't math.

The reasont he above theorm isn't a math theorm, is because it was discovered by a statistician, and is used only in Statisitics.
Click to expand...

Statistics is a kind of applied mathematics (not necessarily in the academic "Applied Mathematics" sense, but it is a way of applying mathematical principles to solve real-world problems.) Your "stats is not math" statement makes no sense. It's math in the same way that theoretical CS is math. Any "stat theorem" or "CS theorem" is also a "math theorem", because all the theory behind it is based on mathematics. Physics and Engineering equations are also based on mathematical models and relationships.

At many schools there is no separate "Statistics" major. If you want to study pure statistics (not as part of something like Econ) you would be an "Applied Mathematics" major at most US schools. There's no reason you couldn't have one, but it seems (to me, at least) to be more of an area of study within applied mathematics -- at least on the theory side.

As others pointed out, CS was frequently lumped in with Math/AM until the mid-60s, and much later at some schools. One of my older CS professors got something like the second specific "Computer Science" degree ever issued (from UPenn). But unless you're doing just theoretical CS, a true "computer science" program is more like an AM/EE double major with some programming classes.
 
D

DVK916

Banned
Dec 12, 2005
2,765
0
0
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Originally posted by: jman19
Do you think writing equations is all mathematicians do? :confused:

Anyway, I've studied a lot of CS, so I wouldn't think that :p
Click to expand...

Yes, I am quite steadfast on that belief ;)! Actually, it's just more looking at the contemporary view of what Mathematics is... which is the majority of what people learn (up to say.. Algebra 2 or maybe Trigonometry if they're "lucky"). A great deal of what people learn in math is pretty much equations (save Geometry, where they're introduced the wonders of logic and theorems!)
Click to expand...

I say you don't really get into the logic and theorms until Calculus, even Pre-Calc doesn't have a significant amount of proofs in it.
 
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